Y&R: Week of February 09, 2009

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I don't understand why it's a crime for Michael and Lauren to be supporting characters, which is what they were for most of their time on this show anyway. Not everyone needs to be a leading player, and Michael and Lauren just do not work as leading characters. The Fisher/Baldwins are not an established leading family of Genoa City the way the Newmans, Abbots, and Chancellors are. The Fisher/Baldwins are the outcasts of Genoa City, which means they're very limited from the get-go. Arguably, it was one of Jack Smith's downfalls when he tried to create a whole family around Michael, which ate up a good amount of airtime in 2004 and 2005. A lot of people thought the show was shifting away from its core during that time, and I can't say I disagree.

The Newmans, Abbots, and Chancellors should be the core, but that doesn't mean Lauren and Michael and other supporting characters can't get more airtime. There's only so much you can do with the only happily married couple on the show. I'm sure if Michael and Lauren had some serious conflict, people would be complaining about how every couple on the show is miserable, you know...

[DaytimeFan]

I so agree. Michael and Lauren *are* supporting characters, that's what they truly always have been, regardless of Emmy wins or story focus. Moving Michael to front burner with the rest of the Baldwin/Fisher clan started a lot of bullsh*t in terms of storyline. Jill and Kay got the shaft, so did Victor, Nikki floated about...then MAB swoops in, pushes Michael and Lauren backwards and I feel the show has some balance again.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

So, Eileen Davidson did an interview with Buzzworthy radio yesterday.

She said something big is coming up, and she absolutely cannot spill anything. She said things are being kept under wraps tightly these days. So, I guess we were right a few pages back when we assumed they were doing a much better job of keeping things from leaking.

She also said she loves Maria, and that Paul Rauch only handles production matters and not the creative side of the show - that's all Maria. She said Rauch is a "grouding force" who tries to keep things under budget and keep the production values in tact.

[lmfan]

That's simplifying the LML years and putting too much blame on Lauren and Michael and I am talking about them and not the whole Fisher-Baldwin family.

Michael and Lauren were pushed into the background by LML soon after their wedding. Maria Bell just continued it. I also don't think they should be blamed for others not getting story because except for a few months in late 2005 leading up to their wedding they never dominated story. The fact is that Michael was elevated to lead during the Kevin story in 2004 and continued in 2005 and it was damn good story and if people remember a critical success and a very popular storyline. He was a favorite of Jack Smith. Gloria is the one who started to dominate too much. The whole family became about Gloria. Even during LML's reign Michael was only used as a prop for Gloria, Phyllis and Victor. And under LML, people may not have liked what she wrote for Nikki and Victor but they received tons of story from her. So did Jack, Phyllis, Brad and all the Newmans. Now Katherine and Jill did get the shaft. That I agree with.

Of course Nikki and Victor are the couple on the show and always have been. They are the true Y & R leads along with Phyllis and Jack and a few others, but characters float from supporting to lead and just because characters are supporting doesn't mean they don't deserve story. Especially when they are played by two quality actors.

Lauren was lead for much of the late 80s and early 90s before she went to B & B so she is capable of playing a lead although I don't expect her to ever play a lead on the show. CLB is treated as support even when he gets airtime. I don't have a problem with that. I think some are missing my point. I don't want or expect Michael and Lauren to be a lead. But why is it asking too much that they get their own story once in awhile? Why do they always have to be used as props to other characters?

[lmfan]

I hope the something big is Ashley finding out about Victor's scheme and it blowing up in his face. I can't stand Ashley with Victor. I like her better working with her family at Jabot. Of course, I don't know who they would match her up with after Victor.

Victor rarely loses though and the killing off of Brad frees Abby and Ashley to become Victor's "new family" without the pesky reminder that Brad was always Abby's real father so Victor will probably get another pass.

[Adam]

Getting slightly back on topic......

In today's episode Phyllis and Michael share some very good scenes. Michelle continues to hit it out of the park. Anyway I found the conversation very telling and certainly sheds light on the possible upcoming arc with Sharon.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

No one claimed it was a bad idea, but if they want them to be a happily married couple on the show, what real conflict can they bring to them? Not to mention, they appear to be a deeply polarizing couple - one that's popular with some and unpopular with others.

I for one have never bought that marriage. I don't care what CLB's sexuality is in real life, but I cannot buy Michael as a straight man, and Lauren seems like his best girl friend. I may be throwing some stereotypes out there, but I don't see what's so special about them.

Michael might have been somewhat of a lead in 2004-2005, but he went back to his supporting role soon afterwards. It doesn't negate from the fact he was a supporting character on and off from 1991 to 2004 and again from 2006 or so onwards. 90% of his backstory is supporting, and he works best in that capacity, IMO. Bill Bell certainly never saw any need in making him a lead or developing a family for him. Whereas he certainly used Victor, Jack, Nikki, Ashley, Jill, Katherine, and the others as leading characters for many years.

