Vee

I don't think they have any intention of redeeming Drew.

Ah yes, the Logan Hayes topic. I liked Logan but Josh Duhon was apparently messy BTS, then they wanted to bring on Brandon Barash as Johnny, etc etc.

Yes, your posting history speaks for itself and has not gone unnoticed. With the exception of this smidge of posts you've been on its neck most weeks in the last year, breathlessly spinning against every weekly result. And now you're predicting its swift doom. Again: It's weird. But I actually don't think it's got anything to do with racism. I think you just don't plain like the presumption of any new soap existing on the network, putting on airs and getting a lot of attention next to your clear preferred favorite. Hey, whatever, we all have favorites; I loved OLTL. And I think BTG is far, far from flawless. But I'm sorry, claiming any show, anywhere, should take a page from The Bold and the Beautiful on diversity or representation is laughable. So maybe dial it back.

What's baffling to me is they threatened to do Martin/Tracy in like a fall or winter preview over a year ago (and I wasn't here for it then either, to be clear). Spent the last year having Martin do horrible, unforgivable things to Tracy and her family instead of building anything viable. And all of a sudden I'm now supposed to want them to throw caution to the wind and fúck during the snowstorm. Sorry, no! I'm good. But judging by the social media reaction to the idea I'm in a growing minority.

Another reason I'm not particularly interested in following their example. MVJ learned too much from how that show operates as is. It's unwatchable except to its hardcore.

It's 'mortem' but thank you for putting the show in the ground already, since it's obviously made you uncomfortable from the jump. Talking about the need for more Black romance is one thing but you've been at its throat manifesting its cancellation from the beginning. That's weird to me.

Could not be here for anything less than a Martin and Tracy romance.

By me! It's an analogy I've run into the ground. I do think Gail Carlson is great though, both earlier in her run and here.

I don't think either Nicole or Kat have anything to be ashamed of.

It's not about an excuse, it's about the nature of the genre IMO. I think the pairings both work and have heat, even as Bill and Dani are clearly dysfunctional and often toxic. Based on online response they have as many fans into them despite all their awful history and/or loving/hating them in equal measure, or advocating for either end of the triangle. That's soap opera audiences for you. And all of those elements are why it works for me the same as that divided audience. Of which we are now two.

It's a soap. They're all real screwed-up people with major sins. Bill would have to earn his way back into Dani's life and he's nowhere near that yet, but it's clearly designed to be a messy, often toxic relationship designed to power the show for years to come. And in Karla and Timon they have actors more than capable of doing that. I would still keep Andre and Dani married for at least the year and probably longer. IIRC Dani even bet or came close to betting Joey Armstrong on them lasting a year, which is shades of the story MVJ did with Lucy and Damian Smith on GH in 1994 - betting on ruining Bobbie and Tony's marriage. I like both couples, and I understand why Andre is better for Dani but she will eventually break his heart. That's daytime to me.

I'm ngl I am not in a rush to watch this week without much Willow, Drew or Michael. They power the show, not this crap.

They did allegedly run Hank/Alex promos either in print or on radio, whatever in urban markets during this period.

The moment that always gets me is when Virgil the angel returns for an almost wordless cameo for a minute or two when Megan dies. Viki sees him and knows exactly what that means. And it was played well without overegging it or underlining it in any dialogue explaining his presence, almost Twin Peaks-esque. (In fairness though they also ran a very lengthy flashback of Virgil from the '80s.)

I do love Jean. Thanks.

Matt Lauer's victim at NBC News speaks out re: her new book. The excerpt is very graphic. @DRW50 The silver lining here is this should permanently end any chance of Lauer ever making a comeback, which his friends at the network tried and failed to mount for him before.

Still somehow not convinced B&B is the best place to look for Black representation and romance.

I think Dani and Bill was always inevitably endgame. They will come together and go apart again. And I'm here for it because the chemistry is very real and they are probably bad for each other. Doesn't mean I can't enjoy Andre and Dani for considerably longer.

I don't want any of those boys wasted on that mutant spawn. And technically, they are cousins.

I understand what happened with Dani. She was reacting to the BRCA situation, vocalized it to Bill, they reacted then she pulled back and walked away. It's typical soap push-pull behavior.

We were on the cusp of the latter by then. Her big stories in '05 had not gone down well. They moved quickly into the "Jasam break up yet again because of 'the danger' and she fúcks her stepdad' period shortly after Robin's return. I do think Billy and Kimberly had some chemistry, so I would've been there for it quad-wise in 2015 tbh lol.

I dunno about that. I don't think either Steve or Kimberly would have stood for that at the time, and as I said earlier I think Robin remained uniquely untouchable in certain ways despite some of the passive aggression evident in the show. Even in '99, Robin is the only character who got away relatively clean. We were also in a real dog year when Kimberly returned. They brought her back to try to help right the show at the end of a nadir period for the show (2005), and it worked (and credit to Steve for pushing for it). Several Jasam stories, like the summer DWTS caper and Michael's imaginary friend, had also just flopped. Kelly was about to enter contract tango, which led to the ONS with Ric in '06 and the villainizing of Sam's character for a year or two when Frons and co. thought she might leave. IIRC Jason and Sam did not fully reconstitute until 2008. So I think those factors as well as Robin's immense popularity would have left Sam on the outs. I would not have bet against Robin if it came down to the two of them. Steve also wielded enough power at that time. But I am glad Robin moved on too. Kimberly was right. I would've cackled if they'd put them back together in the BM recast period though, when Patrick was with Sam. I had moved on from Jason and Robin long ago but that's absolutely something I'd have done. Speaking of Sam coming up snake eyes, I was reminded of the very hands-off way they handled Brenda re: Courtney in '02 when she later returned again in '10 and met Sam. They seemed very, very hesitant to let her be in proximity to Sam, because they knew of the obvious Brendabot issue there (with Sam inheriting most of Brenda's planned story in '04) and they knew Jasam still could not stand up to Brenda. So they sort of avoided it and kept their scenes together awkward, bland and inoffensive IIRC. Same here. I would be happy to see JT make a short visit to consult on a case and tangle with Emma, but I fully expect we will see Kimberly with BB when they honor Robert.

I wish Sharon Wyatt could appear again to usher on an Annie Donely for the PCPD/WSB (presumably Caitlin Reilly, a popular influencer, will not reprise the role so they'd need to find a third actor). But I understand why she doesn't wish to appear on camera. How they handled her for Sean's memorial was lovely.

Lord. The past Wyndemere in the late 2000s/early '10s opening did look a bit Big Bad Beetleborgs/Young Frankenstein at times, but it still had the character. I'll just pretend this one never happened.

I don't think they exactly shied away from portraying Dani negatively in the first year. Particularly not the first six months. I also do think they know Vanessa is delusional. But her toxic character arc has always made sense to me, because it's one of the few that is clearly defined and multi-layered on the show. She's talked her way several times through how getting involved in Joey's world made her feel actualized beyond her sleepy home life as an empty nester in a broken marriage, selling houses and sleeping with busboys or coaches but having little else. Here she feels she is newly empowered. It's a power fantasy which will come crashing down, but I understand why she's all in because LB and the writing (likely Guza's work) made me understand her and sympathize with her foolishness.