19 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Roxie having amnesia in Alaska story.. which introduced the Kurt character.   It didn't involve anyone outside the Lewis orbit, didn't really have any long term implications for anyone, and it just seemed stupid.

God I hated that story. We hardly knew Roxie at that time, and it introduced a nobody character (Kurt was cute and, well, that was it) It also was just kind of skeevy...Kyle Sampson blackmailing Roxie to have sex..the weird old Madame...NuPhillip leering when Rick asked him about prostitutes....it just was weird and as you say, stupid.

1 hour ago, Soaplovers said:

I think he left the first time in spring of 1984 (I believe it was April or May).. and it was a shame he left because he and Beverlee had great antagonistic chemistry as brother/sister.. and their rapport was just getting explored when he left the canvas.

You are correct, he did leave late April or early May of 1984. TOTALLY agree about how great he and Beverlee were together. One of my favorite scenes of any era of GL was when Alan and Alex remembered protecting each other from their father's abuse. The two of them crushed that scene. I believe that was after Long returned to writing the show. I wish they had delved into that more, but Bernau left a few months later and Pilon never had any rapport with Beverlee. 

47 minutes ago, Mitch64 said:

God I hated that story. We hardly knew Roxie at that time, and it introduced a nobody character (Kurt was cute and, well, that was it)

Never understood why they brought in a nobody connected to nobody else on the show to marry Mindy in that over-the-top wedding, then sticking them in a boring "marriage vs career" story. (The same exact thing that scuttled Kelly and Morgan). Of course they had to kill him off.

It's unfortunate that due to real-life circumstances we didn't get MZ Roger vs. CB Alan in the late 1980s/early 1990s. GL had two show-defining villains and sadly so little of the 1977-1980 Roger vs. Alan storylines are out there.

15 hours ago, DeeVee said:

17 hours ago, Tisy-Lish said:

It would have been so much more compelling and believable, had they played Warren as openly gay.  A sexless straight baddy/sidekick really doesn't work. Writing Warren like the eunuch version of Roger Thorpe was a head scratcher...

I don't know about eunuch, but I was thinking today while watching one of the Dreaming Death episodes that Warren always acted like he had a huge sign around his neck that said "Loser." A very ineffective villain. 

I always remember Warren like Alan, or any number of powerful, yet not conventionally attractive and, smarmy guys on soaps in the 1980s, who still seemed to attract the most wonderful women.  They had tons of unwanted post-coital under-the-covers scenes.  They were the embodiment of Kissinger's quote about power being an aphrodisiac, because those dudes were not cute, and only occasionally charming.  And, gals like Lesley Anne got nothing but heartache out of their pairing.

Was I surprised later to find out that the actor was gay? No.  But, he was always written as having a ton of swagger and always on the prowl.  Both of his major roles were men who wanted to acquire power in order to impress (or control) women.

Edited April 21Apr 21 by j swift

5 minutes ago, j swift said:

I always remember Warren like Alan, or any number of powerful, yet not conventionally attractive and, smarmy guys on soaps in the 1980s, who still seemed to attract the most wonderful women.  They had tons of unwanted post-coital under-the-covers scenes.  They were the embodiment of Kissinger's quote about power being an aphrodisiac, because those dudes were not cute, and only occasionally charming.  And, gals like Lesley Anne got nothing but heartache out of their pairing.

Was I surprised later to find out that the actor was gay? No.  But, he was always written as having a ton of swagger and always on the prowl.  Both of his major roles were men who wanted to acquire power in order to impress women.

Didn't Burton also play Eddie Doranz on AMC?  Eddie was a real sleaze ball on AMC, and Kelly Shea was on trial for his murder.  I can't remember who really killed him, but Kelly was innocent..   

4 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

God I hated that story. We hardly knew Roxie at that time, and it introduced a nobody character (Kurt was cute and, well, that was it) It also was just kind of skeevy...Kyle Sampson blackmailing Roxie to have sex..the weird old Madame...NuPhillip leering when Rick asked him about prostitutes....it just was weird and as you say, stupid.

We were talking a few pages ago about this portion of the show being hornier than previous years (or many years after)...this just all seems like being pervy in lack of having any real idea what to do. Even reading about this story in the GL anniversary book I was confused. Who decided that Kyle/Roxie was a good idea, especially in these circumstances? Did they think it would make him look like a rogue?

1 hour ago, Tisy-Lish said:

Didn't Burton also play Eddie Doranz on AMC?  Eddie was a real sleaze ball on AMC, and Kelly Shea was on trial for his murder.  I can't remember who really killed him, but Kelly was innocent..   

Eddie Dorrance (I think). He did. That was the role which made him. I think he got an Emmy, or a nomination.

