As The World Turns Discussion Thread

[Mitch]

Yea, I can see why they chose the Dobson's as they did a great job with "modernizing," GL...but they really stuck to the core and used the Bauers as a spring board to expand the canvas. The Dobson's really seemed to have it out for the Hughes family and I can't figure out why. Would love to read an interview with them talking about their time there. I think that Nancy would have been harder to write for then Bert, who, while being able to kick ass, was more warm and forgiving then Nancy. Its interesting that this enduring character that Irna created was kind of a hard ass, but had a loving forgiving side (i.e. take Lisa, who really did more to her family then any of the more suitable spouses for Bob, but Nancy stuck by her and even looked down her nose at more convential candidates for Bob) so much so that other matriarchs with more obvious negative sides were paterned on her, Lemay admits he wrote Aunt Liz to showcase some of the more negative aspects of Irna's matriachs, and I really think Phoebe had more in common with Nancy then sweet loving Grandma Martin did.) I always wonder if the Dobson's had a negative impression of ATWT from her parents, who created GH. I think that a lot of the producers and writers of other shows were always kind of jealous of ATWT, the conservative show, was always number 1.

Never liked the AK as Paul. He looked like a squeeky little midget and when they had him in love scenes with the Va Va Voom of Emily, it seemed ridiculous (plus I hate mullets.) I am not one who wants "models," for all the actors on soaps, but some kids who are fine as kids, dont have what it takes to carry a soap storyline as young adults. Take RM, who was great as kid Michelle, and is a very good actress, though she is a character actress, not a romantic lead ( I can't stand watching that movie "Bully," with her playing a white trash kid planning and covering up a murder, screwing pot smoking..first time I watched I had to turn my head and said something stupid like, "Michelle Bauer, put a blouse on already," my partner was like, "Who IS Michelle Bauer??" )

[Mitch]

Why the hell did RM have those HUGE shades on inside. Was she stoned or hung over???(I am joking RM was a born again Christian.) I never understood why they got rid of Carol (well, I think they did to try to make everyone forget that Steve was married to her before he met Betsy.) I think she would have made a great recurring character, married to the town minister. It would be kind of interesting to see a Christian character talking about faith and dealing with life's temptations and challenges. Obviously couldnt carry storyline but she could add a different flavor. I don't know why she want brought back for Chris and Nancy's anniversary or Chris' funeral. Maybe she was retired from acting.

Who was this Tom, he was kinda sexy.

Edited September 30, 2011 by Mitch

[DRW50]

That's true about Nancy. It's something I wish I could see. I'm glad a few episodes about the fallout of Adam's paternity lie are available now, as you can see some of Nancy's reaction to this lie, and how it obviously deeply upsets her. There's an episode she's only in a few bits of, but she's at the Stewart cabin with, among others, Ellen and Dani, and there's some sadness from her, I guess because she sees Ellen with her grandchild and it reminds her of what's happened with Adam.

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[DRW50]

I think this was Charles Colson. Or someone Colson. I always type "Chuck Colson" but then remember that's the Watergate guy.

I do wish they'd kept Carol around in some role. I've said this before but I would have brought her back during the Tom/Margo breakup periods or when Margo was off the show in early 1993. She would have been a big contrast to Margo, far more than silly characters like Taylor, and it would have used Tom's past, when, aside from the story with Lien, Tom seemed to lose everything before the year 1980.

[Mitch]

This clip gives a good contrast between "sweet," grandmother Ellen and a still more iron fisted Nancy, ( I love how Wagner gives a disapproving look on her face talking to Ellen) in their discussions about Emily and James and the truth. The dialogue is a bit clunky "Are you talking about Emily or something else?" how would Ellen know? But its good for Marland to show a matriach that actually has feelings misgivings and regrets, instead of just doling out support, advice and encouragement, but never seem to have an inner life of their own.

[Mitch]

Except Carol would not have been a character they could have used as a third, or interloper. She was one of the few characters who remained "above it all, " without seeming selfrighteous or saccharine. Would have been funny to have her as a secretary in Lucinda's office, (she used to work for Lisa so she would know how to deal with historonic divas) sympathetically listening to her without backing up her every move.

[soapfan770]

Thanks for sharing! 80s commercials are so cheesy.

