34 minutes ago, j swift said:

I wonder in the relative span of John's fictional life how long his bad guy period could've been?

He's lived in Salem (or has been with Marlena abroad) since 1985.  I've always had the sense that Forrest Alamain was an adult when he left his family.  And it takes some time to study as a priest.

So, between then and the time he became the Pawn, he seems to have really packed in a ton of stuff.

He was bought off from the Alamains as a child by his own father (not DVD-the last dad) and sent to an assassin school very young.  It's probably better to read a wiki about it because it's super confusing, but Forrest Alamain was presumed dead as a young child.  Once he was a "the best soldier" he got sold to Stefano.  Victor "acquires" John in some sort of gambling situation. So I would assume John was up to bad things as a teen at least and probably came to town in his early to mid 30's?  I think John was described in his mid 30's when he came on the scene, but Drake was younger than that.

53 minutes ago, j swift said:

I've always had the sense that Forrest Alamain was an adult when he left his family.

Hmm, never thought he was an adult at that point. 

The wiki neglects his time as a priest or a jewel thief.  So, I don't know if that's been retconned out of John's history, or if we should factor those times in between when Forrest had his swimming accident and 1985?

9 minutes ago, j swift said:

The wiki neglects his time as a priest or a jewel thief.  So, I don't know if that's been retconned out of John's history, or if we should factor those times in between when Forrest had his swimming accident and 1985?

Well, with the retcons I don't believe he was actually either of those things.  He pretended to be a priest with Princess Gina and Danielle was actually Romulus and the jewel thief.

I believe Gina and John stole art.  And John was never an ordained Priest.  Just a fake one that made people feel safer with him or something so he could steal paintings. 

The wikipedia seems to be the most accurate from my memory, but as someone who has seen 99% of John's storylines I am not sure if I could even explain it without mistakes either.

29 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Hmm, never thought he was an adult at that point. 

Because he wasn't.  The Alamain family was paid off by Yo Ling and Petrov to fake Forrest Alamain's drowning in a pool as a child.  Yo Ling went all rogue and founded an assassins academy in China and brings his 'son' John into it.  A. Martinez was involved in this whole story debacle too.  Forrest Alamain is John, so to speak.  Forrest Alamain wasn't an Alamain by blood, but he was the same child if that makes sense.  His paternity has changed, but that basic part of the story didn't.  The Dick Van Dyke rewrite doesn't really change much of anything as far as backstory.   John's dad wasn't evil Yo Ling, but nice guy DVD instead and Yo Ling stole his dog tags and son.

35 minutes ago, j swift said:

The wiki neglects his time as a priest or a jewel thief.  So, I don't know if that's been retconned out of John's history, or if we should factor those times in between when Forrest had his swimming accident and 1985?

This one https://daysofourlives.fandom.com/wiki/John_Black 

mentions international criminal 

6 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Because he wasn't.  The Alamain family was paid off by Yo Ling and Petrov to fake Forrest Alamain's drowning in a pool as a child.  Yo Ling went all rogue and founded an assassins academy in China and brings his 'son' John into it.  A. Martinez was involved in this whole story debacle too.  Forrest Alamain is John, so to speak.  Forrest Alamain wasn't an Alamain by blood, but he was the same child if that makes sense.  His paternity has changed, but that basic part of the story didn't.  The Dick Van Dyke rewrite doesn't really change much of anything as far as backstory.   John's dad wasn't evil Yo Ling, but nice guy DVD instead and Yo Ling stole his dog tags and son.

Thanks! By God, I have nailed some of this! And, I agree that the DVD Robichaux information was just correcting misidentification. (Although I hate even using a word with identity in it.)

Oh, yeah, a nitpik from hell, it's A Martinez, the letter A, not an abbreviation. I know, makes no sense. But names are names. 

Edited March 2, 20241 yr by Contessa Donatella

5 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

This one https://daysofourlives.fandom.com/wiki/John_Black 

mentions international criminal 

Thanks! By God, I have nailed some of this! And, I agree that the DVD Robichaux information was just correcting misidentification. (Although I hate even using a word with identity in it.)

I think international criminal implies his stuff with Gina.

Danielle/Romulus was a fraud.  John had nothing to do with those crimes.

I can't say Gina/John never stole jewelry, but the story from 1992 with Danielle doesn't intertwine with any of the stuff that happened with Stefano/Gina/Hope/John.  

