Taylor's donation was nice, but Demi Lovato has a serious point. Taylor, and other celebs, love to shout about feminism and women's rights but rarely SAY anything to back it up, nor do they participate in any of the uncomfortable conversations. Taylor is the epitome of this. She loves to scream out "girl power" with this "squad" of hers (which is really just a clique of mean girls, originally designed for a music video that was a DIRECT ATTACK at ANOTHER WOMAN -- tell me how that's female empowerment again?), yet she has never had a serious conversation of substance about feminism (or anything else, really). 

 

I don't deny that she is a kind and generous person at heart -- She obviously is. However, she's also, clearly, incredibly insecure and passive aggressive and willing to pander to whatever cause will inflate her image as "queen nice girl". She's kind, but she's disingenuous in many ways, as well.

Demi wants to storm capital hill over a rape allegation. Taylor donated money she didn't have to so that Kesha could continue to fight. Demi has no point and she could have shown women empowerment by supporting what Taylor did and piggy backing it with something else positive!  Taylor wins and Demi can STFU!  

Yes, but Taylor's donation came after days of radio silence on her part. She got a lot of flack online for not saying anything in support of Kesha when most other celebs were. And that's fair. If you're going to shout non-stop about being a feminist - be one. The donation is wonderful and, kind, but she still hasn't spoken out in support and instead just threw money at a situation. 

Taylor's donation was nice, but Demi Lovato has a serious point.

Demi needs to take a seat.  Like who is to tell people what they should or not do.  Is she the feminist police?  And why should people do things to impress her?  You're not the judge of everyone.   If you want to show support, just do it your way.  If all you can do is tweet, that's fine.  Nobody's pressuring you to do more.   If you want to do more, go ahead, *do something*. 

Taylor's donation was nice, but Demi Lovato has a serious point.

Demi needs to take a seat.  Like who is to tell people what they should or not do.  Is she the feminist police?  And why should people do things to impress her?  You're not the judge of everyone.   If you want to show support, just do it your way.  If all you can do is tweet, that's fine.  Nobody's pressuring you to do more.   If you want to do more, go ahead, *do something*. 

And I totally agree. But Taylor has made an entire career out of shouting about what a feminist she is, thanks to her clique, yet when it comes to real issues, she never has anything to say. People have been calling her out on that for ages, Demi is just the first famous person to say it. 

Yes, but Taylor's donation came after days of radio silence on her part. She got a lot of flack online for not saying anything in support of Kesha when most other celebs were. And that's fair. If you're going to shout non-stop about being a feminist - be one. The donation is wonderful and, kind, but she still hasn't spoken out in support and instead just threw money at a situation. 

Taylor was the maid of honor at a wedding this weekend.  So what if she didn't tweet when everyone else did. I bet a lot of those people don't even know what's really going on.  I honestly wish Taylor wouldn't just stayed quiet on this situation because it's an on going legal case.  Instead she was dragged into something that had nothing to do with her.  This was so unnecessary by Demi. 

Yes, but Taylor's donation came after days of radio silence on her part. She got a lot of flack online for not saying anything in support of Kesha when most other celebs were. And that's fair. If you're going to shout non-stop about being a feminist - be one. The donation is wonderful and, kind, but she still hasn't spoken out in support and instead just threw money at a situation. 

Taylor was the maid of honor at a wedding this weekend.  So what if she didn't tweet when everyone else did. I bet a lot of those people don't even know what's really going on.  I honestly wish Taylor wouldn't just stayed quiet on this situation because it's an on going legal case.  Instead she was dragged into something that had nothing to do with her.  This was so unnecessary by Demi. 

I understand your point, but it's about more issues than just this one. Nonetheless, Taylor's donation was very kind and I'm sure Kesha very much appreciates it. I wasn't discrediting Taylor's contribution entirely, just saying that, yet again, she seems to be late to a party that she claims to be the queen of.

Demi is a nobody, she shouldn't insert herself into a situation concerning much more successful pop stars. 

And I totally agree. But Taylor has made an entire career out of shouting about what a feminist she is, thanks to her clique, yet when it comes to real issues, she never has anything to say. People have been calling her out on that for ages, Demi is just the first famous person to say it. 

