Oh no, I hope that this does not mean that Maggie dies. Probably the surprise cast member is the dead one.

Another waste of an episode, and look, they are right back to the status quo from last year. The previews are very exciting with the Governor invading the prison-- only not because I saw that episode last year. The season started out so great, what Einstein came up with this crap? And <yawn> his daddy beat him. Such depth of character, such deep writing, it is not as if that motivation isn't used on TV 45 times a week.

AMC needs to put in some calls to their best TD guests like Yvette Nicole Brown and the Scott guy. Most of the guests this season have not been great.

I saw some of still scenes from the preview clips. It does look like Phillip kidnaps and/or kills Hershel. I dread this.

Edited November 25, 201312 yr by Ann_SS

For the first time since the show started we decided not to watch last night's episode. The number of people who care about seeing the Governor featured for two solid episodes could fit into my shoe. And from what I've read the story hasn't moved an inch.

Just saw it. So I'm guessing the Gov is still a psycho after all. Hmmmm...

For the first time since the show started we decided not to watch last night's episode. The number of people who care about seeing the Governor featured for two solid episodes could fit into my shoe. And from what I've read the story hasn't moved an inch.

I can't say you're wrong to skip it, although I'm about halfway through the episode and it's OK.

I know Martinez was a bad guy but I liked the actor, he was talented, and gorgeous. I was sorry to see him go. At least he had a memorable death, even if he was an idiot. (don't drink in the Zombie Apocalypse)

Finally finished the episode.

I get the idea of these last two episodes (the Governor can't be redeemed, just because he found a wife and daughter replacement doesn't mean he's suddenly a good person, he will always see goodness as weakness), but I just think they got way off the track of the prison group and add to an already overstuffed canvas (the prison has the virus story, you have Carol's absence - and if Carol returns, that means you have her POV, the Governor's, and now Rick's/the prison's). I'm also confused about the serial killing at the camp they went to. Is this person at the prison now?

The image of poor Pete shackled underwater was visually stunning, but it made no sense, because anyone in the camp could go to that little dock or whatever and see him. Why would the Governor do that?

(I don't know who played Pete, but he was just gorgeous - he should be in a superhero movie)

I'm not sure why they didn't have flashbacks of the Governor and his brother, since it was such a major part of his psyche in this episode (and, looking back, probably of his hatred of Rick)

There were some strong individual scenes, again, like Martinez's death, the walkers trapped on the road, the scene of floating Pete, the scene with the Governor and Kirk Acevedo after he killed Pete. I also know they needed to flesh out the characters with him since they're likely cannon fodder. Most of them still seem somewhat flat, and it's difficult to invest when I know they're probably dead meat.

I hope the show didn't make a mistake diverting attention entirely away from the main characters for two whole episodes.

That bald man on Talking Dead annoyed the &#33;@#&#036;%^&amp;*] out of me.

While I liked both of the Phillip focused episodes, I think they were a mistake. They stopped the show's momentum and I suspect caused some viewers to tune out. If they felt compelled to focus on Phillip, they should have done one episode or integrate his scenes with the prison story. However, I am very pleased that Phillip was not given a redemption story as some hoped or dreaded. So far TWD has avoided the soap trope of redeeming the villain so his victims forgive and embrace him. I suppose Merle had a mini-redemption arc, but he died rejected so that worked.

In retrospect, the dragging out Phillip's story has been a huge mistake. Phillip and his group should have overrun the prison at the end of last season and Maggie should have killed him in melee. The survivors of our group should have fled in different directions before reuniting.

Yep, the bald guy Paul on TD was horrible. They need to bring back Yvette Nicole Brown.

Edited November 26, 201312 yr by Ann_SS

Two solid eppies to show us The Gov is a sociopath? Funny, I didn't even need one for that because last season was plenty. It was a waste and a stall because they had nothing in between at the prison until they got to the mid season finale. I mean, you can have Hersch have the same conversation how many times? Seems like the creative well is a bit dry with this new writer so far, and that does not make me happy

Yep, the bald guy Paul on TD was horrible. They need to bring back Yvette Nicole Brown.

Yeah, Yvette needs to be a regular on that couch, but I could see how Hardwick might have a challenge with that.

I think they actually had quite a few ideas this season (perhaps a few too many), which is why grinding everything to a halt when they will soon be off the air for months confuses me.

Ratings are in. 5.7 in the demo (6.0 last week), 11 million or so total viewers. I actually thought they'd drop more, since everyone knew this was going to be an all-Governor episode. They're probably going to get some viewers back next week, although the holiday travels and whatever else might impact it. I just hope if they do this again they might focus the episodes on other characters who are more connected to the narrative. http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2013/11/26/sunday-cable-ratings-the-walking-dead-wins-night-talking-dead-homeland-boardwalk-empire-witches-of-east-end-more-2/218115/#comment-1590276

The ratings have gone down every episode this season so far, wasn't the show on the exact opposite trajectory in the other seasons? I'm not one of those people that thinks good ratings equals good storytelling but this show is very zeitgeist-y and I worry what happens when it loses that.

Luckily they have a lot of story still to tell, from Michonne's backstory to Daryl and Carol's potential, possible, future relationship. They didn't shoot their wad in the first season or anything.