Soaplovers

I read how the Ann/Carolee/Steve story ended.. and I'm on the fence.. it will depend on how it is executed. Marland also learned with the Wendy character to not change a character to fit a plot.. but to fit the plot to the character (I.e. Eleanor/Luke/Wendy story).

Ah but you forget the season 3 curse..more damaging than the 2nd season lol. Heather on oc (gaslighting shannon), and Heather on NY...hmmm must be the name And lets not forget Teresa in season 3 of NJ where her jealousy of melissa was so obvious anyone could have seen it.

What a wonderful final scene...a resolution to the louie/Katie song and dance. I do wish the show had shown her new romance and had leave town happy, content and wise with her new love.

You guys do know that this is 1985 and that Marie's Cyndi Lauper/Madonna get up was kind of in during this era along with the 80s theme music so I don't think it was out of date for the time, but I can see how it could be out of date in 2019 With that said, the start of Marland's reign at least had a spirit/fun that is gone by 87/88 where it becomes too dark, too serious, and kind of boring. Stories/plots can be tightly woven and spun, but if there's a coldness and lack of fun.. people aren't going to watch.

I was thinking about the whole March 25 1985 episode where Rachel/Alice were interacting... and Rachel without her memory reminded me of the more aggressive/harsh persona from the 1974 episode (where Rachel came demanding Alice vacate the house Steve built for her). I think having Rachel being more vengeful/aggressive after getting amnesia would have been interesting to explore since she didn't recall who Mac was, the person to help her evolve into the woman she was by 1985 would have been interesting to have explored. The twist being that Alice wasn't the same young ingenure anymore, but a confident doctor that wouldn't let Rachel bulldoze her (which was more fitting of the 1967-1971 era.. where Alice was sarcastic, confident and would put Rachel in her place). I wouldn't have Rachel/Alice fighting over Mac... but I would have had it be over Jamie. Jamie could have been confused and disillusioned with his mother not acting like his mother.. and would turn to Alice for advice/guidance.. while Alice would look at Jamie as the son she never had with Steve (thus bringing up the whole miscarriage and Rachel's cruel reminders that she had given Steve the son that Alice couldn't). I could have seen this new element spanning a long time.. and we could also have Rachel gradually regaining her memory.. and slowly start to reconcile the young nasty Rachel, the mature Rachel, and the Rachel she was when she had amnesia. I do recall the first months of Harney playing Alice.. that Rachel/Alice weren't close.. or even interacting with one another much. There was a mention of a library/building built in Steve's honor that Rachel opted not to attend because she didn't want to things harder on Alice.. and I think I recall when Sally's grandmother came around wanting custody.. that Rachel sided with her/Ray over Alice.. but other than that.. no clear mention that the two crossed paths. I also could buy Alice being more cool/aloof after losing Steve and never getting close to another man again due to not wanting to experience the pain of losing another man she loved. Alice always did retreat and become almost cool/aloof whenever love/intimacy came into her life (in my opinion due to all the drama surrounding Pat and her bf, the abortion, and Pat killing the guy... I'm sure that deep down Alice closed herself off of love/emotion in response to seeing all the stuff Pat went through... which explained why Alice was slow to warm to Steve and why Rachel was able to get Steve into bed).

