The Politics Thread

[DramatistDreamer]

Yes, I agree that Hillary was the Democratic establishment's preferred candidate, part of that is because of Bernie's political affiliation but I also think that Bernie had some genuine problems reaching the many Democrats of color.  Sanders definitely failed to strike the right tone with black voters and black women, in particular, who are not only a vital part of the Democratic voting base but the most consistently reliable in terms of voting.  And we weren't voting for Bernie.

Consequently, I can see Michael Bloomberg having some of the same issues, if not worse than Bernie, due to Bloomberg's shift back and forth between political party affiliations, among other issues.  People in NYC regretted that third term pretty early on after he won re-election and national politics is often less forgiving than the local political scene where, perhaps pragmatism is overlooked, if not rewarded.

[Khan]

I know one thing that turned me off to Bernie was the attitude that voter suppression against AA communities was not a "real" issue.  SCOTUS' decision to strip away provisions of the Civil Rights Acts was a clear sign that it was.

[Wendy]

Cheer up. Alexa tells me there is only 752 days until the 2020 Presidential Election! It feels like it has already been 752 YEARS since the orange POS took office and ruined this country.

[Juliajms]

I hope you are right, but I can't share your optimism.  Who knows if democracy as we knew it will even survive Trump?  I have my doubts because now those in power know that you can flaunt norms and no one can or will stop you. We'll see if the Genie will go back in the bottle.  I think it's more likely if we can defeat Trump in 2020, but now ambitious people of all persuasions see that you can lie, cheat and steal and get away with it even when the world is watching.

Isn't that the truth.  We are truly in crazy town. 60 million people voted for that man and many of them will again. It's chilling. 

 

I know most people in this thread will not agree with me, but I would rather be ruled by John Kasich for 10 years than Trump for 2. Maybe I would feel differently if I weren't white and straight, but at the same time,  I understand he wants to take away my reproductive rights.  It's just that I see Trump as an existential threat to both democracy and life itself.  I'm willing to give up the short term so we can live to fight another day.

 

As for Bill Clinton I did love him at the time, but I was still a teenager when he was elected. I wouldn't vote for him now and I do believe his victims.  It's really too bad he didn't step aside because nothing would have been lost. In fact, I wonder if we might have avoided Iraq, if Gore had been the incumbent when he faced W.  I also agree that Ted Kennedy should have gone to prison for whatever that's worth now that he's dead. I don't think either of them would have gotten away with what they did in 2018, but we'll never know.

[DramatistDreamer]

 

 TBH, I never thought of it as optimism but I guess it comes off as such.  Max mentioned the likes of the Whigs once being an active political party and being relegated to history and it reminded me that years ago, I was thinking of the Whigs and the Federalists and immediately thought of the GOP as the next likely political party to follow suit.  It wasn't with any joy or glee that I thought about it, at the time.  Just an assessment of how events seem to shift trajectories throughout the course of history.

 

Not to get preachy but sometimes we think that we live in hardship that will never end but I always remind myself that slavery in this country lasted hundreds of years.  That is truly an interminable amount of time where no doubt, people languished, believing that miserable state would always be.  Unfortunately centuries last a long time but fortunately for me, not for all eternity.  It's a somewhat bitterly depressing way to look at things but it reminds me that things don't last forever.  Now will it change in our lifetimes is an entirely different question.

[Juliajms]

Not preachy at all. I had a similar thought about the various murderous dictators the world has seen. People under the rule of Stalin, Mussolini and Hitler must have thought it would go on forever, but it didn't.  I'm hopeful that we can turn things around even now, but even if things do get much worse it doesn't mean they won't get better for future generations.  We share that kind of optimism at least.

[DRW50]

I was trying to read a bit about this 2030 climate report (which is probably just too depressing to even think about) and stumbled onto this CNN 'discussion.' I barely ever watch CNN so I'm amazed at how vapid this is and how even the host struggles to get words out. They have fallen so far. I guess I should be happy they didn't have some idiot on to tell us there's no such thing as climate change. 

 

https://madison.com/video/featured/experts-climate-catastrophe-could-hit-by/video_b5b5b7d1-f03d-56b7-ab5a-3cefefad1d0a.html

[DramatistDreamer]

 

Unfortunately, Bernie wasn't the only one minimizing the role of voter suppression in 2016.  The media gave the issue short shrift as well.

I was continually shouting to the heavens about it on my TL and only a few other, mainly black people were discussing it, amplifying the issue.

 

Because there was little to no acknowledgement and reflection on it in the mainstream, it's happening AGAIN in Georgia as it has been discovered that voters have been purged from the voting roles.  This comes off the heels of the discovery of voting places in predominantly African American districts being closed--was that Georgia too?  Or South Carolina?

The only reason anyone in mainstream media is paying any attention to this now is because one of the gubernatorial candidates is a black woman but apparently we're all supposed to be colorblind, right?

 

Back to Bernie though...the man didn't know, understand or even want to learn the meaning of the word intersectionality.  He had no grasp of how one's race can affect one's economic situation, health or healthcare prospects, etc. and he had no desire to learn or even acknowledge that such a dichotomy existed. That is truly what turned me off of him.

Edited October 14, 2018 by DramatistDreamer

[Khan]

 

Agree.

[Juliajms]

Florida was having problems with theirsystem too ahead of the deadline.

https://www.politico.com/states/florida/story/2018/10/09/a-mess-floridas-online-voter-registration-system-panned-641953

Edited October 14, 2018 by Juliajms

[I Am A Swede]

 

I totally agree with that. It was one of my favourite threads.  

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That would be wonderful.

[DramatistDreamer]

 

How could I possibly overlooked Florida and their constant stream of voting shenanigans? 

 

Perhaps it is in the spirit of schadenfreude that I'm strangely, slightly bemused by watching these bankers, tech titans and the lot of them having to backpeddle and squirm over this conference in Saudi Arabia as others with half a conscience quickly back out of putting in an appearance. It just speaks to the lack of integrity of the Trump WH that they haven't done so at this time and are still trying to minimize the Khashoggi situation.

 

[sivad40]

 I found out via previews while watching football, Trump is going to be on 60 Minutes tonight with Lesley Stahl interviewing him. 

 

I believe it take at least  three or four generations to recover from the damage that Trump going to do this country.  Trump has control of all three branches of government the support of the American oligarchs (the Koch Brothers the Mercers, the majority of  the intelligence agencies, and the 3/4 of the  media and press is on his side openly (Fox News, conservative talk radio, WSJ, etc) or on the sly (CNN, NYT, CBS, etc).

[DramatistDreamer]

[Juliajms]

^ So gross, but he would have probably golfed following 9/11, he's that worthless.

 

This is just plain nuts.