I'm so over all the 'Brand' talk when it comes to soaps. Clearly, AMC is no longer a very strong brand.

Child bye! I could not agree with you more. Nothing against AMC, but for real though...................

Child bye! I could not agree with you more. Nothing against AMC, but for real though...................

This is just how TV works. ATWT (my show) was tops for years but failed to re-invent. Particular stories aside, Y&R, GH and even Days have been smart to move on, shift to the next generation, and the proof is in the key demo ratings.

In the past it's been said from "sources," I think, that it doesn't matter if OLTL is rating better than AMC and GH because those shows have more brand value. Isn't that what Daytime Confidential said last year?

I do wonder how long they are going to let this continue on with GH. There are no cards left to play. Every former golden child was brought back, endless explosions and death and shootings and SPECIAL GUEST STARS. What's left?

Solid and entertaining storytelling, friendships, strong female characters, a world without Sopranos wannabes.

I thought DC and Errol here pointed out that AMC moving west didn't repair its' budget woes so it may face more real danger.

The idea that OLTL is not in a better position than AMC or GH right now is ludicrous.

OLTL is doing better right now. Period.

True, it's more about GH and AMC dropping than OLTL rising, but what's the difference? That's the only way soaps have been changing ranking positions for years now. Aside from DAYS' increases last year, the news in soapland has been about all the shows dropping, further and further. The fact that AMC and GH are dropping faster than OLTL *is* a good thing for OLTL.

And...it's true that most shows are pretty low right now. Aside from Y&R at the top, and AMC at the bottom, the other four shows all tied in the 18-49 demo this week. But keep in mind....the shows won't all be canceled at once. Sure, they'll all be canceled sooner rather than later, but OLTL at its current level will surely guarantee it a year or more past AMC's expiration date. And if GH keeps tanking? OLTL could be the last ABC soap standing. It's not impossible anymore.

I think Burton is the biggest problem on GH. Benard at least helped get ratings up when Sonny shot Dante. The writing is what stinks the most for Sonny, and drags his character down. Jason is just a black hole. You can do nothing with him, and Burton barely makes an effort. He also won't ever let them go back to making Jason a Quartermaine, I'm guessing, and there's no point in that now anyway because all of the drama died when AJ and Alan did.

I think they should kill Jason off and spin stories out of that.

Dante was once the most promising new character in years and Guza gutted him.

Sonny shooting Dante spiked GH over 3 million viewers. I believe many ex-GHers returned hoping at long last Sonny had gone too far by shooting an unarmed cop. Dante originally was a truly good guy in the line of Robert Scorpio, rescuing damsels and infiltrating the mob only to take it down. He's since become a corrupt cop LYING for Sonny and covering for Jason and Sonny. HUGE mistake Guza made teaming up Dante with Jason so much. Dante and Lucky as good cops was the team needed to counter balance the dark mobsters. JJ's Lucky was always a truly GOOD guy and Guza could have rebuilt around him and Dante working together.

Sonny is a disgusting excuse for a character who never ever pays but some characters do get to ream him. Jason is the saint of Port Charles, it's ridiculous and he's the biggest pit.

Edited November 6, 201015 yr by TeamEric

For me, Jason is a much more viable character than Sonny. Maybe I'm biased since I fondly remember him and Keesha together but Jason Morgan is the staple of everything wrong with GH. I can't give credit to Bernard for that arc because it was so heavily pimped anything but a rating increase would have been a failure. I think once Burton gets material he delivers but he has absolutely nothing to work with. He and Easton have the easiest jobs in the world - blank stares with limited dialogue. But you do have a point, with half the Q's already dead it seems pointless unless they make the last three years someone's dream ala Dallas. *snickers*

Sonny shot Dante during February sweeps typically a higher ratings month but still the spike was HUGE for GH. VM was pimped even more and yet has failed to produce any type of large spike.

