Members felicity22 Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 I said the exact same thing on twitter. Loved those scenes & feel Angie is one of the only people to truly see through David. His emotions with her are unflitered and seem very real. And as you said, those two actors together are absolutely golden. As for JR, I'm completely disgusted with what they've done to him. And over what? Marissa? A woman he never even truly loved. Just senseless decimation of his character to smithereens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skin Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 I thought I saw a shimmer of a soul within him when Dixie brought up Babe in the last few seconds of the show. Hope they go with that for at least a beat or so before JR continues on his path of self-destruction. I still don't get his plan though. He has no money. He has no company to funnel money threw, he has no house, he has no assets to liquidate (other wise why not use them to pay off debts for the house, etc?) where is he hoping to go and more over what is he hoping to do if by some miracle he gets AJ out of the country? They would have nothing to live off of and they would have no where to stay. I'm thinking Babe might end up being a hallucination for JR at this point but why have Dixie remember her? Why have David imply that Babe was one of his patients? Why have Krystal moon over her for the last month? It just doesn't make sense. Maybe it's the PP rewrite? I admit it was nice to see Dixie's flabbergasted expression in light of JR's homophobia. Like what the hell did he just say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 Amen, I guess I like boring AMC lol. And Dragonflies you're wrong--JR has been written out of the will before, but he wasn't when he was given co management of Chandler Ent etc. You have a tendency to remember things wrong when you want to point out how bad LB is of a writer. And they aknowledged this... Yes it's a bit rushed as everything is now but of all the things to cry foul on, when they themselves try to explain it... Nah he was doing a general rant--that EVERYONE is against him. "They took my company, they took my house, they want to take JR away from me". It's a general they. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 I dunno I think it's been building for a VERY long time and see his overeaction and blaming everyone else precisely in character. He's hit rock bottom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Antoyne Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 I personally am loving JR's complete break from reality. It's still not really clicked to me that there are six episodes left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JaneAusten Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 IA. I don't think anything we are seeing with JR is at all unrealistic. One of the things thats been consistant in this storyline is JR's perpensity for blaming everyone else for his misfortunes. Thats very true to how he has been written for many many years. He's also probably the only character I could truly see snap. He's a very passionate character and emotion has ruled JR"s decision making for years. I don't find his wanting to take everything and run at all untrue to who he is. Of course he's not thinking but since when has JR been a methodical plotter like David is.Look at the disaster making that sex tape turned out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members marceline Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 The interactions between David/Angie and Jesse/Liza were wonderful. *Sigh* so much missed opportunity. VI and DM need to do a play or something because they work together magnificently. And I really like the way JL and DW played off each other. You'd never guess that she wasn't the Liza who had played him so dirty all those years ago. I'm getting the feeling that we're going to get the resurrection of David in tandem with the final destruction of JR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members alwaysAMC Posted September 16, 2011 Members Share Posted September 16, 2011 Totally agree about the Liza/Jesse and David/Angie scenes - GOLDEN! I also love that Madison/Scott are getting back together - they are so cute and refreshing - so happy they are getting a happy ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members felicity22 Posted September 17, 2011 Members Share Posted September 17, 2011 I could see him doing it over Annie, if they had gone that way. Blaming Marissa for trying to take AJ away, which forced his hand in playing nice to her -- ultimately making Annie snap because of jealousy. But then the writers decided to make Annie/JR a figment of our imagination. So a woman whom he'd been chasing for over a year, a woman whom he couldn't get out of his head or heart, he forgot about in a nanosecond. But a woman like Marissa, whom he couldn't stay interested in while married -- he completely goes off the deep end for? I just don't buy it! To me, it's not a good enough reason to start drinking, go off on homophobic rants, forget about running Chandler, forget his mortgage payments, forget about being a good father. Because JR has always been a good father -- AJ was his number one priority. And now we're supposed to believe that he planted a sex tape on AJ's computer without thinking about the ramifications if AJ should find it? Sorry, that's just stupid writing. This descent into serial killer mode is just too fast for me & doesn't make real sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted September 17, 2011 Members Share Posted September 17, 2011 But it's not about Marissa. It's been building for ages--and he's someone who falls on crutches--it's an extreme example of an addicts behaviour. I don't even buy he that loved Marissa so much, he just thought that if he had her back it would solve his problems--but it probably wouldn't have and would have led to something else... The gay slurs, and everything else are him hitting rock bottom, seeing that nothing in his life has worked his way, according to him, and actingout. This is less crazy then when he would randomly scheme to kill people he loved and jump out windows--it's completely realistic I think. At last it is to me, everyone has their own take, but it's something I've seen in my line of volunteer work a lot (again, albeit in a much more exagerated fashion). I don't think anyone should take what he says as literal, it's how it's all wrapped up together in his brain--as him never winning, etc--the (ridiculously fast) foreclosure of his house, loss of his business, everything combines.