As The World Turns Discussion Thread

[Soapsuds]

Carole Demas didn't last long in the role because by 91 Lee Bryant was already playing Hannah.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CBKfyRwuFI

[DramatistDreamer]

Lee Bryant also played Lyla Montgomery briefly in the 80s.

 

 

I agree. She writes stories that have that "around the hearth" feel that so many P&G soaps were known for. 

Somehow though, soaps had the mistaken impression that they had to throw out pretty much all that they were known for (which was also the same element that made them successful and beloved) for something entirely different.

Edited February 24, 2017 by DramatistDreamer

[P.J.]

 

Wow...don't remember this guy at all. My guess would be that Tad's backstory was tweaked, and that guy didn't look like the high roller Tad was supposed to be.

 

Frost may not have been as "beloved" in the role of Betsy, but it wasn't because of her acting ability. I've loved her in her work since then. The only thing I really disliked about Betsy during that time was her relationship with Josh/Rod---and that had zero to do with her and everything to do with excusing a rapist and forcing everyone around Iva to make her accept him back into her life.

[DramatistDreamer]

I've stated this before but the entire Josh reformed man situation never sat right with me. It was as if everyone should overlook his rape of Iva because it was 'in the past', meanwhile Iva was left to 'deal with it' and struggle in silence.  On the one hand, it was interesting to see a show like ATWT deal with a character who had committed such a repulsive act in a way that doesn't isolate him or kill him off in the way that soaps traditionally did but as much as Marland may have believed the writing was sensitive to Iva's plight (and later, it was), at that time, it seemed to be written more from Josh's perspective, to make him look more sympathetic.

 

I thought Frost was really good in that role and Betsy was made to defend Josh in a way that looking back now, annoys me but the biggest problem that Betsy had at the time that Frost happened to be playing the role was the lack of romantic chemistry with most of her male counterparts. I don't blame that on Frost, I liked her as Betsy. I think the character was kind of in a romantic slump for most of her run. The writing wasn't really there for her.

ATWT had a lot of talent and many stories to choose to focus on and unfortunately some characters got lost in the shuffle and I believe that Betsy was one of those characters.

[P.J.]

I think the Josh character was an example of Marland retooling the character because he liked the portrayer so much. Fitchner's not exactly my cup of tea, but he acted his ass off in the role. Still, even with the intensive weight put on showing Josh "dealing with" his past, that the entire story sent a dangerous message about rape that was surprising coming from Marland.

 

Other than Josh, I can't even think of a serious relationship Frost had in the role. Runyeon left not long after she started, Bryce wasn't an option. She probably did get lost in the shuffle, somewhat. Part of it was probably also just the reluctance of the audience to move past Steve and Betsy in general.

[Soapsuds]

Just say it PJ. He is not attractive...LOL.  I agree he wasn't a hot actor but he was a great actor. His career has gone way past his ATWT time. He now appears on Mom....LOL. And he is pretty good at doing comedy too.

[P.J.]

But that just makes me sound vain and shallow....lol  

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   I meant more along the lines of he's always playing the "guy with an edge", and never anything I've seen him has an ounce of relatability. And for a while there, it seemed he was everywhere.

[DRW50]

 

She was also involved with Seth. 

 

One of the main problems was all her love interests were, like her, very serious. It's actually bizarre to realize her goofiest love interest was Josh, a rapist and child abuse victim. 

 

I think Marland had all these ideas of Lily's father and the conflict this would cause with Iva - it would also be the catalyst to reveal the secret everyone in Lily's had gone to great pains to keep to themselves. And then of course there was more story with Lily accepting him, which meant everyone else did as time passed. It could have been a more generic tale if not for the affair with Meg, which was lots of drama and passion that I'm not sure was originally going to be there without the chemistry between Finchtner and Jennifer Ashe. It's pretty explosive stuff for Marland's ATWT (I sometimes wonder how much of that was pushed further by the strike). It ended up being what defined Josh, even though it was mostly just in his last 5-6 months on the show. 

[NothinButAttitude]

Episode when a very pregnant Margo (with Adam) departs and goes into hiding:

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[Soapsuds]

No way would Margo have done that to Gregg Marx Tom....LOL   I am not sure but wasn't there flirtation with Hal and Margo when Gregg Marx was in the role of Tom?

[DramatistDreamer]

There was definitely a time when Margo, who angrily assumed that Tom and Barbara had had a one night stand, leaned on Hal. At first it seemed as if she was on the path to using Hal to get over Tom but even before it was revealed that Barbara lied and staged the "affair", Margo decided that she was still in love with Tom and decided to forgive him for the one night stand that they mistakenly thought he had. At this particular time, it appeared that Margo cared for Hal while Hal's feelings for Margo seemed more intense.

 

When Tom left and didn't return from D.C. (i.e. when Marx left the role), it seems clear that Marland decided to revisit Margo and Hal and intensify those feelings on both sides.

 

I agree that had Marx stayed in the role, there would be no need to revisit Hal and Margo. Most likely the conflict between Tom and Margo would've remained the miscarriage fallout and perhaps Tom working long hours as D.A. and Margo working long hours with Hal on the Stenbeck case, with awkward interactions between all three (given their history). Maybe there might've been a hint of closer bonds between Margo and Hal as Margo put distance between herself and Tom immediately after the miscarriage, which might have caused more friction between Tom and Hal regarding overstepped boundaries but I suspect Marland might have sent Margo and Tom to couples therapy (he was big into therapy and analysis) and they would've worked it out.

Had Marx stayed, I seriously doubt Marland would've written Margo and Hal having and affair, let alone a baby together (it wouldn't have been believeable), given the heat that HBS and GM had together (sexual orientation, be damned!).  

Marland must've known that Marx was leaving when he started to write the Margo/Hal affair. 

 

I do wonder whether Marland always intended for Tom to be recast? I know that the strike interfered with many things so the TL gets confused a little.

Edited February 27, 2017 by DramatistDreamer

[Soapsuds]

I know HBS handpicked SH for the role of Tom. I think it was a better triangle with Holmes in the role. HBS and BH did have chemistry.

[NothinButAttitude]

Was there even a huge backlash over the Margo/Hal affair with the audience? Do you think there would've been a huge backlash had GM remained in the role and Marland still had Margo have an affair? 

[DRW50]

 

I doubt it. Gregg was only in the role for two years and while HBS and Gregg had a lot more chemistry than she ever had with Scott Holmes, there was a ton of buildup to explain why Margo would stray (she thought he'd cheated on her, the miscarriage, his frequent absences, etc.). And Hal was her best friend, and Hendrickson always played the role very sympathetically and believably, which was one of the reasons he'd risen from bit player status in the first place. 

 

I don't think there was any big backlash, although I do wonder if people thought the whole running away thing was odd or silly (although they may have just said, "That's Margo for you" since the show didn't really take Margo completely away from her "kooky" persona until Ellen Dolan became so horribly dour). Of course it was mostly a device for HBS' maternity leave and her very nearly leaving the show, but it is somewhat odd to watch onscreen. 

Edited February 27, 2017 by DRW50

[P.J.]

 

God...seriously? SETH? I don't remember that at all.

 

I'm sure Marland played the beats of the story---and I'm sure he loved writing big, meaty, angsty stuff for Lisa Brown. It just continually skeeved me out, and giving Josh and Meg their HEA, with Iva forced to be a bridesmaid at their wedding was beyond the pale.