17 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks @Maxim

Supposedly there were backstage issues with Sarah so that may also be why the material is a mess. 

I'd never watched that Dorian scene. Dorian in therapy is a no-brainer but not that common. It's very Dorian that the therapy does not really help her but leads her to redirect her obsessions and anger to another target. Doug Marland therapy this ain't.

I love how Elaine Princi played that last moment. So big but also fitting.

I agree. Elaine really knows when to make it "big". I would cringe if it was someone else acting like this, but when it's Dorian... it's just part of the beauty. She has some really nuanced, understated moments too... especially with Jason.   

16 hours ago, mar4331 said:

@Maximlove your commentary. Looking forward to your opinion on Bo with Nora. Love them together!

Thank you! I'm happy that you like them. 😊 And I look forward to meeting Nora too. I've heard from other fans that she's very captivating. 

5 hours ago, Vee said:

I am finally getting back to October '91 and going straight through, so I'll be behind whatever else is being discussed here but will likely offer my tedious meanderings if they still appeal to people.

YES, PLEASE!

9 hours ago, Vee said:

I am finally getting back to October '91 and going straight through, so I'll be behind whatever else is being discussed here but will likely offer my tedious meanderings if they still appeal to people.

There can't be enough talk about this time period as it's so unique to the show and to soaps in general. I always enjoy reading your analyses.

This is going to be very embarrassing to admit, but I always thought this Dorian was just a younger Robin Strasser when I've seen clips. If y'all hadn't talked about an Elaine Princi, I would have never known. They look so similar!  What great casting. 

You're all going to make me add this era of OLTL to my future soap opera watching list. As a kid, I never had time to follow OLTL year-round, only during the summers if I were home and had time after AMC. I distinctly remember loving Tina and Cain (likely bc I had a young crush on Cain), and I definitely remember Max and Luna (again, probably same reason with Max haha).  Then, my next phase of OLTL memories starts with the Vega family.

2 hours ago, alwaysAMC said:

This is going to be very embarrassing to admit, but I always thought this Dorian was just a younger Robin Strasser when I've seen clips. If y'all hadn't talked about an Elaine Princi, I would have never known. They look so similar!  What great casting. 

Princi is great but she was indeed a very deliberate ringer Rauch hired to get at Robin when she refused to return in '90. She claimed he told her the audience would forget all about her. That's not quite what happened but Princi did very well, especially after Gottlieb and Malone came in. (I don't think the rocky adjustment period for Robin in '93 was quite as rocky as people claim, but I'm biased as I came in around the same time she first came back.)

It's the Nancy Pinkerton era we've recently unearthed from the '70s you should check out - what a fascinating iteration of the character.

Edited July 11Jul 11 by Vee

12 minutes ago, Vee said:

Princi is great but she was indeed a very deliberate ringer Rauch hired to get at Robin when she refused to return in '90. She claimed he told her the audience would forget all about her. That's not quite what happened but Princi did very well, especially after Gottlieb and Malone came in. (I don't think the rocky adjustment period for Robin in '93 was quite as rocky as people claim, but I'm biased as I came in around the same time she first came back.)

It's the Nancy Pinkerton era we've recently unearthed from the '70s you should check out - what a fascinating iteration of the character.

Very interesting background, thank you!  

And yes, give your recaps/thoughts of your watch, always love to read!

Rauch was an a-hole in the way he hired Princi. However, Princi was fantastic. The changeover from Princi to Strasser was indeed very rocky. It did not go over well in the soap press. Logan wrote about it in his column more than once as he praised Princi and thought that Strasser's return was (in his words) "a major disappointment."  Like most things (railing against Rauch/calling for JFP to be fired from GL), he would walk back those comments later when he would need an interview. As a viewer, I resented Strasser and the way she came back to the show. I think Strasser's second return (never saw her first tenure) was marked by overacting especially when she first returned. I think it got worse under Carlivati because he encouraged the overacting, but I know a lot of people like that version of Dorian so YMMV. 

I know it was rocky early in '93, I just don't remember it being some kind of major catastrophe with Robin being disliked by a majority of fans. The show also course-corrected fairly quickly over the next year, the whole Victor, etc. saga was huge and the early Emily Haynes nonsense was forgotten. That period being rough is no secret, but sometimes we substitute recent forum sentiment for past conventional wisdom. I don't think it's any shade at Princi to say that in the eyes of most people, Robin adjusted in time and so did the show.