Who cares! There's not one definition on how one should be a feminist.  Let Taylor do it her way.  Let Demi do it her way.  Let people do it their own way.  Your way might not be the same as other people. 

Edited February 22, 20169 yr by Toups

Not that I'm the biggest Demi fan in the world, but I would argue she's definitely a very successful pop star. I mean she's got over 30 million twitter followers, and had two huge hits over the summer.

And I totally agree. But Taylor has made an entire career out of shouting about what a feminist she is, thanks to her clique, yet when it comes to real issues, she never has anything to say. People have been calling her out on that for ages, Demi is just the first famous person to say it. 

Who cares! There's not one definition on how one should be a feminist.  Let Taylor do it her way.  Let Demi do it her way.  Let people do it their own way.  Youre way might not be the same as other people. 

Probably the last I'm gonna say about it - I agree, wholeheartedly, with your point. The only point I, and many others, have made, is that when you claim to be the ringleader of a cause, it comes across suspicious when you're constantly attacking females in the press and when you have to be badgered into speaking up for other women. And when you put yourself on a platform like the one Taylor is on, people are going to discuss her antics. 

I guess Taylor and will never work with Dr. Luke (not that I mind)...

 

I think Taylor can use her next project to take some risks (maybe hanging around Calvin Harris will have an influence on her). She's reached a level where she can afford to experiment without alienating her core fanbase. Sort of like what Madonna used to do during her peak years - bring elements of the underground into the mainstream because you have the platform to do it.

"influence on her" - by going to the EDM/dance route? Working with the likes of Calvin, Diplo, Skillex, Zedd, David Guetta, etc?   I don't think Taylor needs to do that when so many pop artists are already doing that.  I think the next move, after releasing another pop album, is going the pop-rock route and be more instrument based, since she can play the acoustic and electric guitar.  Not a lot of pop stars are playing their own instruments right now.   So in terms of people she's hanging around who might have some influence on her, I'm hoping she'll lean towards Haim than Calvin. 

The EDM/dance route is very diverse and always changing. She could pluck an up and coming underground DJ/producer and bring something to the mainstream that isn't quite as popular yet.

 

But other than a few songs and some remixes, I agree the EDM/dance route isn't quite right for her. I think for the next project, she can afford to take more risks and stretch herself outside of her comfort zone a bit. She shouldn't be looking to do 1989 2.0. 

when you claim to be the ringleader of a cause,

Can you find me a quote?  I honestly don't remember reading/hearing that from her. 

 

when you're constantly attacking females in the press

The Rolling Stone interview where she talked about Bad Blood?  What other instances? 

Isn't Demi also close friends with Selena Gomez? I wonder how Selena feels being in the middle. 

Vix, why is Taylor obligated to say or do anything, especially over a he said she said matter? No one has to get involved, but Taylor did and wrote a check. Tweets from other celebs are WORTHLESS. If you ask me, she made the smartest move because there's NOTHING to support Kesha's story. Taylor, can I get a loan?

when you claim to be the ringleader of a cause,

Can you find me a quote?  I honestly don't remember reading/hearing that from her. 

 

 

when you're constantly attacking females in the press

 

The Rolling Stone interview where she talked about Bad Blood?  What other instances? 

Let me rephrase "claim to be". When you constantly talk about how into an issue you are, assemble a mean girl clique and pass it off as girl power, launch attacks at other artists in the name of feminism, etc., and you're someone as high profile as she is, people are going to look at you in times such as this.

As for her attacking females - there's the rolling stone article, the time when she said Tina Fey and Amy Poehler would rot in hell for making a joke about her, the entire issue of Bad Blood ( a direct attack at another woman), assembling a clique to further taunt the other involved woman, the time she inserted herself into a twitter war where nobody was checking for her in order to call out another female artist (only to be proven wrong and dogged across the internet), etc. I could go on, but I'm tired. 

Vix, why is Taylor obligated to say or do anything, especially over a he said she said matter? No one has to get involved, but Taylor did and wrote a check. Tweets from other celebs are WORTHLESS. If you ask me, she made the smartest move because there's NOTHING to support Kesha's story. Taylor, can I get a loan?