25 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

We were talking a few pages ago about this portion of the show being hornier than previous years (or many years after)...this just all seems like being pervy in lack of having any real idea what to do. Even reading about this story in the GL anniversary book I was confused. Who decided that Kyle/Roxie was a good idea, especially in these circumstances? Did they think it would make him look like a rogue?

Eddie Dorrance (I think). He did. That was the role which made him. I think he got an Emmy, or a nomination.

He was great as Eddie, and deserved an Emmy (or the nomination), but I never liked his roles on AW or GL.  They were both like Eddie-light, and neither worked for me.  Part of it was probably the writing (on both GL and AW) and part of it was Burton's acting style, which worked well with a total villain, but not so well as a villain with a softer side.  If Burton had gone from AMC to Edge of Night -- now that might have been some good drama.   

6 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

We hardly knew Roxie at that time, and it introduced a nobody character

This is a major no no- having a new character interact with another newbie. 

New characters have to be anchored with established characters for months before they branch out.

But when TPTB do major cast purges, this ends up happening and many viewers are left wondering who are all these people-where is my connection?

23 hours ago, DeeVee said:

Then Marland abruptly left the show. I doubt he would have left Alan and Hope on the back burner. I'm pretty sure the plan was to bring back Rita. Originally, she was going to come back to cause trouble for Ed and Vanessa, but they realized that pairing wasn't working, so they brought in Maureen for Ed. They strongly hinted Rita was pregnant when she left town, and the thinking is she would have sashayed back to Springfield with a kid to blow up Ed and Maureen and Alan and Hope.

While there's not enough of Vanessa/Ed (and I mean Maeve and Mart) for me to judge---I think it would've been fascinating to see Vanessa and Rita go at each other. I have never found a scene of Maeve and Lenore interacting, even though they were on for maybe a year together, and Rita realized that Vanessa was snooping into who Alan slept with in Jamaica(?).

21 hours ago, DeeVee said:

 

Anyway, it's a shame they never gave Hollen a strong story, especially considering how Long made the Lewises so prominent.

It is. I like Rebecca and Trish.

20 hours ago, DRW50 said:

There's a line in one episode where one of the "good" characters expects Vanessa to gloat over a tragedy (someone dying or losing a baby), and Vanessa says she isn't heartless. So Marland probably was going to soften her with time, as you mentioned.

I think I know what you're referring to--after the oil rig disaster, Vanessa is left to deal with the press, and while she gives a strong, prepared statement, when one of the reporters asks how she identifies with the women who lost their husbands, it kind of rattles her. After, Ross asks her how it went and she cracks a little bit about how she is human. Which is really kind of sweet, as Vanessa had been a bitch on wheels for a lot of the year. 

19 hours ago, Gatecrashers said:

One of Pam's huge misfires... Question for you all: What other misfires (besides firing long-standing vets, which was mostly Kobe) has Pam made as a writer? I thought she was mostly great, but there are some turkeys on rewatch. Opinions?

I think she overexposed Reva practically from minute one. And then the Lewises really literally revolved around Reva.

The Kyle Sampson story. He literally arrived with a built in entourage that no one GAFF about. Then he ate the town. I hate that they rewrote Billy's parentage to shoe horn Kyle into a family. Couldn't he have been just a businessman looking to takeover Lewis Oil, who used Reva but then they fell in love?

Killing Lujack. Look, I get VI was a hit with the audience. But honestly, enough so that the role was unrecastable? Permanently? Puh-leeze.

19 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

An overview of the major cast changes for GL beginning  1980 with  Marland's arrival.

1980

IN

Kelly

Morgan

Jennifer

Bea

Nola

Vanessa

Henry 

Joe

Derek

Tim -SORASED character from Dobson era

Andy- recast charcter from Dobson era.

OUT

Roger

Renee short term Marland charcter

And these Dobson charcters

Mark 

Greg

Ann

Peter

Elizabeth

Lucille

Holly

Greg was the doctor Rita had a fling with, correct? Which Mark was this? 

44 minutes ago, P.J. said:

It is. I like Rebecca and Trish.

I think I know what you're referring to--after the oil rig disaster, Vanessa is left to deal with the press, and while she gives a strong, prepared statement, when one of the reporters asks how she identifies with the women who lost their husbands, it kind of rattles her. After, Ross asks her how it went and she cracks a little bit about how she is human. Which is really kind of sweet, as Vanessa had been a bitch on wheels for a lot of the year. 

That may be it. Thanks.

6 hours ago, kalbir said:

It's unfortunate that due to real-life circumstances we didn't get MZ Roger vs. CB Alan in the late 1980s/early 1990s. GL had two show-defining villains and sadly so little of the 1977-1980 Roger vs. Alan storylines are out there.

