I tend to believe that the network's decision to truncate his plans for the Slater family (in order to make their TV movie, "Something About Amelia," appear more groundbreaking in its exploration of child molestation) went a long way toward making Marland ultimately quit the show.

As great as Doug Marland was, and he was fantastic, you didn't want to cross him. He went to bat for his shows and his actors. The reason he quit Guiding Light was Allen Potter basically truncated his Carrie split personality story and fired Jane Elliot. BIG mistake on GL's part. Marland's writing and the wonderful stories were a huge reason why GL was a strong second to GH during the early 1980s.

Of course, I tend to think they were better off asking Bill Bell or even then-EDGE OF NIGHT headwriter Henry Slesar to do something with that half-hour...but that's just me.

OK, this is an equivalent of a supernova exploding somewhere in the universe. Bill Bell, Khan, Bill Bell? I thought you were so Nixon. Or, better, so Douglas Marland. Why him?

I wonder if they thought about approaching Spelling to do a daytime soap in '83. Dynasty was really gaining momentum then and he had tons of hits already under his belt at ABC. Perhaps he was too busy with the primetime shows to take on 250 more episodes a year.

Just like someone said, yeah, they did, and it didn't work. And it wouldn't have.

I'd love to know what went down between Agnes and Doug that eventually forced him off the show and to have his name removed as co-creator.

You know, I remember seeing Agnes Nixon's archive interview and I was disappointed. It's not really a fun interview to watch as this woman who has created two of my favorite soap operas and some of the most memorable characters comes off a bit flakey...but come to think of it, show me a genius who isn't. Nixon sort of gives the interviewer heck during certain points of the interview. I can't tell if the interviewer wasn't prepared or Agnes was having a bad day but it's not like all the other interviews that were pleasant and interesting to watch like Erika Slezak's or Ruth Warrick's. Has anyone else seen the interview?

If I recall too, I think EricMontreal22 shared this with me, doesn't Windser Washam say the reason Agnes and he got along well was because she offers the romantic, fanciful side to the character, while he offers doses of reality? Maybe she was too "romantic" for Douglas Marland, who I think was able to balance fantasy/reality with mastery in his own writing.

And what was the theme of Loving? All My Children is the "brotherhood of man", and One Life is something to that effect just told through various diverse characters...what was Lovings theme?

Erik

I'd so watch that. I can hear one of those snarky teens now, heckling the new kid in town: "The Loving Murrrders. You've heard of the Loving Murrders, haven't you? Gwyneth Alden off'd her whole clan, man, it was reeeal wild. You know, they say, on some nights, you can still see Isabelle -- she was Gwyn's mother-in-law -- walking up to the Alden Mansion with a candle in her hand."

I absolutely L-O-V-E this!

That was so Degrassi! But I could totally see a bunch of kids who've turned the abandoned Alden mansion* into some sort of clubhouse slash meth lab with a skateboard ramp sweeping down from the balcony above the salon. Children of the Corinth

*(Deborah Brewster blew through her money and lost the house or she passed away and everyone's too creeped out to buy it, Corinth's real estate values rivaling Detroit's)

Oh Lord, and when the government decides to finally tear the old place down, the kids chain themselves to the front steps. "It's the only place hwere we have a voice!!"

And what was the theme of Loving? All My Children is the "brotherhood of man", and One Life is something to that effect just told through various diverse characters...what was Lovings theme?

I always figured Loving's theme was the simple and generic "old-fashioned soap opera." Old-fashioned soap opera about what, Aggie?

Bill Bell, Khan, Bill Bell? I thought you were so Nixon. Or, better, so Douglas Marland. Why him?

Because, Sylph, if I were the head of ABC Daytime, it would make perfect financial sense to court the man who was responsible for huge successes with CBS (with Y&R) and NBC (with DAYS). Charlie Sheen: "Duh!"

Because, Sylph, if I were the head of ABC Daytime, it would make perfect financial sense to court the man who was responsible for huge successes with CBS (with Y&R) and NBC (with DAYS). Charlie Sheen: "Duh!"

But it's not like Nessie and Doug were financial failures. They've had successful shows too, on several networks. No?

Yes, but Agnes Nixon (and by the way, her nickname is "Aggie," not "Nessie") already had her hands full with AMC; and while a soap created and head-written by Marland alone would have been tempting, the truth is, even then, Y&R was a juggernaut. Sorry.

Yes, but Agnes Nixon (and by the way, her nickname is "Aggie," not "Nessie") already had her hands full with AMC; and while a soap created and head-written by Marland alone would have been tempting, the truth is, even then, Y&R was a juggernaut. Sorry.

No need to apologize. And I'll call Agness whatever I want to call her. Aggie goes on my nerves, both as a nickname and as a person.

Plus I agree with you, they should've asked Bell, who hasn't really had his hands that much 'free' in those days.

Edited March 14, 201114 yr by Sylph

I have a soft spot for Loving... but, yes, it did seem like a watered down version of All My Children.

I thought Michael Weatherly was so f*cking hot as Cooper... loved the glasses.

Changela!

Changela!

Halleloo!

I always thought she should have tried pitching Loving to CBS or NBC. And in fact, Loving/The City isn't owned exclusively by ABC, it's owned by Nixon's production company...

