Backstage: Can the Internet Really Save Soap Operas?

[TeamEric]

You make several good points about PP's indecisiveness.

PP originally hyped their reboots as edgier and more like a prime-time network soap. Instead, they stuck to the dated, narrow ABCD formula. They cravenly caved to the vocal minority over cursing, which proved to many they were not committed to forging a bold new path.

OLTL badly needed a brave, ruthless visionary like Linda Gottlieb at the helm who would have told those complainers it's 2013 not the 1950s and about time our soaps reflect real world dialogue. JP clearly loves OLTL but she often reminded me of Frons' pimping his star pets over story. When Gottlieb took over OLTL, it felt completely FRESH. PP's OLTL didn't, that's the bottom line to me.

[EricMontreal22]

To be fair to Ginger Smith... I get the impression that the EPs at these online soap have a lot more creative vision and influence than the shows have had on ABC for a long time (something that I think soaps at their best usually had.) So I think she deserves some credit for the writing--or at least, like it or notm in terms of what characters came back, the jump in time was her idea, she apparently worked as a liaison with Agnes Nixon (who wrote that Joe/Billy Clyde scene herself) etc.

Agreed re online soaps.

[EricMontreal22]

I somewhat agree with this (and really agree with much of what DD said.) However, I still think AMC/OLTL in the end were edgier than network soaps (at least AMC and OLTL on network tv) had been in a long time. But this was in more traditional ways--ie the way they handled Cass' abortion, something that has virtually not been allowed on increasingly scared and conservative network soaps since the 2000s began.

I do think PP should have stuck to their guns. I seriously doubt the people who bothered to complain online about the swearing--took all the time to do that--would have tuned out if the swearing had continued (although maybe slightly more controlled.) Bowing to the pressure served no one and I seriously doubt ANYONE continued to watch (or started watching) because they started cutting that element out. Ginger Smith really does seem to, IMHO, get how to update MC *enough* and still remain true to its often forgotten roots. It's not an edgy soap, but it is braver than it has been and increasingly was showing to be in the right direction.

OLTL was more confused. I think Pepperman's ideas for the most part were spot on--and she seemed to realize what was wrong with her writing team judging fromher interviews. But I think she has less experience with the show, or maybe listens too much to fan pressure, and I'm not as confident in her. I enjoyed OLTL, every episode, despite its issues (and one reason was due to all the character based scenes--even if they led nowhere as they usually did, which I think was something JP pushed for) but I still agree with much of whatyou say about it.

[allmc2008]

I always thought OLTL was the Edgy counterpart to AMC back in the 70's. AMC had the groundbreaking issues but OLTL seemed to be more head-one with certain things than AMC.

Also, didn't OLTL have more of a "Center City/Bad Neigborhood" element during that time?? It seems as if they had more "Rough [for lack of better word]" characters like Karen and Marco.

[DramatistDreamer]

I'm confounded as to why the article picks on Ginger Smith (lol). I thought she did a pretty decent job with AMC. And that's not just in comparison to online/web soaps, I look at Y&R and I was more impressed with what AMC tried to achieve, and did accomplish than most of what Y&R did.

Whew, I'm glad to finally admit that one. And this is from a person who was raised on CBS soaps.

[TeamEric]

I can't really judge GS' vision as I only watched a few episodes of AMC. But, IMO, GH proved a great deal braver with Lulu's abortion than PP did with Cass. An abortion due to rape is far more "acceptable" to conservative audiences than Lulu's youthful mistake.

Neither AMC nor OLTL pushed the envelope as far as LGBT issues as another posters keenly noted.

I think caving to the no cursing crowd signaled PP wasn't committed to modernizing these soaps. OLTL's 20somethings were praised early on sounding so much more natural and realistic than any on ABCD. They lost that element.

As for JP, I should have made clearer the comparison to Frons was valuing pet stars over story. She was always touting hey watch this or that star individual performance. For example, Dani's drug addiction. She heaped praise on KM who seemed a favorite of hers but on screen it was resolved quickly and glossed over. That was but one example of dropped potential. She heaped praise on KDP and RH's hotness together but their characters didn't resolve any of their issues. The same was true of her hyping Tuc with that ridiculous reality series vs delving into David & Dorian's very real problems. Characters may have been talking with each other but it was all surface stuff very much a Frons type approach IMO.

[Vee]

I watched both of those abortion storylines. IIRC, GH's made Lulu out to be some sort of scarlet woman. AMC got it right.

I don't think you needed the overt profanity to modernize the dialogue - it still sounded good, and real, without it. AFAIK, though, the real reason they bleeped the shows was because they got the cable run on OWN and were looking out for another syndication deal. Bowing to the fans was, I believe, just lip service. I still would've run the shows 'dirty' on Hulu, but that's me. Nor do I think all the dialogue was surface at all.

And as for Dani, she wasn't addicted to drugs. She was using drugs - there is a difference. On most soap operas, someone uses Ecstacy once or twice and they're a raging addict. Dani was a casual user who did it from time to time to numb herself to her life, and was tempted by it in the future. But she wasn't an addict. That's not something I condone but it is real life, and the nuance is something daytime did not understand. Until the PP soaps.

