I don't really see how this story is a punishment. Most of the characters on this show have done something awful. Were Sarah Brown and Tamara Brawn being punished all those years Carly was screwing over Port Charles? Was Kirsten Storms when she stole drugs for Lucky, cheated with him, faked a pregnancy, Didn't tell LuLu and Dante their baby died and kept Spinelli from his own child? Olivia just let the entire town mourn Leo's death. Talk about a bitch move. I could go on and on about the terrible things Sonny, Dante, Sam, Luke, Lucky, Nik and Ava have done. Are all of those actors being punished?

 

 For a good long while Liz was being turned into Amy. Standing at the nurses station with nothing to do. That might have been punishment. Thank god someone decided to do something  with the character. I very much doubt Becky's fans are abandoning her in droves just because her character kept the identity of a hit man secret.  

 

Although, I don't consider myself a BH fan, I feel more sympathy for Liz right now than I have at any other time (short of the rape and Jake's death). She's screwing herself over good and hard right now, but she'll come out of it just fine in the long run just like all these other characters.

 

I do not consider myself a "Liz stan" by any means but did a few of you miss my point entirely?

 

My point was that they CHOOSE to write "bus bump" storylines for Liz, year after year. That is NOT the same as being written well and lovingly as a vixen or villain. She is not written as love-to-hate, she is written intentionally by the writers as "You should hate this bitch" over and over again and it saddens me that some people on this board continue to fall for it and can't see past what's on the extremely-biased page.

 

I also think it's very different when you write a lead character as an antihero, such as Carly or Ava, because fans still adore them because the writing says you are supposed to. The word "hero" is still in said term, aka leading a story in some form or another. They have strong motives, goals and POV and they usually have a large majority of the canvas in their corner. And if not a majority, then at least other lead characters or actors. What Olivia did deemed wrong (though I personally don't mind it) but just yesterday, Sonny agreed she did the right thing, when she previously pulled the same exact [!@#$%^&*] on him! Liz is not a lead character, she is a beautiful, vintage piece of stable concrete on the set that holds the other thots who have done far worse closer to the limelight.

 

Liz is always the roadkill in someone else's romantic triangle or plot point. See: Liz/Nik/Britt and Liz/Jason/Sam, or given romances that go nowhere and she is back at square one. See: AJ and Ric. When EVERYONE on canvas is given a random sibling out of nowhere or retconned into being someone's child, where is Liz's family? The only weak attempts they've made in the last 10 years consist of the Homophobic Orange Glowstick and the five-in-a-decade appearances by her gram Audrey Harding, as spelled oh-so-carefully by our latest dipshit show producer. For example, when Franco was going into the arts, would that not have been the perfect opportunity to utilize Liz's art background? The only time I recall them even mentioning it was when she sketched someone's face for the police. Or perhaps actually give her the opportunities that Sam and Patrick have been given to show they are good parents on screen, instead of the handful of times a year we see her three kids. We are told Liz is a good mother but if all we remember immediately is that they all have different fathers, are we sure she is without seeing it?

 

Just my two cents but thank you for taking the time to read! And thank you to those who see where I'm coming from. Can I get a "PREACH" from someone please?

 

I actually would like to see Liz get away with it.

AlexisFan- I didn't miss your point. I just disagree with it completely. I don't think Sam was written lovingly when she screwed her cancer stricken mother's husband. I don't think Ava was written lovingly when she was threatening to down martinis while pregnant. What a fun vixen! Was dead beat cheater Lucky written lovingly? Nope.He just dumped the traumatized child he calls his own on Liz's door and ran for the hills. Again. What a hero! 

 

  Liz has also had plenty of sympathetic writing over the years. Just like the rest of them have had their moments. She's had plenty of moments in this story showing how guilty she feels. She's just desperate and things have snowballed. I've never seen her as evil in this story. Anyway, whatever she's playing BH is getting paid, so I doubt she goes home and cries about being "punished". Please, some one come along and punish me with a job that pays hundreds of thousands of dollars. 