John was never an actual priest.  We thought he was.  It was retconned and the actual power of his love saved Marlena.  He was impersonating a priest all along.

This belongs more in the Classic Days thread, but I think I can answer most questions about it.

As far as I can say, the Yo Ling backstory still stands.  The paternity just changed.  

32 minutes ago, carolineg said:

I think international criminal implies his stuff with Gina.

Danielle/Romulus was a fraud.  John had nothing to do with those crimes.

I can't say Gina/John never stole jewelry, but the story from 1992 with Danielle doesn't intertwine with any of the stuff that happened with Stefano/Gina/Hope/John.  

John was never an actual priest.  We thought he was.  It was retconned and the actual power of his love saved Marlena.  He was impersonating a priest all along.

This belongs more in the Classic Days thread, but I think I can answer most questions about it.

As far as I can say, the Yo Ling backstory still stands.  The paternity just changed.  

I thought perhaps that was why it said "criminal" instead of "jewel thief." I do have it firmly in my head that she was lying, actually she was a con woman, wasn't she? She was attempting to scam him in a big way. 

Maybe we'll be forgiven because it's too late to move this now. And, most has been covered, thanks to you, I tip my hat, not for the first time, either! 

8 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

I thought perhaps that was why it said "criminal" instead of "jewel thief." I do have it firmly in my head that she was lying, actually she was a con woman, wasn't she? She was attempting to scam him in a big way. 

Maybe we'll be forgiven because it's too late to move this now. And, most has been covered, thanks to you, I tip my hat, not for the first time, either! 

The Danielle story might be entirely retconned to be honest.  She was John's former lover, but not married to her as she said.  She knew John with a different face and tracked him down, but we know now John always looked like John.  In the end, John let her get away and Danielle said they really once were in love, but she was Romulus and they broke up back in the day because John found out.  She just wanted to get back with him because she wanted to steal more jewels with him I think. Or maybe the Alamain money, maybe both?  It was such a weird transitional story that was really never brought up again so I don't really know where it stands.  I honestly don't think I have heard anyone on the show mention it since 1992.

John Black FAQ as of 1999 (Before many of the retcons)
compilation from Dustin Cushman's old page:

Page one
https://web.archive.org/web/20051201023222/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq.html

Page two
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110090232/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq2.html

Page three
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110084629/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq3.html

2 minutes ago, janea4old said:

John Black FAQ as of 1999 (Before many of the retcons)
compilation from Dustin Cushman's old page:

Page one
https://web.archive.org/web/20051201023222/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq.html

Page two
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110090232/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq2.html

Page three
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110084629/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq3.html

WOW, What a blast from the past hearing Dustin's name mentioned!! Also, thanks for the links. 

9 minutes ago, janea4old said:

John Black FAQ as of 1999 (Before many of the retcons)
compilation from Dustin Cushman's old page:

Page one
https://web.archive.org/web/20051201023222/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq.html

Page two
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110090232/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq2.html

Page three
https://web.archive.org/web/20060110084629/http://www.soapoperafan.com:80/days/misc/johnfaq3.html

Thanks for the links!  Even in the rundown it's hard to decipher what Danielle's motives and endgame were and I find the story so boring and silly I don't want to re watch lol.

12 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

WOW, What a blast from the past hearing Dustin's name mentioned!!

Dustin Cushman's DAYS website was great.
He's still around.  He doesn't run a Days site anymore.
But he writes great daily GeneralHospital recaps for soaps.sheknows.com 
I don't want to go off topic by saying more about that here.

I posted his old John Black FAQ only because that was thoroughly researched and whatever it says there was *true as of May 1999*,
and and it relates to the current Pawn storyline.

Edited March 2, 20241 yr by janea4old

Just now, janea4old said:

Dustin Cushman's website was great.
He's still around.  He doesn't run a Days site anymore.
But he writes great daily GH recaps for soaps.sheknows.com 
I don't want to go off topic by saying more about that here.

I posted his old John Black FAQ only because that was thoroughly researched and whatever it says there was *true as of May 1999*,
and and it relates to the current Pawn storyline.

Was SO great! And, if it was on his site it was bonafide! I love that some of it exists in archived cyber space. I frankly LOVE archived cyber space myself. 

I think John’s backstory is finally complete, but the Konstantin storyline rewrites part of it. The Pawn never worked for Victor as an assassin. It would make more sense if the writers had tied it to Stefano somehow, instead of Steve and Victor.