The whole reason Frons put JHC at AMC was because he was so impressed with how she was able to produce Port Charles on its tiny budget. I'm sorry but the whole "Julie Carruthers cannot even balance her own checkbook" thing is ridiculous. Is AMC over-budget? Apparently so. But I don't but that the woman whose efficiency Wendy Riche devoted an entire Emmy win speech to whose ability to produce Port Charles on peanuts impressed Frons now apparently can't even add.

At a certain point it becomes practically impossible to stay on budget and I think Frons has slashed AMC to that point. Meanwhile every time I check out GH every couple of months it seems to have all new sets!

Isn't the only reason OLTL remains under budget due to Frank Valentini's production model? Actors at recent fan events confirmed it's one take and you're done at OLTL. Even if actor objects that it's not a good take, it's very rarely re-shot. FV also tapes so far in advance, their studio goes dark more weeks than GH/AMC do.

Not privy to backstage info at AMC, but GH can barely stay 3 weeks ahead on taping and there's always rewrites and cuts scenes over there which must be expensive too.

I think it was a mistake to bring JJ back without any plan. They have no idea what to do with him and just shoehorn him in, and the damage done to Lucky's relationships with his family doesn't just go away because Greg Vaughan did. Luke these days is such a diminished character that it just won't ever be the same. They clearly destroyed the last shreds of his relationship with Liz to try to show that Lucky was cool now and didn't need this woman who was according to him at her best when bleeding in the snow, but that has basically led to a lot of time in a supporting role and a mostly offcamera romance with a recurring character.

The only way they ever could have made Lucky work again was if they had genuinely changed the nature of the show and they don't want to do that.

Dante is probably along the same lines. They clearly felt the need to somehow tarnish him and implicate him so he could fit in with their pets. So he lies about a lot of stuff to help protect Sonny's other kids, and now we find out he lied about something big, which makes him look like a hypocrite because he went after Sonny and Jason for lying and covering up.

Then you have his extremely dull relationship with Lulu which seems to never go anywhere.

They don't have any real idea of how to tell stories or where to take characters. This has been a problem with Guza for years and years. In 99-00 you could see the show literally grinding to a halt as stories were dropped and scenes were repeated over and over to fill the gap. Now it's even worse. They just don't know how to do anything to keep a good story going. What they've done with the Lisa story is one of the most bewildering things I've ever seen on this show. They want to drag it out to keep her around without knowing that dragging it out just takes away what most people enjoyed in the first place.

I think it was a mistake to bring JJ back without any plan. They have no idea what to do with him and just shoehorn him in, and the damage done to Lucky's relationships with his family doesn't just go away because Greg Vaughan did. Luke these days is such a diminished character that it just won't ever be the same. They clearly destroyed the last shreds of his relationship with Liz to try to show that Lucky was cool now and didn't need this woman who was according to him at her best when bleeding in the snow, but that has basically led to a lot of time in a supporting role and a mostly offcamera romance with a recurring character.

I feel like Guza wanted to SPIT on L&L2 as badly as he did L&L and he used JJ's return to do nail that coffin shut. The writing wrecked them and yes Lucky wound up diminished for it. TG/JJ's magic chemistry been sacrificed for the Ethan garbagel, too.

I think Lucky as an Interpol agent could work as makes him Robert Scorpio but alas once again Guza tosses him to prop up Jason crap.

Dante is probably along the same lines. They clearly felt the need to somehow tarnish him and implicate him so he could fit in with their pets. So he lies about a lot of stuff to help protect Sonny's other kids, and now we find out he lied about something big, which makes him look like a hypocrite because he went after Sonny and Jason for lying and covering up.

We've never agreed more, CarlD2!

In 99-00 you could see the show literally grinding to a halt as stories were dropped and scenes were repeated over and over to fill the gap. Now it's even worse.

GH lost its heart and soul after Lucky's death week in 1999. Guza's never recovered that heartfelt storytelling ever again.

It's a shame because I found Guza's 1998 GH the best balance and well-written soap I ever watched in 30+ years of watching ABC soaps. Rape Revisited was brilliant from start to finish, the show had a heart. Luke was a deeply flawed man but Lucky was the best of Luke and Laura, their heart and soul. The show had three anchors, JJ, VM and SBu and it was balanced.