How long did it take exactly for Adam's paternity to be revealed? I thought it happened in late '87.

Those scenes with Jessica and Shannon make me sad considering their later awful storyline. I never knew James and Lilith were lovers, that must have been one hell of a couple.

Pam Dixon didn't work as a long-term character did she? Whatever happened to the Franklins? Who was Mark?

[DRW50]

I liked Pam. I thought she worked fine as a long-term character. I guess from the show's POV she didn't, but, as an SOD review at the time said, Lily steamrolled over her, and every other female in her age range, with the exception of Meg. What I liked about Pam was that she was a decent person and a quiet person, which is something a soap needs when the other characters in that age group are OTT.

Any scene with Jessica and Shannon makes me sad. I still hate what the show did to the characters when Shannon came back.

Adam was conceived in late 1987 or early 1988. Margo and Tom reconciled, Margo learned she was pregnant and it had to be Hal's. She fled to Greece. She had the baby in August or September 1988. They passed the baby off as Tom's until sometime in April or May 1989, when Hal found out. The fallout went on for quite a while, as he didn't find out for a year after this that Barbara had known and kept quiet.

Nella Franklin quit the nursing program and moved to California with Beau. I'm not sure what happened to Roy. The parents just faded away I guess.

Mark was Glenn Harrington's brother. Shannon turned to him during her estrangement from Duncan. She didn't trust Duncan and she thought Glenn was a hero. In actuality Glenn was working for Stenbeck and had killed her Uncle Earl. Glenn was killed by Stenbeck right before Stenbeck shot Hank Elliot on the heliport. Shannon was devastated, and to compound it, learned she was carrying his baby. Mark was a very nice guy and when he came to town he and Shannon got together, and they spent a lot of time setting up the Earl Mitchell Center. Unfortunately Shannon lost her baby. Mark realized Shannon would only ever love Duncan, and he left town quietly to try to make sure Shannon didn't have to face the burden of breaking up with him. There's a very nice episode where Lyla is singing "I'll Be Seeing You" as Mark says farewell.

This was a depressing story and it seems insane to me to leave Shannon and Duncan apart for a year and a half, especially since the story drained all of Shannon's humor and personality. But I will say that this was some of Margaret Reed's best dramatic work on the show.

I know what you mean, but I think they could have had her as a third party without actually being one - sort of the way that John was a third party with Kim and Bob even though he long stopped having feelings for Kim.

I love the idea of Carol as some sort of confidante to Lucinda. It would have been a nice humanizing effect for Lucinda, which she didn't really have (the closest was Sierra).

[DRW50]

Here's Mark's goodbye episode.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgqefK2d3bA&feature=related

[Paul Raven]

I agree C David Colson always comes across as sexy in an alpha male type of way.Earlier Toms seem kind of boyish and photos of Tom Tammi give off a similar vibe.

[Paul Raven]

C David Colson as Tom with Bob

[Paul Raven]

In a SOD interview concerning her departure Jacquie Shultz comments that the past life and perfume stories were confusing to her in terms of Dee's character.

Here is a SOd synopsis from early 82.I guess this is the Dobsons?

Edited October 1, 2011 by Paul Raven

[DRW50]

Thanks. I've never seen that. I'd never heard of these people Ingrid or Sven.

This story seems so convoluted but also sounds like fun.

I'm always so fascinated by what they were doing with Ellen at this time. The idea of patient Ellen quitting a job...I guess this is when David still had amnesia? Or he and Ellen were estranged, at least. The idea of her being interested in another man. Too bad they never gave her a story like that after David passed away (she flirted but that was it).

Karen seems like such an odd character. There are a lot of very quirky female characters on the show at this time - Karen, Margo, Ariel. I wonder how viewers reacted. I also wonder if that's why a lot of these characters were never mentioned again after leaving, even though there was certainly reason to bring back or mention Ariel and Karen in later years. I wonder if they were a little too grey for Marland.

Edited October 1, 2011 by CarlD2

[Paul Raven]

Cast list from around that time

[DRW50]

I didn't know Betsy Palmer was on the show. I guess this must have been a short role. Who was Suz?

Who were Brenda, Aaron, Stan, Matt, and Madame Koster? I've read about Stan but am blanking on the memory.