Not sure if posted before.. but here is a link from when the show celebrated their 9000th episode, along with a brief interview with Pam Long detailing her plans. http://articles.latimes.com/1986-06-26/entertainment/ca-21528_1_love-story NEW YORK — When you're the longest-running daytime soap opera on television, you just have to kick up your heels every now and then, and that's what the cast and crew of "Search for Tomorrow," which premiered on Sept. 3, 1951, did last week. To celebrate the taping of the show's 9,000th episode, there was a champagne reception at the Manhattan studio where the soap is taped daily. In September, "Search for Tomorrow" will be celebrating its 35th anniversary--and another celebration bash is anxiously awaited. In the meantime, what's in store for the show's story lines? New executive story consultant Pamela K. Long (she joined the show last month) has lots of ideas that she hopes will keep the audience glued to their couches. "I intend to utilize all of our existing characters," said Long. "We're not bringing on anybody new right away and we don't have any big plans to get rid of anybody. I like the current characters. In my mind, Jo and Stu (played by Mary Stuart and Larry Haines) are the backbone of the show. Their friendship has endured since the show debuted. "The McCleary brothers, Cagney (Matthew Ashford), Quinn (Jeffrey Meek) and Hogan (David Forsyth), really sparked my imagination and made me want to get involved with 'Search for Tomorrow.' I think the McClearys and their women are the lifeblood of the show because their connections cross through all the story lines." Known for her Gothic-style stories from her previous writing work on "Guiding Light" and "Texas," Long said she has a different style in mind for "Search for Tomorrow." "I intend to bring a reality to my storytelling on 'SFT,' which is a result of my own personal growth. I'm not interested in wild, outlandish, fantasy-type stories. People and their relationships are more fascinating to me." Some of the story lines she will be developing over the next few months, along with that of the McCleary brothers, will include a torrid love triangle between Patti (Jacqueline Schultz), Liza (Louan Gideon) and Hogan; there will be a hot new love story between Quinn and Evie (who is now played by Joanna Going) which Long hopes "will rival the love story of Bo and Hope Brady (Peter Reckell and Kristian Alfonso) on 'Days of Our Lives."' Also in the works is a steamy love story between Sunny (Marcia McCabe) and Bela (Lee Godart) that will exemplify the light and dark forces of love. Comments "Search for Tomorrow" executive producer David Lawrence, who joined the show last March: "I'm very happy to have joined a company that's achieved such an amazing record. I look forward to building onto the show's achievements. "We took a long, hard look at our show to determine what we had that's really unique," Lawrence continued. "In addition to all the values that have kept the show on the air for nearly 35 years, it seems apparent that a major strength is the fact that we have the three attractive, charismatic McCleary brothers, and so for a period of time we will be focusing our major stories on their strengths and conflicts. We've also created a new opening for the show, which now includes clips of all of our performers."

That's the theme music from Friday the 13th part 3

I actually liked her wardrobe in the 84/85 return.. and I think it was done to age the character because Sally had been aged.. if that makes sense. Plus, didn't JC have that short haircut when she was on OLTL? Her wardrobe and hair were much better in her 1989 visits..imho. It is a shame that she retired, because I would have loved to have seen audiences reactions when she had the short dark hair that we saw during that Soaps 50th anniversary special that aired in the mid 90s.

@vetsoapfan I knew something was up with how Courtney was dismissed a few months after Swyer/Reinholt had been dismisssed....and that explanation answers it. I could see why she had an issue with what Lemay was planning to do. The Alice of 1969 who dumped Steve after finding out he was the father of Rachel's unborn baby, and worked her through nursing school and had a life/career of her own.. wouldn't be so fragile. I agreed with her instincts (the same as mine) that Alice wouldn't fall apart because she had Sally and had to be a strong influence for her. Did Alice act all weak and fragile when Harney took over? I seem to recall her Alice was colder and not as warm/sarcastic as Courtney's Alice. I guess we can all say that we are blessed to have her year return in the mid 80s to show that she was a good actress and was playing a stronger/confident Alice again. I even thought she had good acting instincts with how under-stated she was during the Rachel Amnesia story where she was trying to remain professional.