Anyway, this dicussion lasted a lot longer than it should've. I respect your opinion lmfan, and I know you love Lauren and Michael. I guess it goes back to what we consider our favourites.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

[y&r_fan]

Wow - Don has ALREADY been removed from the opening credits. His shot was replaced with Kristoff's today. Too bad they won't add new cast members that quickly.

[MarkH]

Yes, I concur. I don't see by what metric anyone is saying M&L should be supporting or are "done".

I also see no reason to endlessly prop Newmans/Abbotts/Chancellors. I like to see those families, but Winters/Fishers etc. are fine too. Here is what I think:

Newmans/Abbotts/Chancellors are, relatively speaking, ratings gold. The heightened focus on them, and heightened drama for them, has repaired the awful ratings attrition of Spring 2008. The show is now moving from "repair mode", I think.

My hope is that there will be time on the front burner again for the Winters/Fishers...they may not get AS MUCH story as the others..but there will be times...

Let me also say that Y&R does supporting peculiarly well. I think it may be one of the only shows where you can be supporting AND front burner... I personally love the Amber/Daniel/Kevin/Jana quad. Even though none of them are driving story right now, I feel like I see them often and get a good sense of them. I really think this show is an ensemble, and uses most of the cast is a remarkably strong, balanced way.

The major exception is the Winters. I wonder if the writing team realizes that group is STILL not working (thanks, Tyra and Ana!)...and if they're contemplating major fixes for that tale?

Really?

His firing, the finding of Brad's body, and now this...all make me wonder if he really p*ssed someone off in his negotiations?

At that farewell party, when they showed the pictures, Rauch was glowering in the distance...and there was no MAB that I could see. So, I wonder if he played hardball and lost?

[dm.]

I certainly hope they are because nothing is working for them on the show right now.

It shouldn't be that hard.... just come up with ANY story for Devon and try to spice up Neil and Karen. But it seems the writers aren't even trying to work their storyline properly. We only saw Karen 4 times this year.

[MarkH]

The good news is that marrying Karen to Neil represents some investment in the character.

The bad news is that the writers seem to have mistakenly assumed that we are rooting for Tyra/Ana...and most viewers can't seem to stand those two. The rooting value is with Karen...which probably surprises the writers...who wanted us to think Karen was "mean" for asking Tyra to get her own place.

The way to fix this, I think, is to show us more of Karen, and make us feel more FOR her...her cancer anxieties, her insecurity over Neil, her sweetness to Ana and Lily and Devon. (Which means no more creepiness, like 'call me Mama Karen'). Then, once our love for Karen is strengthened, reveal Tyra as a shifty grifter. Totally ramp up Tyra's villainy...I mean, make her REALLY bad so she's going to have to leave the show (maybe she'll die in a trash compactor or something).

At the end of that story, Neil and Karen will then have Ana, whom they can promptly ship back to boarding school so that she can come back a young adult in a year.

Now, the stories that are working for the Abbotts/Chancellors/Newmans are 'BIG' stories...high drama.

I think they should consider doing something like that for Winters (after this Tyra mess is over). We don't know that much about Neil's past....other than Malcolm was a half-brother. Or maybe "Drucilla" starts sending messages and gifts. It wouldn't be Drucilla of course...but the start of some kind of mystery...I haven't thought it through, but it seems to me that they need to try to give this clan a story, for once, that is a little more reality based.

Neil is best, for me, when he is that strong man with strong ideas about what his family should be doing (Victor-esque, just not as much as an assh*le about it), while remaining deeply principled (e.g., he would not have sex with Carmen). For Neil, one option would be to have him actively doing some of the manipulation and brinksmanship in these corporate wars.

Let's not even mention Adam/Heather.

The canvas is quite full...but one gets the sense that one weaker skill of MAB's team is handling the "low simmer" of characters on the back burner. Her front burner bubbles with sudsy goodness...but like Brad Bell...her back burner actually seems to be off the stove.

[DeeeDee]

Michael & Lauren shoulda remained friends.

[dm.]

If they realized that we don't like Ana/Tyra than our work is done, but if they haven't done that we can expect a lot more things to complain about. Giving Eva Marcille a longer contract seems to indicate that they want to invest more in her, yet we don't see that on-screen.

I do like the idea of Tyra exiting the show, but maybe not by killing her. I do not want to see any murders or funerals on the show for a longer time.

[kandbar]

Neil and Karen have no chemistry... nothing to root for. I like Tyra and Neil possibilities... that or recast Dru. I have nothing against racially mixed couples, but I want a stable African-American couple on every soap (excluding AMC, since we already have Jesse/Angie).