I actually would like to see Liz get away with it.

I actually wouldn't mind that either. I'm looking forward to the Carly/Liz showdown, but the rest of the confrontations are bound to be lame. Sam can't bring it, imo  However, GH isn't capable of playing the long game the way Y&R used to back in the day unfortunately.

 

The one way I'll admit they did Liz wrong was bringing Jake back too soon. He's the reason Jason will forgive Liz sooner than later, but the fact that she has that child back makes her desperation a little harder to understand. I honestly don't care that she's lying to Jason and Sam, but lying to Jake and Danny is harsh.

I think the point Alexisfan is trying to make is that Liz is always the loser. She has never come out on top and there's never been a push on TPTB's part to make her likable. We've constantly been pushed to like Carly, Ava, Sam, etc. It's not that they were always written sympathetically, it's that they were pushed as "heroes" or "flawed" and their actions always forgiven. Liz is always somebody's leftover, always a loser, always given the worst storylines or no storylines at all. She's not written as a vixen, which would be fine. She's just consistently given storyline after storyline that is meant to destroy her character. It just never works because Becky is great and has loyal fans. Hence her being brought back from being fired. She is eternally [!@#$%^&*] upon. 

I think the point Alexisfan is trying to make is that Liz is always the loser. She has never come out on top and there's never been a push on TPTB's part to make her likable. We've constantly been pushed to like Carly, Ava, Sam, etc. It's not that they were always written sympathetically, it's that they were pushed as "heroes" or "flawed" and their actions always forgiven. Liz is always somebody's leftover, always a loser, always given the worst storylines or no storylines at all. She's not written as a vixen, which would be fine. She's just consistently given storyline after storyline that is meant to destroy her character. It just never works because Becky is great and has loyal fans. Hence her being brought back from being fired. She is eternally [!@#$%^&*] upon. 

 

THANK YOU BOO

 

Juliajms, I do see some of your points as well and I think they are valid. A lot of the current "hero" characters have come from some nasty depths as well. I just don't think anyone else has been given the shaft by numerous and subsequent writing regimes as much as Becky Herbst has.

 

Sem-tangent here but the only way Becky Herbst can rank in the fist slot in the opening credits is by holding Billy Miller's dick. I will be forever pressed about that [!@#$%^&*]. You know once Jason Thompson leaves and they have to break up that quadrangle photo they'll shuffle her off to some "lesser" picture frame next to Genie Francis without a dick to share between them.

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by alexisfan07

I think the point Alexisfan is trying to make is that Liz is always the loser. She has never come out on top and there's never been a push on TPTB's part to make her likable. We've constantly been pushed to like Carly, Ava, Sam, etc. It's not that they were always written sympathetically, it's that they were pushed as "heroes" or "flawed" and their actions always forgiven. Liz is always somebody's leftover, always a loser, always given the worst storylines or no storylines at all. She's not written as a vixen, which would be fine. She's just consistently given storyline after storyline that is meant to destroy her character. It just never works because Becky is great and has loyal fans. Hence her being brought back from being fired. She is eternally [!@#$%^&*] upon. 

 

THANK YOU BOO

 

Juliajms, I do see some of your points as well and I think they are valid. A lot of the current "hero" characters have come from some nasty depths as well. I just don't think anyone else has been given the shaft by numerous and subsequent writing regimes as much as Becky Herbst has.

Of course, bae!

Yeah, I mean it's undeniable that certain characters (Carly, Sonny, Jason, Courtney, Sam, etc.) were/are constantly written to be heroes and loved. That's not to say those characters never did bad things or unlikable things that were hard to root for. But the difference is, with characters like that, it was ALWAYS clear that the audience was supposed to root for them or, at least, come around to rooting for them at some point (though maybe not so much Carly in the SB days). These characters are pushed to be the "leads" of the show, considered "flawed", their actions are always justified and made out to be okay, they never suffer consequences, and they always have a LONG line of sympathizers to balance out any backlash they may receive. Even Sam, as Julia mentioned, when she slept with Ric: Yes, that was unlikable. Yes, we rooted for Alexis instead. But Alexis quickly moved on from that and thus, so did the audience. Not to mention, Sam was ALWAYS a morally-tainted character.

