Members DRW50 Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 ^^^^That's really shameful, how much more inferior do women have to look in comparison to men on this show? Also, this is like the millionth time Nikki's apologized for something she didn't do and all Victor does is brush her off and treat her like crap. This show is twisted and one big f.ucking mess. New writers and producers, please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soapfan770 Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 It'll be interesting to see if the current team will recognize this present creative downturn and pull themselves out it. Between September 1996 and June 1997 Y&R was terribly bland and uninteresting. There was the whole never-ending Cole/Victoria/Ryan/Nina quad, the Ashley/Kurt/Hope snooze-fest, and Sharon crying everyday "IS MY BABY GONNA LIVE??????". Bell realized all of these storylines were nothing but clunkers and moved to bigger and better things ie the custody war between Danny and Phyllis and Veronica Landers coming to town. The downturn in 2002 brought us Smith and cut out a lot of dreck. Unfortunately, the 2005 downturn brought us Latham. So right now I'm pretty skeptical because no one could a show around like Bell could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Yeah - in the span of 9/10 months. If things started really taking a turn in May, 2009, that means on Bill Bell's time table, it'll be... February, 2010 when the "clunkers" are done and the bigger and better things are here, in a perfect world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Yes, in a perfect world... The difference is, this was Bill Bell's show, his professional legacy, and he was a storytelling genius. Maria, Hogan, and Scott have none of these things in common. As bellcurve previously stated, the give it time excuse was used with McTavish, Guza, Goutman, Pratt, Higley, and others, and look how well those turned out, especially in this daytime climate. And I've personally only observed this show to be getting worse in recent months. Not to mention, Maria Arena Bell wasn't a good HW from the beginning. The show might have been more stable a few months ago, but there was nothing brillant about it, and many of those little problems have only gotten worse in time, IMO. I don't think I need to go into that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Seriously though, after everything that's happened at ATWT and GL the last few years, why do you think Y&R will break that cycle? Or ever have anything close to storytelling geniuses of that caliber again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 I guess it's hope, Y&R had its severe drop in quality and uniqueness much later than other soaps. It still has the elements there, minus some things of course, to make it successful and the the show we all know and love. Those elements are just not being explored by this writing regime. Compared to most shows, the damage done to Y&R's core might not be on the same level as what was done to other shows. It's still the #1 soap in viewers and demos, and it's still a big hit internationally. There's a lot more opportunities available to Y&R than say ATWT. We all assume Y&R has the best chance of outliving the other soaps, which means it also has the best chance of getting better and finding a HW and EP that truly gets the show and what it's all about. It has time, when compared to other soaps. I do not believe anyone at this show currently "gets" it. Their writing style seems to go against the grain of this show, in my view. Even when it was more stable late last year and early this year, it wasn't the show I knew it to be or what I expected from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 But don't you think anybody who comes in now to write, even with this singular vision, will probably view Victor or Jack or Katherine or Jill or one of the major players differently than Bill Bell saw them when he created them? There's no possible way for any writer, even one with a singular vision, to step into his shoes the way so many are looking for. Basically, we're talking about a clone of Bill Bell, and that's never going to happen. Any head writer who comes in, realistically, is probably going to take Victor or Jack or Nikki in a direction the fans hate. Why? Because it's not what Bill Bell would do. It's a blessing and a curse to have had Bill for so long. These days you say you'd take Alden and Smith in a heartbeat, when so long ago, people were saying the same things about them they're saying about Maria now. Don't misunderstand me - I don't think the show's very good right now. I don't think it's as bad as others, but I'm not partioularly enjoying it either. I'm just taking a step back and looking at all the past postings from people during LML, during Smith, during Alden. And I wonder - if they do hire someone with a singular vision, how long will it be before all of these posts show up back again? Not very long. Because nobody's ever going to find another Bill Bell. And that's going to be this show's downfall. Because the fans were so used to him, and so spoiled with him, for so long, that there was no possible way the show can ever be as good, or close to as good, as when he was at the helm. I just see it as a lose-lose situation. It's like how you say the writers shouldn't get their ideas off of message boards, yet you post 50 times a day with all the things they should do to improve the show, the characters to get rid of, the stories that aren't working. So they do it, and the ratings don't go up, and more people complain that they "wrote the show based on what people said on a message board". They can't win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 I'm not asking for a Bill Bell clone, I'm asking for consistently decent storytelling