Taylor is obliged to nothing! She does not owe anyone anything and didn't need to say or do sh*t! My only point is that when you portray a certain image time and time again and attempt to shove it down everyone's throats, people are going to wonder why, time and time again, you stay silent on issues you claim to care deeply about. 

Isn't Demi also close friends with Selena Gomez? I wonder how Selena feels being in the middle. 

I don't think they are very close anymore, but I really don't follow that whole gang so I don't know. Toups would probably be the better one to answer that question. 

Taylor's donation was nice, but Demi Lovato has a serious point. Taylor, and other celebs, love to shout about feminism and women's rights but rarely SAY anything to back it up, nor do they participate in any of the uncomfortable conversations. Taylor is the epitome of this. She loves to scream out "girl power" with this "squad" of hers (which is really just a clique of mean girls, originally designed for a music video that was a DIRECT ATTACK at ANOTHER WOMAN -- tell me how that's female empowerment again?), yet she has never had a serious conversation of substance about feminism (or anything else, really). 

 

I don't deny that she is a kind and generous person at heart -- She obviously is. However, she's also, clearly, incredibly insecure and passive aggressive and willing to pander to whatever cause will inflate her image as "queen nice girl". She's kind, but she's disingenuous in many ways, as well.

 

+1 to all of this.

 

I actually think there's a good argument to be made on both sides.

 

I understand the place Demi was coming from.* There are women who claim to be feminists, even though a lot of what they do or say goes in direct opposition to what most feminists consider to be core beliefs (SARAH PALIN, of all people, claims to be a feminist. Okay, then.). And then there White Feminists who ignore the racial/LGBTQ inequality that women of color feel needs to be addressed in regards to issues such as equal pay and abortion rights, and then there are faux feminists, who appear to either claim feminism because it seems like a trendy buzzword, or use it as a way to deflect genuine criticism because their feelings got hurt (and yes, I do think Taylor falls into the latter category to an extent). Demi didn't make herself look too great because it seemed like mentioning feminism on social media was enough--although, I'm not going to lie, my initial reaction was "YOU GO, GIRL!"--but she--and Katy Perry, for that matter--have actively campaigned for Hillary Clinton, which is both a sign of a feminist stance and a somewhat ballsy move, due to those in their fan bases who might be alienated by that (something Taylor has always been VERY afraid of--I'm not saying she has to endorse anyone for president, of course, but...well, see below.).

 

I've said plenty about Taylor and my opinion of her feminist stance before, especially when the VMA thing with Nicki Minaj happened. I think, as the most powerful woman in music, one who has DELIBERATELY cultivated herself as a role model to young women and girls from the very beginning of her career--something many pop stars don't do, and even actively avoid--she has a platform that other almost every other pop star, even Demi, simply can't imagine. Her influence among young women and girls today is virtually unrivaled. So when she came out as a feminist? THAT'S why it mattered, and still matters. It's why I wish she would just own her position as a calculated businesswoman, rather than be offended by it and fall back on the "I'm just the Girl Next Door who happens to be a mega successful pop star" schtick (not that I don't doubt she has a down to earth side, but it's not a bad thing top acknowledge you're a powerful woman, either!). Girl, being called calculated is a COMPLIMENT. It means you're smart. It's obvious you are. 

And it's obvious she's generous. She's donated to a lot of causes and visited a lot of sick children in hospitals. But as perhaps the most well-known celebrity feminist in the world, it would be pretty [!@#$%^&*] awesome to see her pick a women's rights cause or two to highlight, instead of just sending "I send text messages now" when asked what she learned from the Nicki Minaj debacle, which she did in NME magazine a few months back. That just makes her seem like she's more concerned about looking bad on Twitter than speaking on women's rights. I sincerely hope that's not the case.

 

The donation to Kesha is a start (and I softened on her once I learned Kesha's mom mentioned it first), and I'm willing to wait and see what she does in the future. But there's more to be done, by everyone.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to make this so long, but as a young proud female feminist who just so happens to be Taylor's age (I'll be 27 on Sunday!), you DAMN well better believe I care about this. 