With Liz, there's no consistency. Sometimes she's an ingenue. Sometimes she's a vixen. Sometimes she's mentally unstable. Sometimes she's jut a bitch. Sometimes she's a flawed good girl. Sometimes she's selfish. Sometimes she does everything for the people she loves. Regime after regime has dumped upon her, giving her story lines that would have absolutely destroyed a lesser character. Unlike your Carly's or Sam's who always came out on top, at least in terms of relationships and storyline, Liz has NEVER come out on top, arguably not since the 2002 Sarah/Lucky/Liz triangle. She is always in triangles where she's never the one chosen. She is always somebody's second choice, their leftover. And when she IS the only object of a male character's attention, the romance is always backburnered and quickly dismantled. I'm not saying other characters aren't given bad story lines, but the past few regimes have made it blatantly clear that they don't like Liz, that Liz will always be the fallback bad guy, that they will continue to trash her character and make her unlikable as possible, that they will diminish the love story between her and Lucky at any cost, etc. They have all but driven her off the show (which they TRIED to do, but didn't work). The thing is, much like Sharon Case, Becky always gives 100%, she is a great actress, and she has very loyal fans. Therefore, Liz always remains a popular character and TPTB are once again left with a character they have repeatedly and unsuccessfully tried to destroy. And if she isn't being given a storyline that means to destroy everything about her character, she's given nothing to do at all.

 

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by Mr. Vixen

Of course, bae!

Yeah, I mean it's undeniable that certain characters (Carly, Sonny, Jason, Courtney, Sam, etc.) were/are constantly written to be heroes and loved. That's not to say those characters never did bad things or unlikable things that were hard to root for. But the difference is, with characters like that, it was ALWAYS clear that the audience was supposed to root for them or, at least, come around to rooting for them at some point (though maybe not so much Carly in the SB days). These characters are pushed to be the "leads" of the show, considered "flawed", their actions are always justified and made out to be okay, they never suffer consequences, and they always have a LONG line of sympathizers to balance out any backlash they may receive. Even Sam, as Julia mentioned, when she slept with Ric: Yes, that was unlikable. Yes, we rooted for Alexis instead. But Alexis quickly moved on from that and thus, so did the audience. Not to mention, Sam was ALWAYS a morally-tainted character.

With Liz, there's no consistency. Sometimes she's an ingenue. Sometimes she's a vixen. Sometimes she's mentally unstable. Sometimes she's jut a bitch. Sometimes she's a flawed good girl. Sometimes she's selfish. Sometimes she does everything for the people she loves. Regime after regime has dumped upon her, giving her story lines that would have absolutely destroyed a lesser character. Unlike your Carly's or Sam's who always came out on top, at least in terms of relationships and storyline, Liz has NEVER come out on top, arguably not since the 2002 Sarah/Lucky/Liz triangle. She is always in triangles where she's never the one chosen. She is always somebody's second choice, their leftover. And when she IS the only object of a male character's attention, the romance is always backburnered and quickly dismantled. I'm not saying other characters aren't given bad story lines, but the past few regimes have made it blatantly clear that they don't like Liz, that Liz will always be the fallback bad guy, that they will continue to trash her character and make her unlikable as possible, that they will diminish the love story between her and Lucky at any cost, etc. They have all but driven her off the show (which they TRIED to do, but didn't work). The thing is, much like Sharon Case, Becky always gives 100%, she is a great actress, and she has very loyal fans. Therefore, Liz always remains a popular character and TPTB are once again left with a character they have repeatedly and unsuccessfully tried to destroy. And if she isn't being given a storyline that means to destroy everything about her character, she's given nothing to do at all.