The show would have probably still flopped, but maybe its downfall would have been easier and less chaotic...

Erik and I discussed this privately--and it's also been covered a lot in the Loving thread in the canceled soap folder, though that thread is pretty huge now, but...

Remember Agnes did that with ALL her soaps. She liked to own them herself for their first 5 years before even soncidering selling them. I believe her two production companies were Dramatic Creations and then Creative Horizons but I can never remember which name owned AMC and OLTL and which owned LOV--but the belief was (she discusses this in All Her Children ) that after that time they would have some sort of foundation. She said she hated the business aspects, and was always relieved to sell them to the network, but wanted to have some footing established. For whatever reason--prob low ratings, Loving was never sold (nor was The City, prob one reason it was given such a short chance).

ABC wanted a 30 min soap there. *They* approached Nixon--I get the impression from her insanely long youtube interview that shw was happy not doing another soap.

Some interesting points though--originally the show was to be created with Dan Wakefield, the uber fan/author of All Her Children (who was an acomplished novelist and had created the late 70s teen drama--a big influence on Dawson's Creek apparently but a flop--James At 15/16). For whatever reason he got scared off nad backed down, and it was only then that Doug Marland came in and got co creation credit. When Marland left after his year again (for whatever reason--but he was the first HW not Nixon) he asked that his name be taken off of the credits. In its first year or two the show garnered big critical praise but it never caught on. And yeah it did feel very much like AMC--actually AMC was getting bigger and more big city/business oriented at that time, and I think on purpose Agnes wanted ot have a soap that felt like the 1970s AMC. Of course at the time this was against the fasion of nearly all other soaps--established and new ones.

Agnes Nixon was official HW on AMC only a few times--when Marland left was one, and in 1994 (a very good year) was another--but in the late 80s especially it really had a hard time finding an identity and went through a huge roulette of staff.

I do think Agnes' request should have been taken by ABC--which was to air it between AMC and OLTL where it could have established an audience.

But, in Nixon's defence, like I said it wasn't her idea to do a third show, and it did make sense for ABC to approach her for a new soap seeing how massive AMC and OLTL were at the time (Agnes served as well as overall ABC Daytime consultant back then).

True, but it makes you wonder if the "cookie cutter" soap is what could partly attributed/attributes to killing the genre off soap by soap. I honestly believe had Capitol, Dark Shadows, Ryan's Hope, Santa Barbara, and Edge of Night...and maybe the Doctors had stayed on or had been introduced at a different time there would be more diversity in the line up. Capitol could have been the West Wing of daytime, Dark Shadows as the Vampire Diaries, Edge of Night as CSI, and the Doctors as ER since General Hospital likes to pretend it is the Sopranos. I wish somebody at ABC would take over who would make General Hospital a medical drama again, make One Life to Live the liberal minded soap and make All My Children the conservative soap with heart. The only other show I can see is remotely different is The Bold and the Beautiful because of its fashion world backdrop. Otherwise The Young and the Restless, AMC, OLTL, and Days of our Lives are cut from the same cloth.

I never knew AMC was a conservative soap I get what you say but... I mean when Capitol came out, critics all complained they barely took advantage of their setting.

While I do think soaps back in the day were more sitinctive, sometimes I think modern fans put too much stock in this. It was more about the actual style--but really most of the major plots on early 1970s ATWT were similar to early 1970s AMC--it was more about tone, AMC had more comedy and was less conservative, etc.

I'm going to beat my buddy Eric to the punch with these two items, but I believe she did approach Ellen Holly and Lillian Hayman about joining Loving after all of that Rauch mess went down over at One Life. Warmth and familiarity, sure, but those characters didn't have the crossover appeal of spinning off say Luke and Laura (understatement!). Plus, when Angie and Frankie (and Pat) showed up in Corinth, there was no introductory crossover s/l on AMC that may have encouraged folk to tune in an half hour earlier.

Right, I think she felt bad about Ellen being let go on OLTL but by that time really had no power over Rauch, but did control Loving. Ellen saw it as a dig. (and of course before angie joined they did have the big Carter Jones AMC story's climax air oon Loving--the crossover that as a kid made me a fan, I had never even HEARD of Loving before lol).

It would have of course hurt AMC, but imagine Tad, Liza, Greg, Jenny, Jesse, Angie doing Pine Valley High the College Years at Alden University over on Loving. Honestly, I think with the proper scheduling of crossovers to the mother show, the masterful introduction of a new teen set on AMC and new college character on LOV, Agnes Nixon of all people could have pulled that off. After the show got its feet, a couple of them could have stayed on LOV with new characters while others moved back to AMC, maybe taking a LOV character or two with them (think Lisa Bonet getting the ball rolling on ADW and Jasmine Guy assuming lead). Of course such a thing with teens would have worked even better if LOV's timeslot was later for the sake of high schoolers, but the college kids would have eaten it up if well-written. Soaps were huge on cOllege campuses in the '80s and if you took popular characters like those on AMC in a college setting at that, I wonder what that could have been.

I like this idea actually. I do think LOV's early time slot hurt it (it did do a bit better when they exchanged its slot with Ryan's Hope a year in something Hope fans never forgave it for). West coast it aired before noon--not a good time for soaps IMHO.