I think the show would have been fine if Courtney hadn't been fired.. She had started as a teenager and had grown into an adult that had been handed some hard knocks, and by 1975.. she would have dealt with the loss of both her mother and husband within a short amount of time.. and her trying to make a way for herself and her newly adopted daughter Sally would have been a wonderful story to have seen unfold. Alice wouldn't have a breakdown, but keep things going for the sake of Sally.. and I think the audience would have enjoyed the journey the character went on trying to forge a new start and identity outside of Steve.. and outside of her former tense relationship with Rachel. It's a shame because I think Alice and Rachel could have both existed in their own stories.. and interacted at functions where both were cordial/friendly with a hint of tension existing still between them. The show kind of played on that from 1984/5 where they had their own stories/lives.. and would cross paths and be friendly.. yet there was always a tension that existed between them.

@vetsoapfan I think in his own way, Lemay had to admit he was wrong about firing Jacqueline Courtney... but couldn't outright say he was wrong except to say that she wasn't a strong actress.. but was a charismatic actress.. and that Susan Harney was a strong actress, but lacked charisma. I do know that my mom (and my grandfather especially) were die hard AW fans.. and Alice/Steve/Rachel.. later Rachel/Iris/Mac were memorable stories. I often think it was odd the timing in which they fired Courtney because she lasted a few months longer than the other two actors fired.. and in fact, was given some interesting/meaty material to act... being a mother to a suddenly orphaned child and becoming a widow all around the same time. I bet had Courtney stayed around, Alice would have had the same focus and attention at Mac/Rachel/Iris had.. in fact.. i could have envisioned a Ray/Olive/Alice situation to rival that of Mac/Rachel/Iris. And her brief return in 1984-85 showed how strong and likable she was as an actress plus her brief visits in 1989. Speaking of which, still think it was a mistake to fire BP as Pat in early 1982 when she still had a lot of potential as a character.. even her brief return in 1989 showed that the character had some fire in her still. Shame really.

I'm just surprised at how out of date Marland's 1977 Doctor's is vs Lakin's 1967 version. It seems too conservative and by the numbers, but I guess that could be on account of the fact that he was working on a Proctor and Gamble soap that was more conservative than The Doctors was (I can't believe that a matter of months earlier that there was an episode where Paul was giving a speech to Stacy about how women are the true pillars of strength, but never are given the credit for it.. and you contrasted this speech that he gave to manipulate Stacy to do his bidding with Mike/Toni/Maggie where Mike was falling apart while Maggie/Toni were the pillar of strengths telling him to grow up).... and now we are stuck with Steve basically given no blame while Ann/Carolee will be made to suffer (still loved that final episode where Carolee gave Steve hell and that she had nothing to be sorry for because she sadly turned out to be correct about him and Ann).

talented or not... AW's loss became OLTL's gain since Courtney and to lesser account that actor playing Steve helped OLTL with a ratings increase... even Courtney's brief return to AW in the mid 80s helped bump the ratings up a bit. In any work place conflict, everyone shares blame.... and I think Lemay's ego actually did in the show in the long run. The Matthews family was to AW what the Hughes family was to ATWT and the Bauer family was to GL... the tentpole family. When the Frames/Snyders/Lewis families took center stage at the expense of those tentpole families.. ratings fell.

I had heard a rumor that she was intended to be paired with Mike (the interracial relationship rumor).. but that it was abandoned and the show opted to pursue Mike/Sara instead.

I've always wondered... were Robert/Anna really that popular of a couple? I know when I was a kid back in 1991, Soap Opera Digest were running stories about how the couple reunited and were married in a nice elegant wedding in the summer of 1991 that Faison tried to crash. However, I've always believe that the two were just thrown together due to the writers not knowing what to do with them vs the reuniting and wedding being organic. If I can recall, wasn't Robert more popular with Holly (I know my mom was pro Robert/Holly in the 80s with Anna as a potential spoiler)... and his pairings with Cheryl/Katherine were more embraced than any with Anna. And of course, Anna/Duke were the tortured couple you were rooting for to get together with Robert as an early spoiler than Olivia being a more dangerous spoiler. Am I off base in this?

