Backstage: Can the Internet Really Save Soap Operas?

[cassadine1991]

http://www.backstage.com/news/can-the-internet-really-save-soap-operas/

[John]

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  Fritz Brekeller commented on Backstage.com.

  Working for Prospect Park, on both AMC & OLTL, I admit that there have been some bumps in the road with both reboots. However, I strongly disagree about the hiring of Ginger Smith as EP on AMC. Having worked on numerous network soaps with various EPs, I can honestly say she is one of the smartest and the best. No one could possibly bring more passion to what they do than she does - and no one knows the people of Pine Valley better, except possibly Agnes Nixon. Despite the learning curves of remounting these shows, I think both AMC & OLTL exceeded expectations - but as they say, it's only my opinion.

[John]

These seasons although bumpy were entertaining & these soaps have lots of life left in them. I will continue to support PP, AMC & OLTL. So excited for Season 2 of both soaps, but take your time and bring us fans the best shows possible.

[Vee]

I'm not sure why this has its own thread, but okay.

I'm amazed Roger Newcomb would diss Ginger Smith like that, since she put on the best AMC I've seen in at least 11 or 12 years if not longer.

And again with these people trying to talk up "the indie soaps" in lieu of, say, Ginger Smith - even Roger Newcomb, who I respect. I would say I don't understand why so many of the online soap press keep boosting those shows, but I know why - it's because those little productions make them feel like they're part of an industry, they include them far more than the networks, they make them feel special. And I know a lot of those shows' hearts in the right place. Unfortunately, nine out of ten of those shows are absolute [!@#$%^&*] - either their production is godawful, or their scripts and characters are utterly terrible, and more often than not you have both at the same time. If it's not Peapack II, it's Let's Cosplay Dynasty. Yet I keep hearing about how I need to watch The Bay or Venice. Who cares? These things are not the future and they're never gonna be, because they're just not good.

[EastMA2]

Roger Newcomb lost any credibility he had years ago when he declared Nuke a Supercouple before Jake Silbemann had even aired on ATWT. Nothing he says is of interest to me. I think AMC and OLTL had higher online viewership than any of the other online series.

[Juliajms]

I think that the internet can save soaps in the sense that someday relatively soon we will have paid access to all the old episodes of classic soaps that are still in existence. I don't really believe it will save the day time drama in the format for which many of us are nostalgic. I wish to god it could. I would pay good money (subscription fee) if it could, but I can't claim to be a true believer that it will.

[chicklitsandfantasies]

I would never pay a subscription for an online soap and I really don't get the hype over web soaps like The Bay or Venice . Both were boring in the episodes I watched and were more about throwing on "names" than good storytelling. That being said I don't think AMC and OLTL 2.0 translated well online.

[TeamEric]

Looking ahead, Newcomb said Prospect Park needs to revamp the soaps’ format. “I don’t think they’re going to get a lot of new viewers if they keep the traditional format—conversational scenes broken up into multiple parts,” he said.

IMO, the net is the future home of soaps. But PP miscalculated by trying to just recreate AMC and OLTL online versus boldly revamp them into a new modern format. Both EPs just really tried to reproduce ABC's version of AMC and OLTL instead of building a hybrid which is IMO really needed.

[RogerNewcomb]

Vee, I never mentioned Ginger Smith. The writer threw her name in the middle of my quote as if I had named her. I noticed that right away when I saw it and felt bad. I actually enjoyed AMC much more than OLTL in their first seasons so if I was going to diss someone personally (which I wouldn't do in this case), it certainly wouldn't be her because I think she did one of the better jobs of anyone in this process.

My main point was I felt the whole thing was rushed once PP picked it back up and there was more focus on logistical stuff (finding a studio, building sets, hiring people, etc) than actually having the perfect story that they were happy with and going from there. I strongly believe adding some indie talent to the mix would help. Not the indie talent that used to work in daytime but the truly undiscovered artists who have taken their original ideas and made masterpieces for pretty much no money. They are the ones who started with a story and figured out how to tell that story in a new medium. I tied my thoughts all together with a hopeful ending saying PP has a chance to make really great shows for Season 2 if they learned the lessons they needed to learn through all this (what story do you want to tell? how often do you release episodes? what is the best way to promote & spread the word? etc). The narrative of the article turned out to be more about why this couldn't work versus why it could, which is the angle I try to go for. Anyway, just wanted to clear up the Ginger Smith comment. I think the writer wanted to insert a name (any name) into that slot. I'm not sure how he picked her name but have a feeling it just a random luck of the draw from somewhere.