It was Robin's final run on the show in the 2000s after coming back in '03 that was marred by her own fear of being fired/pushed out again. She overacted a ton (somewhat by her own admission) because per her own words she feared if she didn't go 200% the show would lose interest in her. I still always enjoyed her, but you could feel it onscreen and I missed what she was capable of when she was less traumatized. There was plenty of baroque story for Robin and Dorian in the '90s but it was never done with her yowling most of her lines or endlessly malapropping French, unlike the last years.

Edited July 11Jul 11 by Vee

1 hour ago, Vee said:

I know it was rocky early in '93, I just don't remember it being some kind of major catastrophe with Robin being disliked by a majority of fans. The show also course-corrected fairly quickly over the next year, the whole Victor, etc. saga was huge and the early Emily Haynes nonsense was forgotten. That period being rough is no secret, but sometimes we substitute recent forum sentiment for past conventional wisdom. I don't think it's any shade at Princi to say that in the eyes of most people, Robin adjusted in time and so did the show.

I think it's a YMMV situation. I think it was enough of a problem that it was written about in the soap magazines and in letters to the editor. I remember Strasser at some point talked about how difficult it was for her as well, but I don't remember where. Might have been on her hotline or on twitter possibly. 

I always try to look to Logan's columns, soap articles and books to get an idea of what the sentiment was at the time if possible (did this with JFP's GL as that elicits love/hate responses). As you point out, we may make things rosier/worse in our memories. In regards to Strasser, it was amusing that Strasser talked about Rauch using Princi as a weapon in an interview with Logan, but Logan kept silent about his praise for Princi and his criticism of Strasser.

RE: Dorian/Carlivati

She was not served by her writing or by Frons's intervention. I'm sympathetic to that. I think you're right in your assessment of why she was overacting a lot more. I also think her time dealing with JFP and everything that went down then contributed to that.

 

Edited July 11Jul 11 by chrisml

11 minutes ago, chrisml said:

She was not served by her writing or by Frons's intervention. I'm sympathetic to that. I think you're right in your assessment of why she was overacting a lot more. I also think her time dealing with JFP and everything that went down then contributed to that.

It's true. But she's also outright said so herself in her hotline, on her social media, etc. - that she was horribly hurt by JFP pushing her out, and felt she had to come back and always be 'on' and pushing very hard onscreen to keep impressing the show and keep her place, lest she 'bore' the control room. I sympathize with her feelings, but it wasn't conducive to her quality of work. That did start long before Carlivati, it was there from the beginning when Michael Malone brought her back in early '03. Though it certainly got even broader later. Robin still did a lot of good work, but she was too often in a different, histrionic gear vs. the 90s for me. You could no longer depend on her to bring an emotional scene down to ground level. Certain partners helped her find that still, though: Pamela Payton-Wright as the renewed Addie who challenged Dorian's point of view about wanting Viki's life (and they should've had so much more of the sisters), Brittany Underwood who she had a wonderful rapport with, etc. Erika sometimes as well, not because Erika couldn't be subtle but because it was rare in the 2000s when the writing didn't demand Viki and Dorian still go at it hammer and tongs. And Robin and KDP are very close offscreen and on but their relationship ceased being a quiet one in the '90s.

And yes, Malone, Strasser, etc. also have made no secret of it being a hard adjustment early in 1993 and that the writers didn't know what to do with her in the beginning, that they'd simply had to deal with a prestige return brought upon them. They did correct once the big umbrella story settled, but Robin of course spent the next 30 years griping about that because she wanted to still be the one who killed Victor Lord even though she gave Malone the idea to retcon it lol. I am not disputing the soap press take at the time. I just know that within a year or two I never saw a hint of anything like that in the mags from fans, or on the online soap forums of the era where I was lurking while far, far too young. (And where actors like James DePaiva would knock around occasionally complaining about Max being domesticated, unaware then that the Internet is forever.)

It's been mentioned, but to her credit Robin has gone out of her way to say on Twitter that Elaine Princi was treated very unfairly by the show on her behalf.

Edited July 11Jul 11 by Vee

@Vee I think we're agreeing on almost everything. We're just quibbling about the degree of the rockiness of her return. I don't think there's a right answer. It definitely caused a ruckus and there was viewer/journalist blowback. The length and force of that blowback is personal I would imagine. For me, it was major because it was a main reason (along with the Toddification of OLTL) that I gave up on OLTL sometimes in 1994/95. If anything, the way Strasser was treated by the network, JFP and subsequent writing regimes made me more sympathetic to her as an actress but I don't know if I ever warmed to her as Dorian.

 

Up to June 2nd, 1992.

🍷

 

"Like a virgin... touched for the very first time."