If Roger Thorpe could have a place in Springfield with all the stuff he pulled, than I certainly think Annie Dutton could have had a place. I actually think Marj dusay shouldn't have played Alex. I would have had her come on claiming to be Alan's wife even providing a marriage certificate and explaining she married him while in prison thinking he would be in there for years. Her function the first few years would have been the same, and they still could have had Annie in the story.. and even had Amanda (written in character) being the peacemaker.. and having her come on orders from Alex (who has started a new life overseas). And maybe down the line when enough time passed, bought back Alex played by another actress that fit closer to the core of the character.

Edmund was better as a short term character (like it was intended originally I believe) than a character kept on for years. I was watching some spring 1997 episodes.. and I think this was the final time I could safely say this was GL of old. It's a shame that by early 1998, the show was off course again and never really corrected course except for occasionally glimmers of hope like in 2002. I often wonder had Cynthia Watros opted to stay on past early 1998 if the show would have moved Annie completely out of the Josh/Reva orbit or not? Sonni was successfully moved out of their orbit in the last months of her stint in 1989, plus Eve Guthrie also function outside the Nick/Mindy sphere her last several months of her stint in 1994/5.. so I could have safely bet that Annie could have functioned quite well in other spheres as well.

That makes sense about the recasting of Wendy since the original Wendy was sweeter and warmer than this Wendy is portraying so far. Plus, we had hints that Marland was slanting toward a Wendy/Eleanor/Luke triangle with Eleanor being insecure over Luke thinking Wendy was beautiful. From what I recall reading, a triangle doesn't end up happening and I'm not sure if it was due to a writer change... or audiences didn't warm to this story.

The one positive of the 1988 strike...the Laura stalking story wrapped quickly.

I've heard Marland say he didnt know much about pacing, etc when he first started..and dragged both of those stories out longer than they were supposed to be. I'm also mystified at how there is almost a 180 in regards to the women characters. Penny is a stepford wife (the old penny would have taken that money to go back to school herself without telling Jerry), Nola lost brain cells, carolee admitting she wanted to go back to Steve before she was mugged, MJ losing her quirkiness, and Maggie becoming a shrew. I was amazed Althea was made acting chief of staff..though I was hoping for more Paul vs Althea power plays (pollack's would have done that for sure). And Sarah saying Nola was wrong for not being Jason's plaything !?!?! It's a shame that he used this show to learn how to head write...the show was in a shaky place at this time..and the show needed a proven talent to turn it around.

Funny you should mention that.. one year ( i think it was 2011).. they opted not to do the horton Christmas ornament scene preferring to hang the ornaments in the new Horton Town Square... fans were livid and the tradition was restored the next year. I still recall when after Alice Horton passed away, the show was going to get rid of the set because it was designed back when shows had budgets and it was too costly to keep.. fans were livid over that announcement.. a few months later, Jennifer came back to the show full time and moved into the house thus the set was saved (or redesigned so it could fit without costing too much).

Brandi was never needes...Kim, on the other hand, hell yeah. Sorry kyle..you're always be over shadowed...1st by Kim, than camille and finally lisa. Sucks to be without charisma.

@vetsoapfan Was that the episode you had wished was on youtube awhile? The 35th anniversary episode? I have to admit I really enjoyed watching the episode and thought the show crafted a great 35th anniversary featuring the two tent pole characters Stu and Jo. For a 30 minute episode, I think the show did well with paying tribute to the show and it's two tentpole characters... which baffles my mind why modern day soaps can't see fit to do a worthy anniversary episode in a 60 minute time slot. There wasn't any writer credits at the end of that episode.. was this before, or after, Pam Long/Addie Walsh took over as head-writers of the show? It has their touches since they were strong writing friendships between characters.

Their 35th Anniversary episode... a few months later, they would end

I do think that Marland has finally settled down in his role as head-writer.. and finally is moving the show forward. He also seems to have finally quickened the pace a bit with having Maggie cheat on Matt with the new guy after only a month or so of knowing him. And poor Greta is neglected and acting like the adult for once.