[SOAPSFOREVER]

I agree with most of this post, though I don't agree about Ginger Smith. I think her AMC was flat and uninspired, even when the writing was spot-on, which it was much of AMC-2.0's run (I'll never understand PP's decision to ax MMcP and ES. I think they did a herculean job with the relaunch). That said, Vee's on the mark about the "indie soaps." They really haven't caught on, as much as Roger Newcomb and his website want us to believe they have, and get excited about. The stories are weak, the production cringe-worthy, the acting not much better. The episode scheduling is erratic, too. Most of them are a mess. Newcomb and the rest of the soap press need to own up to that.

[RogerNewcomb]

There are a lot of great online series, some that and indie are others (more and more) that are big budget studio productions. Uniliver (P&G's big rival) has their own soap channel, WIGS, but those shows aren't my favorite. One that is, an indie show called Out With Dad, has had millions of viewers, has gotten better every season and is from all undiscovered talent in Toronto. The fist episode was watched by over four million people on YouTube alone. My favorite web series tend to be the ones from these unknown writers and producers. The ones daytime soap fans tend to know about most are Venice, The Bay, etc that mostly are written, produced and star people from the daytime world.

[Vee]

Roger, I'm only going by what the article said. The way it's worded, it attributes the critique of Smith to you. If you didn't say that, I'm pleased and I apologize for the misunderstanding.

I've always found you to be pretty positive, and while I agree the PP soaps faced a logistical mess, I think anyone would have in their situation and timeframe. Whether they were or are up to the challenge long-term is another story, but I thought for what they had to deal with, their shows looked and felt like a million bucks, compared to what those two shows had been on ABC. They looked lush and dealt in character - even OLTL, which moved like molasses for most of its first season in lieu of plot.

I'm sure there is independent talent to be harvested, but I also thought the largely new blood brought in for AMC and OLTL was needed and worked. Moreover, though, I don't know which shows you mean, but I'd genuinely like to know. When I think indie soaps, I think The Bay, Venice, DeVanity, etc. and I just don't give a [!@#$%^&*] about any of those. I think they're not ready for primetime. But that's JMO.

[EricMontreal22]

I'm glad to hear that it was a poorly worded quote re Ginger Smith--because I do think she was one of the people who seemed to manage to make the joining of the online and established soap worlds work as best as time was able to give them.

Re online shows--I'm with Vee about how disappointing I find the ones that have been expressly done as soap operas, such as Venice. I've given them several shots, but... ANd I think one problem with suggesting that these TOLN soaps could have used some of the production talent from that is simply logistics--NONE of those shows tried to crankout as much material in as short a time as TOLN did. And of course, this ultimately was a problem, but... I have liked web series and serials before--I largely loved The Outs, etc. But these aren't shows that are trying to be "web soaps" per se (and they also seem to be lucky to get 20 minutes out per month.) (Out With Dad is good too, although it can feel preachy to me in parts.)

[allmc2008]

I look at these indipendant soaps the way I look at the early radio soaps like Painted Dreams compared to the later radio ones like Helen Trent. When the genre first started in 1930 the theory looked good on paper but not in practice but once Helen Trent came in they hit there stride.

I feel that shows like DeVanity are like Painted Dreams meaning the theory is OK but not in practice whereas the PP soaps are the "neo-Helen Trents" (with a few extra flaws they need to work out).

Also, when soaps first started didn't they have odd and random production models?? I remember reading about soaps that aired 6 days a week and some that aired M/W/F. If so this Era we are currently in really is mirroring the genesis of daily serials meaning this Era probably is a rebirth.

[DramatistDreamer]

The one aspect of the article that I would give credence to is, I think PP may have to let go of the idea of being 'all things to all people' .

People who watch a lot of serial drama (even comedy) online expect the content (if not the language) to be a bit edgier than what the traditional daytime drama audience may be used to. And unless one is willing to 'train' an audience to watch and enjoy watching online, I don't think the time-frame that PP had to launch these shows and make them successful would allow for that type of training.

Add in the other logistical and creative problems (some of which were of PP's own making) and you have somewhat of a Heculean task.

It just seems to me, PP should probably decide whether they are going to be a web based show or a network/broadcast based show. I'm no expert but the models (financially & creatively) appear to be somewhat different between the two media.

I know some make fun of the small apartments that some characters have on the PP shows but the look to me, is comparable to their broadcast/network counterparts. Whereas many of the indie shows have a certain lower production 'look', I can't explain it specifically but except for comedies like ABG, I often lose interest in many of the indie shows mid-way through.

A lot of daytime drama fans appear married to the idea of these shows being on broadcast/network TV. To change most soap fan's minds would be a true challenge, mainly with the older viewers/fans.

It's interesting because I was reading on other blogs how Martha Byrne is going to be in an upcoming show on CBS but I wonder what happened with Gotham? I remember being a bit confused as to why she wanted to veer away from producing episodes online and trying to go on broadcast TV. As a result, it doesn't look like she found a producing partner and the project may have stalled.