 

 

Yassssss boo. EXACTLY. Our combined posts should cover it all!

 

I feel like I read a few comments by JP and SA about Liz and they seemed to defend her recent actions a bit so maybe they can take the character in a different direction. I would love a good mental illness storyline for Liz to dive into what is behind her Jason obsession and be a winner by coming out the other side mentally free of him. I am probably being overly optimistic and we will probably just get Liz/Nik/Hayden but whatever, I love all three actors so I'm easy to please.

 

I will say, I think the show sees Liz and Lucky as endgame, despite how trashed they are. So until the show is cancelled or Jonathan Jackson has amnesia himself and thinks he needs to come back to this dreck, Liz will continue to dick hop. In theory though, they could build her a nice, popular short-term pairing in the meantime, like Sam and Patrick. I did like 2014 Liz and Ric, maybe that little scene with them bumping into each other at the hospital was a prelude to revisiting them now that they've both done horrible things and will (presumably) be trying to better themselves in the near future. (We'll just pretend the Ric/Nina [!@#$%^&*] ever existed, okay?)

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by alexisfan07

Funny, I actually completely forgot about the Ric and Nina stuff until you mentioned it. 

My mom and I were discussing Nina and Franco the other day and she summed it up perfectly: they really operate on the periphery of the show. They don't interact with or have connections with anyone (other than Kiki), so why keep them around? If we are going to be subjected to them, the least they could do is connect them somehow to an important character. 

I say ditch Franco but my idea for Nina has always been simple: Give her a brain tumor, but when she wakes up, have her be the crazy, scheming vixen she was originally meant to be. Don't whitewash her actions, just explain the instability behind them. It would be nice to see a tumor storyline that didn't make someone a Mary Sue. And then make her the long lost daughter of Monica and Jeff and that would at least give her something to do and connect her to a core family, while also giving Liz a family member. If they're going to insist on keeping her around, let's at least give her a reset and give the character some traction. 

Funny, I actually completely forgot about the Ric and Nina stuff until you mentioned it. 

My mom and I were discussing Nina and Franco the other day and she summed it up perfectly: they really operate on the periphery of the show. They don't interact with or have connections with anyone (other than Kiki), so why keep them around? If we are going to be subjected to them, the least they could do is connect them somehow to an important character. 

I say ditch Franco but my idea for Nina has always been simple: Give her a brain tumor, but when she wakes up, have her be the crazy, scheming vixen she was originally meant to be. Don't whitewash her actions, just explain the instability behind them. It would be nice to see a tumor storyline that didn't make someone a Mary Sue. And then make her the long lost daughter of Monica and Jeff and that would at least give her something to do and connect her to a core family, while also giving Liz a family member. If they're going to insist on keeping her around, let's at least give her a reset and give the character some traction. 

 

HA! Love it. Frankly, I think the show would rather forget it happened too. Poor Donna Mills being subjected to that [!@#$%^&*], my God.

 

I don't get Nina and Franco either, they are SO isolated. The issue is Franco and the history he has with 95% of the canvas. It says something when they're reaching for Franco to get some connections by having him interact with Maxie, though despite the crassness of it, at least Franco and Maxie have a bit of a past and it's not quite as horrible as what he's done to the rest of the town. And Nathan being Nina's sister is a nice easy way into that quad. But they need more than that and I don't see how it's possible with the current canvas. I don't mind the quirky Franco, Nina and Kiki family either. It would be a nice nod to adopted families if neither Franco or Nina turn out to be Kiki's parent but I'm sure one of them will be. My money's on Nina being Kiki's mom right now.

 

I actually like Nina for the over-the-top caricature that she is. The fish-out-of-water in the 21st century can be quite entertaining - Stafford just needs to tone it down 100 notches sometimes. I love Roger Howarth and if they can somehow recast him as a third, more veteran (even doctror) character, I say go for it because Franco just doesn't work as a permanent character on the canvas. That, or just cut him altogether and pair Nina up with someone else.