 

*I also understood why Demi said she doesn't have the same kind of money as Taylor, which is obviously true of her and almost every other pop star, both because of Taylor's success and Taylor's upper middle class childhood. At the same time, though, it...didn't help her all that much.

 

Okay, I'm done now.  

 

 

Edited February 22, 20169 yr by MissLlanviewPA

Taylor's donation was nice, but Demi Lovato has a serious point. Taylor, and other celebs, love to shout about feminism and women's rights but rarely SAY anything to back it up, nor do they participate in any of the uncomfortable conversations. Taylor is the epitome of this. She loves to scream out "girl power" with this "squad" of hers (which is really just a clique of mean girls, originally designed for a music video that was a DIRECT ATTACK at ANOTHER WOMAN -- tell me how that's female empowerment again?), yet she has never had a serious conversation of substance about feminism (or anything else, really). 

 

I don't deny that she is a kind and generous person at heart -- She obviously is. However, she's also, clearly, incredibly insecure and passive aggressive and willing to pander to whatever cause will inflate her image as "queen nice girl". She's kind, but she's disingenuous in many ways, as well.

 

+1 to all of this.

I actually think there's a good argument to be made on both sides.

I understand the place Demi was coming from.* There are women who claim to be feminists, even though a lot of what they do or say goes in direct opposition to what most feminists consider to be core beliefs (SARAH PALIN, of all people, claims to be a feminist. Okay, then.). And then there White Feminists who ignore the racial/LGBTQ inequality that women of color feel needs to be addressed in regards to issues such as equal pay and abortion rights, and then there are faux feminists, who appear to either claim feminism because it seems like a trendy buzzword, or use it as a way to deflect genuine criticism because their feelings got hurt (and yes, I do think Taylor falls into the latter category to an extent). Demi didn't make herself look too great because it seemed like mentioning feminism on social media was enough--although, I'm not going to lie, my initial reaction was "YOU GO, GIRL!"--but she--and Katy Perry, for that matter--have actively campaigned for Hillary Clinton, which is both a sign of a feminist stance and a somewhat ballsy move, due to those in their fan bases who might be alienated by that (something Taylor has always been VERY afraid of--I'm not saying she has to endorse anyone for president, of course, but...well, see below.).

 

I've said plenty about Taylor and my opinion of her feminist stance before, especially when the VMA thing with Nicki Minaj happened. I think, as the most powerful woman in music, one who has DELIBERATELY cultivated herself as a role model to young women and girls from the very beginning of her career--something many pop stars don't do, and even actively avoid--she has a platform that other almost every other pop star, even Demi, simply can't imagine. Her influence among young women and girls today is virtually unrivaled. So when she came out as a feminist? THAT'S why it mattered, and still matters. It's why I wish she would just own her position as a calculated businesswoman, rather than be offended by it and fall back on the "I'm just the Girl Next Door who happens to be a mega successful pop star" schtick (not that I don't doubt she has a down to earth side, but it's not a bad thing top acknowledge you're a powerful woman, either!). Girl, being called calculated is a COMPLIMENT. It means you're smart. It's obvious you are. 

And it's obvious she's generous. She's donated to a lot of causes and visited a lot of sick children in hospitals. But as perhaps the most well-known celebrity feminist in the world, it would be pretty [!@#$%^&*] awesome to see her pick a women's rights cause or two to highlight, instead of just sending "I send text messages now" when asked what she learned from the Nicki Minaj debacle, which she did in NME magazine a few months back. That just makes her seem like she's more concerned about looking bad on Twitter than speaking on women's rights. I sincerely hope that's not the case.

 

The donation to Kesha is a start (and I softened on her once I learned Kesha's mom mentioned it first), and I'm willing to wait and see what she does in the future. But there's more to be done, by everyone.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to make so long, as a young proud female feminist who just so happens to be Taylor's age (I'll be 27 on Sunday!), you DAMN well better believe I care about this. 

 

*I also understood why Demi said she doesn't have the same kind of money as Taylor, which is obviously true of her and almost every other pop star, both because of Taylor's success and Taylor's upper middle class childhood. At the same time, though, it...didn't help her all that much.

 

Okay, I'm done now.  

 

 

Bravo! Bravo! Bravo! You could not have said it any better!