Edited November 6, 201015 yr by TeamEric

Dante was once the most promising new character in years and Guza gutted him.

Sonny shooting Dante spiked GH over 3 million viewers. I believe many ex-GHers returned hoping at long last Sonny had gone too far by shooting an unarmed cop. Dante originally was a truly good guy in the line of Robert Scorpio, rescuing damsels and infiltrating the mob only to take it down. He's since become a corrupt cop LYING for Sonny and covering for Jason and Sonny. HUGE mistake Guza made teaming up Dante with Jason so much. Dante and Lucky as good cops was the team needed to counter balance the dark mobsters. JJ's Lucky was always a truly GOOD guy and Guza could have rebuilt around him and Dante working together.

Sonny is a disgusting excuse for a character who never ever pays but some characters do get to ream him. Jason is the saint of Port Charles, it's ridiculous and he's the biggest pit.

Just started watch GH on a regular basis and think it is rather funny how the show has nothing to do with a hospital. I've tuned in a few times over the years, been disapointed almost every time, and just don't get why the show is so popular. I like Lucky, Dante and Dominick--three good characters--but find Jason down right odd in so far as his devotion to Sonny. Also, Sonny has gone too far many times but this silly car bomb that almost killed his daughter takes the cake. Why do so many characters what to protect him? Also, seems like his daughter might be better off knowing the truth.

Any show needs a moral compass and GH seems to lack any ethical focus. Also, they show does well with make characters but there are no strong women aside from maybe Monica who you see twice a month. I often feel like the homoerotic connections between the guys feel far stronger than typical soap romances. Jason has one true love--Sonny. Luke has been dumbed down to the level of class clown.

Since we're all making our usual weekly arguments, I'm just going to point out again as I do every week that the real problem is in the management across the board. Debating whether OLTL or AMC will go first is like arguing over which trash can a raccoon will turn over first. It doesn't matter because as soon as he empties out one, he's going after the other.

I agree Marceline. (And I still have a hard time believing that AMC would go first, anyway).

And next week is anybody's game. GH ALWAYS bounces back (as sickening as it is). OLTL does not. (Although I do see some minor consistency developing)

AMC cannot seem to get out of that deficit in the 18-49. They are all toast within the next 5-6 years. GH will maybe outlast the other two by a year. Who knows. I think the sign will be the shows that ABC Daytime has in development. And what the heck happened to this Aisha Tyler thing? (whom I have always felt was a BORE, with the exception of her stint on E Television)

OLTL is not doing better. There is absolutely no evidence of that. It is staying the same at best. It stays at 1.7 or 1.8. It moves and up in the ratings, only when other shows have a bad week. It will be comfortably back at the bottom within the next week or two.

Debating whether OLTL or AMC will go first is like arguing over which trash can a raccoon will turn over first. It doesn't matter because as soon as he empties out one, he's going after the other.

Perhaps this should be framed. Or at least become your signature.

OLTL is not doing better. There is absolutely no evidence of that. It is staying the same at best. It stays at 1.7 or 1.8. It moves and up in the ratings, only when other shows have a bad week. It will be comfortably back at the bottom within the next week or two.

These days, staying the same with tiny gains is a good thing. People have hyped Y&R for staying the same for over one year. Seems like people are taken with the OLTL stability given the free falls surrounding it.

Also, last year this time the talk was all about whether it would be OLTL or ATWT to die first. Now, that convo has shifted over to AMC and Days with OLTL seeming safe for the time being.

Suds report made mention of The Talk being off to a better start than The View. I can't remember 13 years back but he said there was serious talk of a View cancellation. Wouldn't it be a bitch if Chen replaces Susan Lucci as Diva of Daytime? Nelson is trashy but always has good info. He continued on by saying NBCU is now shopping the 55-64 demo as every bit as good as 25-54: Too little, too late--such talk, a few years ago, might have actually saved the World and GL from budget cuts and eventual cancellations.