that's both riveting and emotional. I'm asking for the types of storylines that made me fall in love with this show in the first place. Everyone has their stlyes yes, but they can also respect the style that made this show a success in the first place, and I don't mean just pacing styles. I'm also asking for respect to the dynamics of the show, especially the relationship and feud dynamics. I've felt this regime totally DOES NOT GET the Jack/Victor dynamic. It now feels overly petulant, silly, botched, and eye-roll worthy under this regime. The same thing with the Jill/Katherine dynamic. We're now to beleive Kay is some saint, when we know she was just as nasty as Jill could ever be. I don't perceive that to be a different spin on anything, it's a totally misunderstanding, especially by this writing regime. I never called for Alden and Smith's heads. Also, I never perceived the negative responses they got to be comparable to the backlash about this show and its writing regime now. Up to a few years ago, Y&R was the least complained about soaps on general soap message boards and in the fan reactions in the magazines. I don't think that's true anymore, in fact, it seems to be one of the most complained about soaps. Starting with Latham and getting thinker with this current writing regime. I think people just want some form of consistency in storytelling that's very much in touch with this show's roots and what made them watch in the first place (assuming they were pre-Latham viewers). We're not asking for Bill Bell to come back from the dead. We're asking for someone who respects his style, has their own style, but ultimately writes this show in a similar style that made it a success. Some consistency, but not a total washed up version of Bill Bell's Y&R. It might be a lose-lose situation, but that doesn't detract from the state the show is currently in. Fans are unhappy, ratings are falling, and the pres is turning against it. Fan might vent their frustration on boards, but completely stealing ideas from message boards and from only a specific group of posters or boards, will be enough to make any show polarizing or hated by some fans. If they aren't good enough to figure out what's wrong with the show they're writing and producing, why are a small group of internet posters more qualified? Just by my postings, they don't do anything I suggest. LOL! Ratings may never go up, maybe they will, but I'm pessimistic on that situation. If ratings are staying the same and have a better chance of only falling, why do they seriously think changing something that's unpopular on a message board is going to make any difference? Not only do most people not have Nielsen boxes, but ratings haven't been observed to change or go up dramatically in YEARS. Also, with this current writing regime again. I do not feel like they understand the show or its characters. Alden/Smith might have been frustrating sometimes, but they had a sense and a clearer vision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Hmmm... all food for thought. Definitely a lot to digest, especially at 2:30 AM here. LOL! I definitely see a lot of your points. I guess I'm just more pessimistic. I love this show, I love this genre. But I just have more realistic/fatalistic expectations in terms of the whole medium. Which, oddly enough, leads me to be more optimistic from day to day. I just enjoy it for what it is, because I figure it'll be gone soon enough - whether it's canceled, or I just don't care to be involved in watching daytime anymore. So I find small moments that remind me of the good ol' days and I treasure them, because they don't come around often. I feel like I have a 70 year old grandparent with Alzheimers. I still love them, and it's rare I see the person they truly are, but I also know I only have a couple years left with them, so I'll enjoy it for those rare moments of clarity, no matter how few and far between they are, and no matter how frustrated I get. Weird analogy, but you get my meaning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 ^I understand what you're saying, but as long as these shows are still on and we're loyal viewers, both us and the show deserve better. There's always going to be a vocal group of us who want our shows to be better and want a better writing regime in there. The odds might be stacked against us, but we're still fighting for the best for our shows, and probably will be until the bitter end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DRW50 Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Yes but these people should have some type of control over their fate. These are writers with decades of experience who up to a few months ago were being hailed as geniuses and revivers of the soap genre. Even with budget cuts and ratings woes and franchise fee slashes, it's not that impossible to write basic beats of story and try to find a balance. Other soaps do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 I hope so. Of course, you know me. I'll probably wake up tomorrow and be inspired and invigorated in terms of daytime, and love the episode that airs and you'll all make fun of me for "defending and excusing". You probably just caught me in a mood tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted July 28, 2009 Author Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 Hey, everyone's more than welcome to hate the current incarnation of Y&R and its current head-writing regime as much as I and others do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members brimike Posted July 28, 2009 Members Share Posted July 28, 2009 I like the regime. I just hate the mistakes they've made. Especially when they could have been so easily avoided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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