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by alexisfan07

I think the point Alexisfan is trying to make is that Liz is always the loser. She has never come out on top and there's never been a push on TPTB's part to make her likable. We've constantly been pushed to like Carly, Ava, Sam, etc. It's not that they were always written sympathetically, it's that they were pushed as "heroes" or "flawed" and their actions always forgiven. Liz is always somebody's leftover, always a loser, always given the worst storylines or no storylines at all. She's not written as a vixen, which would be fine. She's just consistently given storyline after storyline that is meant to destroy her character. It just never works because Becky is great and has loyal fans. Hence her being brought back from being fired. She is eternally [!@#$%^&*] upon. 

Liz's actions are never forgiven? She is always forgiven. For all the crap she's done, she's never been the town pariah thats been cast out and hated by most. The closest was when she cheated on Lucky with Nikolas and even then the only two people she lost were Lulu and Lucky (the former of which has since forgiven her). Outside of that, she's always been beloved and held on a pedestal by pretty much everyone except whichever woman's man she's come for at the time. Seriously she has had tons of friends and support and they never turn their backs on her

 

 

 Unlike your Carly's or Sam's who always came out on top, at least in terms of relationships and storyline, Liz has NEVER come out on top, arguably not since the 2002 Sarah/Lucky/Liz triangle. She is always in triangles where she's never the one chosen. She is always somebody's second choice, their leftover.

 

thats not entirely true. In the original Sam/Jason/Liz/Lucky quad, Jason left Sam and chose Liz! Liz was made out to be the winner in that plot. Julia mentioned that both Sam and Lucky were both demonized and anyone who watched that knew that Jason and Liz got preferential treatment and were the couple to root for. Liz won out there

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by Cheap21

I think the point Alexisfan is trying to make is that Liz is always the loser. She has never come out on top and there's never been a push on TPTB's part to make her likable. We've constantly been pushed to like Carly, Ava, Sam, etc. It's not that they were always written sympathetically, it's that they were pushed as "heroes" or "flawed" and their actions always forgiven. Liz is always somebody's leftover, always a loser, always given the worst storylines or no storylines at all. She's not written as a vixen, which would be fine. She's just consistently given storyline after storyline that is meant to destroy her character. It just never works because Becky is great and has loyal fans. Hence her being brought back from being fired. She is eternally [!@#$%^&*] upon. 

Again, I understand the point. I just don't agree with it. I agree that Sonny and Carly have been pushed to be the heroes of the show, although in the case of Sonny that has never worked on me. If being Sonny's mob moll is what makes a character the winner, please, let my favorite be the loser again. 

 

 For a long time Carly was the one driving drama, but that day is at it's sad end.  In fact, Liz is the one doing that right now.  I agree that the regime that tried to fire Liz didn't like her (obviously). I don't think that that the story she is getting right now is a punishment or that she has always been the loser.

 

She has family on the show. Three children. So what if they have different fathers? She had a brother for awhile, but the character never stuck. She has had a ton of romances over the years and a fairy tale wedding to Lucky. What some of you seem to think of as Liz being the loser are the only things that make the character interesting to me. She may not be some rich guy's wife )although she has been married many times), but she has her own career. If anything this show needs more middle class or even poor people. I don't agree that being poor or middle class makes a character a loser (which I've seen people say on other boards).

 

What can I say? If people want to believe this story is the worst thing to ever happen to Liz, even though it's obvious that Jason is going to forgive her, I can't stop you. However,  it's clear to me that if she were really hated at this point she wouldn't be in the middle of the show's biggest story right now. Someone had to be the bad guy, I only wish it were Carly, which really would have brought the drama. 

 

As to who will stand by Liz, I believe Laura will. She's warned Liz against doing this, but I believe she will stand by her, along with Nik. 

 

 

Edited November 4, 201510 yr by Juliajms

A National Enquirer spoiler (I know, but the spoilers are usually legit) has Liz confronting Sam on the 16th.

 

What is wrong with that sentence?!