Members VirginiaHamilton Posted September 20, 2012 Author Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 That's pretty much a perfect assessment of GH in the new millennium. Whatever legacy was built in the 70s/80s/90s was destroyed in order for Guza to fulfill his vision of turning a once-fantastic soap into a horrendous ripoff of award-winning prime time shows that he couldn't pay to get hired to write for. Some may want to front as if GH from 2000-2012 was at a Gloria Monty/Claire Labine level of excellence, but the past 10+ years of destruction (including the aforementioned example of a beloved character like Felicia being disrespected by her own daughter) is proof enough everything that was great about GH was destroyed beyond repair. I'm not fool enough to believe that this show will return back to its 90s glory with Cartini at the helm (because, let's face it, Guza and his overlords JFP and Frons, made damn sure that it wouldn't), but I do know that what I've seen from them (thus far) is better than what I've seen from the Trio of Suck in their 10+ year reign of terror. The fact that the cops (even if McBain was the top dog) were actually allowed to save the town from the latest crisis - something that would've never happened under the previous regime - proves that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OldGHFan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 ^^ Thank you Virginia. IA. Frank and Ron may not be the world's best producer and writer, but they are worlds better than Guza. You may not respect their storytelling but they didn't go out of their way to destroy what came before them. That's why I liked Wendy Riche so much. She came aboard as GH's new EP and made the show her own with her own vision. However, she respected Gloria Monty's GH and didn't go out of her way to diss any of GM's stories or characters. Guza just took a bulldozer through everything and everyone that he didn't create. Take a look at what he did to Luke & Laura. Rick Webber. Holly. Felicia. I could go on and on. You get the point. And while I still have yet to see Cartini get a full grasp of Anna Devane, she is at least recognizable to me. And Heather, while a tad crazier than I saw her in the past, is at least fun to watch. And I've seen some heartfelt Q scenes. Of course I'm still hoping that he will fix Robert and Holly and that the focus on the lives of Sonny and Jason lessens, but I'll take CartiniGH over GuzaGH any day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ChitHappens Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 But how are they better when Cartini have not told a coherent story yet? Make sense out of any story since their tenure. You are going to have to do alot of stretching for this one. And I'm just asking for one COMPLETED story that made sense and was not a complete joke (Jerry Jacks' most recent return is a example of how inept these 2 are). Just one! How many retcons did Guza have to do to any story and not even finish the story? Just because Guza got rid of people we liked does not mean that he is worse than these clowns. Production values, you guys want to tackle this one? Camera work? How many characters were damn near upside down during JFP's tunure? Was continuity a struggle for her? The generic lighting? The actors should be glowing in the dark when they get home. The return of the vets? What exactly are their stories? Showing vets means giving vets stories or at least include them in the the stories of others. Tracy and Monica going at it in the Q mansion? That's not a story! I have yet to see how Cartini are better than Guza and Jill. Their Cartini's GH is the absolute worst GH because their black hearts are not into GH at all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soapfave06 Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 I have to agree with Chit. Although, I could watch Tracy and Monica fighting in that mansion anyday, even if it isn't a story, but that has more to do with Jane and Leslie's performances together. The only characters that seem to have focus on this show are Dante and Lulu, and they haven't even really had a story themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OldGHFan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 I see your point about Cartini and having no real, good storylines. I guess I'm not watching very often so I guess that says something about their show. The bottom line for me is that Cartini isn't going out of their way to destroy things so that makes them better than Guza in my book. But that's probably about it.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ChitHappens Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 But what about this clown act has convinced you they are not out to destroy GH? Guza was not out to destroy GH. His vision was to focus on CarSaSon, but he knew how to tell a story and not retcon it to death. Did he have missteps? ABSOLUTEL! But again, coherent storytelling was not a problem for him. He didn't have to dumb down his characters to make a story work. Connie's story has gone on far too long, and it's not even interesting. The background has been re-written so many times, it's absolutely ridiculous. Who does this? Johnny's story is abysmal! Absolutely absymal! It has been dropped and picked back up to death to where I want this character dead and gone! And guess what, he used to be one of my favorites. And you better bet your ass, Guza would not be on Twitter trying to gain favor with a stupid audience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Khan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 Robert Guza, Jr. hated GH, hated GH fans, and hated everything both stood for. If that wasn't clear in every damn storyline and scene he wrote for the show, I don't know what was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OldGHFan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 I'm curious, when did you start watching GH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Khan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 I still can't believe the blood feud that has sprung up from "Cartini vs. Guza." It's like trying to argue whether Mussolini or Hitler was more evil. Evil is evil, folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OldGHFan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 Thank you. Guza liked Sonny, Jason and Carly and that's it. Every other character was expendable and I have no doubt Guza took great joy in spitting on Gloria Monty's legacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Khan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 And really, everything he did to make those three look good backfired in the worst possible ways. Ergo, even his own vision of how GH should have been was hateful and destructive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members VirginiaHamilton Posted September 20, 2012 Author Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 I also share your appreciation for Wendy Riche (so much so that I referenced your post in the favorite EPs thread), as she was the EP that ushered in the best era of GH that I'd seen in my 20-year viewing history. Whatever mistakes she did make and flaws that she did have are overshadowed by the greatness that GH had risen to during its 90s-era prime. And while I'm aware that Guza became HW during her tenure, she knew how to keep his hack ass in line. The minute that she'd gotten replaced by that bootleg-Janet-from-Three's-Company was when the show sunk to the depths of shittiness that has defined it for over a decade. The list of casualties under Guza's poison pen are too numerous to mention - hell, even the spawn of the ruined characters were slaughtered because of the Trio of Terror's insistence of killing the very show that many viewers (myself included) loved - which is why I will pretty much hold anyone in a higher esteem that does the opposite of the crap that I'd seen. For the record, I do not think that Cartini is perfect and do believe that they're fighting the uphill battle of undoing Guza/JFP/Frons' damage and resisting the complaints of the Guzafied viewers who wouldn't know a good soap if it slapped them in the face. However, if I were to choose between, say, watching Sam spend her days and nights waiting for the roided goiter to pay her a smidge of attention or seeing Sam trying to put the pieces of her life together after her (long overdue) end of her relationshit, I'd gladly choose the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Khan Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 See, with me, it's not that simple: Guza's GH was bad, and so is Cartini's. One wasn't (or isn't) worse than the other; they're both just, well, awful. Does that make any sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ChitHappens Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 That makes perfect sense! However, at least Guza could tell a story without all of the convoluted chit in between! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wingwalker Posted September 20, 2012 Members Share Posted September 20, 2012 Rose D'Angelo on ATWT. I know Martha didn't want to play double roles anymore, but I was so upset when Rose was killed off and I still tear up a bit when I watch the funeral. I think I grew to like Rose more than Lily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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