One of the greatest soap rivalries. Aside being played by two iconic actors, it was so beautifully constructed by the Dobsons and built on by Marland.

Yes, I give him tons of credit for that, he was the only writer besides the Dobsons who really got both characters. Long could write classic Alan stuff (mainly about controlling people in his personal life) but then she'd have him do goofy things like trying to build a bioweapon.

4 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Who decided that Kyle/Roxie was a good idea, especially in these circumstances? Did they think it would make him look like a rogue?

I remember watching the scenes where Kyle humiliates Roxie and wanting to hurl. This is something I have NEVER been able to figure out--why after being treated like this by Kyle did Roxie act thrilled about Reva marrying him? I don't care how much time had passed. It's something that happened a lot on soaps during that time period, where abusive men were turned into romantic heroes, but it was still awful.

1 hour ago, P.J. said:

While there's not enough of Vanessa/Ed (and I mean Maeve and Mart) for me to judge---I think it would've been fascinating to see Vanessa and Rita go at each other. I have never found a scene of Maeve and Lenore interacting, even though they were on for maybe a year together, and Rita realized that Vanessa was snooping into who Alan slept with in Jamaica(?).

It would have been great to see the two of them go at it. Like Reva, Rita came from a humble background and the way she pursued men was at least somewhat mercenary, so Vanessa would have had that as a weapon against her. Rita was no fool and would have been on to Vanessa's machinations. I can't remember if Rita and Hope ever got a major confrontation scene. They should have given Kasdorf a short-term deal to give the story a proper wrap-up. Lots of potentially great moments lost.

35 minutes ago, P.J. said:

Killing Lujack. Look, I get VI was a hit with the audience. But honestly, enough so that the role was unrecastable? Permanently? Puh-leeze.

Yeah, that was wild. Why build up this character, attach him to a core family, get at least part of the audience on board with his romantic pairing...and then permanently kill him off?

Made total sense that VI wanted to try his luck in Hollywood. They should have anticipated this. They could have had him lost at sea. Or not! They brought back Roger after he fell off a cliff, Reva after she drove off a pier, and Brandon, who was at death's door already when Lucille croaked him.

46 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

One of the greatest soap rivalries. Aside being played by two iconic actors, it was so beautifully constructed by the Dobsons and built on by Marland.

Yes, I give him tons of credit for that, he was the only writer besides the Dobsons who really got both characters. Long could write classic Alan stuff (mainly about controlling people in his personal life) but then she'd have him do goofy things like trying to build a bioweapon.

I remember watching the scenes where Kyle humiliates Roxie and wanting to hurl. This is something I have NEVER been able to figure out--why after being treated like this by Kyle did Roxie act thrilled about Reva marrying him? I don't care how much time had passed. It's something that happened a lot on soaps during that time period, where abusive men were turned into romantic heroes, but it was still awful.

It would have been great to see the two of them go at it. Like Reva, Rita came from a humble background and the way she pursued men was at least somewhat mercenary, so Vanessa would have had that as a weapon against her. Rita was no fool and would have been on to Vanessa's machinations. I can't remember if Rita and Hope ever got a major confrontation scene. They should have given Kasdorf a short-term deal to give the story a proper wrap-up. Lots of potentially great moments lost.

Yeah, that was wild. Why build up this character, attach him to a core family, get at least part of the audience on board with his romantic pairing...and then permanently kill him off?

Made total sense that VI wanted to try his luck in Hollywood. They should have anticipated this. They could have had him lost at sea. Or not! They brought back Roger after he fell off a cliff, Reva after she drove off a pier, and Brandon, who was at death's door already when Lucille croaked him.

I do wish we had more of Rita's actual exit because it seems like so much took place after she left that she should have been there for. Add in the Ed recast and how flat a lot of the Hope/Alan material feels afterward, and I wonder what might have been.

 I think Kobe and Vincent had a bad falling out over his wanting to be in the movie Marie, which is probably why he was killed off.

2 hours ago, P.J. said:

I think she overexposed Reva practically from minute one. And then the Lewises really literally revolved around Reva.

The Kyle Sampson story. He literally arrived with a built in entourage that no one GAFF about. Then he ate the town. I hate that they rewrote Billy's parentage to shoe horn Kyle into a family. Couldn't he have been just a businessman looking to takeover Lewis Oil, who used Reva but then they fell in love?

Killing Lujack. Look, I get VI was a hit with the audience. But honestly, enough so that the role was unrecastable? Permanently? Puh-leeze.

Greg was the doctor Rita had a fling with, correct? Which Mark was this? 

Greg slept with both Rita and Eve.

Mark Hamilton was a love interest for Katie.

In the 80s soaps started killing off characters left right and center for drama then jumping through hoops to bring the actor back. Previously they recast, left town with the possibility of a return or were dead dead.