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Wizzerkat Posted September 17, 2011 Members Share Posted September 17, 2011 Not a lot in JR's life HASN'T worked his way. He has been a trophy in the contest between Adam and Tad/Dixie for his soul since the day he was born. It isn't about JR, it's about JR acting as either Adam(become essentially his clone) or Dixie/Tad(be anything that isn't Adam) wants him to act. He wasn't valuable unless he was doing what they envisioned to be right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted September 17, 2011 Members Share Posted September 17, 2011 Exactly which has shown largely why he acts this way. No character, especially in the current state of soaps, has a clear psychological profile, but I think all of this is completely in his--especially if you add in the over the top drug addiction when he was young during the awful Passanante years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Skin Posted September 17, 2011 Members Share Posted September 17, 2011 I don't see what Annie has to do with any of this. I would say she is an anomaly at this point. Even Annie herself doesn't seem to care about JR from her brief appearance back on the show this summer. She is insignificant and she never mattered to him outside of the lust of forbidden fruit and getting a chance to one up his cousin Scott. Half the attraction between that pairing was the fact that they got to make fools out of their respective spouses. Once they made it official and got together the whole thing unraveled quite quickly because there was no bad dirty wrong right feeling to spike their adrenaline rush. It's obvious he didn't love her, or if he did not deeply enough for it to mean anything substantial to him. I don't even think this current descent into chaos is necessarily about Marissa so much as it's about the fact that so many things are not going JR's way so to speak. He's not getting what he wants so he is throwing a temper tantrum over it. JR always does this. It's nothing new to his character something bad happens to him (his parents cheat on eachother/divorce, Babe lies to him, Marissa tells him that she isn't in love with him anymore, Jaime takes his prospective girlfriend, Dixie comes back from the dead, etc.) and then he is unable to deal with things like an actual adult would and he goes off the deep end. That's a classic JR response to personal strife and conflict. He has no clue on how to deal with personal problems and that's why he ends up striking out at other people. It's not so much about Marissa herself as it's about JR not getting what he wanted. He wanted his toy wife, his child and the picturesque stepford family and he thought that he could do that with Marissa. Marissa is a lesbian so that can't happen and now he is angry. When JR is angry he strikes out. Now that he can't have want he wants, he is going to destroy everything in his path because he didn't get what he wished for. I think it's as simple as that. As far as his character motivation. As it's been said above JR has pretty much gotten everything that he wanted for the most part. There haven't been a lot of times when anyone has said no to him and forced him to do something he didn't like. JR isn't a mature person or character. He is a child himself, it doesn't surprise me at all that he wouldn't think about how his actions affect other people. We've seen that ill judgement concerning JR so many times. He nearly killed Babe and Kendell due to his irrational actions. His son nearly died under his watch due to parental neglect. His pig headed thinking landed Bianca in a coma and nearly killed Amanda while he was driving drunk as well. JR may care for his child and may even love him but it's clear that he doesn't have a clue what is best for him. Why? Because he has no idea what is best for himself. He doesn't think logically at all and never sees that every time he hurts someone he is hurting numerous people even his son. Attacking Marissa and Bianca with the sex tape, driving drunk, languishing in an alcoholic haze for days/weeks, pissing away his fiscal stability, etc. proves that. That being said I do think that the show is going over board if they are attempting to make him a mass serial killer. I don't think JR was ever that screwed up even at his worst. I still don't really buy this. Especially not when you take in the picture of Dixie circa 96' and Tad around the same time period playing house with each other. I always felt the Chandler side of JR felt hollow because there was no reason for that aspect of his character to resonate with him. It would have made more sense for the character to be like Dixie with shades of Tad then for him to be this bizarrely misshapen Adam clone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members felicity22 Posted September 18, 2011 Members Share Posted September 18, 2011 Yes, the way they ended JR/Annie, one would think that he never loved her as he was made to forget her instantaneously. They weren't even allowed to mention each other's names when Annie came back this time around. But that is NOT the way Annie/JR were written initially. There are plenty of JR/Annie fans around who can attest to the fact that the way JY/MCE portrayed the characters, there was way more than a strong physical attraction there (not to mention the fact that they were obsessed with each other for a year). There was a true connection and love. Even the way JR reacted when they took Annie away shows there was definite true feelings there, based on love, not just lust. But the DK/DS crap writing was schizophrenic after MCE announced her departure & they wrote out Annie in an abysmal way. Just like I think they're unfortunately going to write out JR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members marceline Posted September 18, 2011 Members Share Posted September 18, 2011 I'm no big Jannie fan but I think people need to accept that this is a case of a show simply choosing to disregard and disrespect what we saw with our own eyes. The memory of JR/Annie was too threatening to the current canvas so they chose to just pretend it never happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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