Again, I don't have as much time, but I'm trying my best. I would love to binge-watch, but it's just not possible.

🔷

So what is going on right now?

🔷

Well, color me surprised, but Blair actually had her first time with Max Holden. I don't know how this will affect her future relationship with Asa, but I have my suspicions. I really doubt Blair-Max will last more than a few weeks at best. Blair is too driven and too determined to become rich and powerful to choose Max. Asa, realizing that Blair is slipping away, has been making preparations to buy her off - he is using her mother's guardianship to pressure her into marriage. Asa, Asa... Where is Renee to slap you now?

🔷

Speaking of slaps, the biggest one went to Cain Rogan who was FIRED AND THROWN out like a dirty dog on the street. What a divine karma! He did everything he could to break-up Asa and Renee's marriage and just when he succeeded, a little fox got into the den before he could. Blair Daimler is the new HBIC and not you, Rogan. You made a great mistake rushing to break-up Renee and Asa. Now all that you're left with are Tina's kisses. Yawn.

🔷

We are very close to discovering who killed Carlo. Sarah found a picture that depicted the agent called "Scarecrow" and Carlo together in a restaurant acting like they are related or best buddies. When she and Bo went to investigate in that particular restaurant, they found that this Scarecrow individual was seen with a strange woman with a British accent. We all know who that is, right - the not so paralyzed Julia Media aka the killer, if you ask me. 

🔷

We have a new family in town - Victoria's son Joey made a friend - this blond Billy boy... who looks kind of familiar. The were playing ball like they were 5 years old and talking about "girls", while Billy's mother and father were talking with Victoria about getting accepted in some private clubs. From their attitude, I got the impression... they like to discriminate people. Hmm. 

🔷

Oh, and I almost forgot. Cassie is probably going to get fired after violating the law multiple times for BO. What she did was stupid - first she stole documents and gave them to him and then she called him on the phone to warn him that they are going to be arresting him. You are not made for detective work, Cassie. Go back to the newspaper. 

Overall - 10 out of 10 - I'm excited that the storylines are finally moving ahead. 

Clip of the day -  Asa vs Cain - You're fired, bitch! 

 

20 hours ago, Vee said:

I know it was rocky early in '93, I just don't remember it being some kind of major catastrophe with Robin being disliked by a majority of fans.

IIRC, the issue wasn't with Elaine Princi being forced out and RS returning, per se, as it was with HOW Strasser was being asked to play Dorian now.  Even when she returned in 1991 or thereabouts, there were complaints that she was OTT and a marked contrast from her original run.  (I think it was Marlena Delacroix who complained that even Strasser's big, red locks were OTT, lol).  Again, though, it wasn't necessarily her fault - at least, I didn't think it was.  She was just playing what was written for her; and what was written for her wasn't anywhere near as subtle as what Sam Hall or Peggy O'Shea had written for her in the '80's.

Thanks @Maxim 

Another reminder of how quickly some of these stories go. And how much Cain is just sort of thrown into stories during his time on the canvas rather than necessarily feeling genuine, in spite of Chris Cousins' natural appeal.

I think they may have been better off having Max in Cain's role during this story, especially given Blair's involvement. He might not have gone after Renee, but that could have been tweaked.

On 7/12/2025 at 8:26 PM, DRW50 said:

Thanks @Maxim 

Another reminder of how quickly some of these stories go. And how much Cain is just sort of thrown into stories during his time on the canvas rather than necessarily feeling genuine, in spite of Chris Cousins' natural appeal.

I think they may have been better off having Max in Cain's role during this story, especially given Blair's involvement. He might not have gone after Renee, but that could have been tweaked.

Absolutely...  His Thomas Ripley meets Disney villain-act is just tiring at this point. It stopped being interesting half a year ago. And together with Tina aka the wannabe Bonnie and Clyde... they just don't work for me. I love the writing on the show, but some of the characters are clearly not thought-out in terms of vision. It seems like the writer is trying to build them up, find who they are... but is not succeeding. The saving grace is that... we have so much amazing stuff that all of the flops pale in comparison. It's literally 90 percent great and 10 perfect mess. Which is completely normal. OLTL 1992 continues to be one of the strongest soaps I've seen in my life. In some aspects, it gets better and better. I have currently seized watching anything else, because the other soaps can't compare with the style of writing and overall quality that I'm getting accustomed to. I can't play Bold after watching these episodes... OLTL 1992 really spoils you and makes you crave more and more quality storytelling. I have no idea how I'll be able to continue my classic Bold 2004 re-watch after this.