[TeamEric]

Actually, I remember being pleasantly surprised how even handed Guza was with both sides of the abortion debate. On one hand you had Dillon making the case it was wrong to kill any "unborn baby" and refusing to accept it was Lulu's sole right to choose. Then on the other hand, you had an older male, the actual STAR of GH, father Luke defending a woman's right to choose for herself. You had Tracy recalling her own abortion and choice. Luke and Lulu's dialogue in the car scenes outside the clinic was particularly poignant... whatever Lulu CHOSE he would back her and that was the very right message the writers hammered home. I also liked Guza didn't treat it like the decision didn't pain Lulu. He addressed head on some guilt and shame but also brought her to a place she felt it was very right choice FOR HER. It was a surprisingly BRAVE choice for very conservative ABCD and I remember feeling proud and amazed by GH "going there" versus taking the rape baby abortion easier route. It wasn't quite Erica Kane's abortion but the closest I've seen told on ABCD since Lulu is the famous L&L's daughter.

Did anyone on AMC object to Cassandra's abortion? I'll say it again, Nixon took the safer path by going the rape baby abortion route. There's a far greater majority who support abortion in case of rape or incest and feel that's when a woman can choose. Also, the whole sex slave torture set up so much sympathy for Cassandra's plight versus tackling abortion more bravely as a life choice like Lulu was written.

I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of the cable rules but I know PP had the FX cable deal when they launched. PP was originally writing for that type audience and not OWN which came later.

With very few exceptions, I felt OLTL 2.0 scenes glossed over issues versus DARED to really "go there." I cheered Clint laying into Matthew's irresponsibility but the most surprising and welcome scene came between Snoop and Matthew. It wasn't a moralizing lecture like Clint had delivered or B&N skated around, it was a straight up acknowledgement of a real problem too many unwed black girls are forced to raise their kids alone because the boy dads don't step... and some of those boys grow into men who learn too late to regret their irresponsibility. It hit home because it was so topical and delivered with a sad wisdom by someone in that community. It felt very REAL. Shockingly Snoop was very, very good in that scene and RG was great playing a felled Matt.

I disagree on Dani. She wasn't some casual user who was sometimes numbing herself. The first week Matthew explained he took her drugs away because she was growing addicted to them and unable to function without them. After her overdose, he showed real concern she simply switched to medicating herself with alcohol instead. Dani was often drunk that first month clearly unable to face life head on without some form of drug. Then poof suddenly she was sober all the time without any real transition and the need for therapy angle became another dropped plot point.

They glossed right past T&B's huge trust issues to deliver another round of simpering idiot Blair who can't resist a hot Todd. They resolved nothing and PP proved too chicken to really tackle Blair's utter lack of self-respect. The topical CIA black sites story was dropped completely in favor of shallow Dorian schemes and pining like a silly old fool for David. And right there is another missed opportunity in glossing over too much the real ageism of David feeling younger hotter Rama would sell his series better.

I could go on and on but almost every time PP had the opportunity to be topical or socially relevant, they skipped it. Like I said, they badly needed a Linda Gottlieb type who would have insisted club scenes didn't equal modern storytelling.

[Vee]

Dani said in the first week of shows, point blank to Todd and IIRC Téa - she's not an addict, she just uses a bit too much. Matthew never said she was an addict, but he did say he was worried. It's a fine line, and the show was walking it for story reasons.

Dani does self-medicate with liquor and drugs and she has certainly shown addictive tendencies, but as of now they have yet to take that leap. That was something that was developing - we saw her drink too much, we saw people talk to her about it. But she was back and forth over that line for the whole season - avoiding bad situations at Shelter some nights, drinking at home on others - and then she became involved with Bandini, which was another kind of dependency other than chemical or alcohol. I don't think Dani's story was anywhere near over, and I don't think they whitewashed what was going on with her either. I think it was ongoing. I don't think it disappeared in any way. I find what's happening to her far more interesting than the same old "drugs are bad, go to rehab, done." Should the show go on, there's always time for Dani to go to rehab. She's still in the midst of high drama.

Angie did somewhat object to Cassandra's abortion - at least, she objected to it on the basis of how she once found Cassandra in New York, and because she was still suffering from the loss of Lucy. She was nebulous about it and sad but she supported her daughter's choice. Contrast that to GH having teenage Lulu constantly harp on her terrible deed of aborting her sinful child for months and years - no thanks.

As for Dorian and the CIA sites, that was clearly not over - she took the fall for stumbling on too much. They just took way too long to even begin to get back to it, which is what was happening with Carl Peterson at the end and the final segue into more of the Triskelion story. If you think those guys are not connected to those black sites I've got a bridge to sell you. It all fits together, it's just a matter of whether they ever get to show us how and why.

[EricMontreal22]

Ye, Angie of all people had a pretty strong objection, IMHO, to the abortion--albeit she understood she had to back up her daughter no matter what--which is a very realistic portrayal and very true to character, IMHO.