LML Or MAB: Y&R

[Sylph]

Yes, Carl, beautifully put.

And I can almost bet they will think it's the doppelgangers, you can always rely on things getting worse.

This show is... Kind of... Done.

[DRW50]

Jamey Giddens said the show is actually in more cancellation danger than something like GH, as CBS does not feel the Bell soaps are making enough profit to justify survival.

[Sylph]

It would really need at least two years of full dedication and an excellent production/writing/directing team headed by a true storyteller (yeah, I know how cliched and shabby that sounds).

Commitment. Which it won't get.

[JackPeyton]

Jamey also posted that Y&R ratings fell because MM was gone. Im not kidding and i doubt he was wither. He said something about Kish from OLTL and MM being in a ratings class with Marcil and Eden R... lol.

[DeeeDee]

+1.

[DaytimeFan]

I can see how this is true since the Bell shows aren't owned by CBS, while the ABC soaps are. That said, NBC seemed to think that a non-NBC owned soap like DAYS was worth keeping around, at least till 2011.

But it's interesting that 2011 is when Y&R and B&B's contracts expire. As I've said, when Y&R falls, B&B falls with it.

[JimTolkien]

Now this I completely agree with...I have been saying for the longest while that the Bells are tapped out, they have nothing left to give but the same crap over and over and over. You have even personalities of B&B bleeding over into Y&R while the show has become Passions/DOOL, part DEUX.

As for MM and Adam being the Lord & Saviour of Y&R (oh, another one of those ) , that's another load of rubbish...Adam was poorly written and even that character didn't drive up ratings either though it did stir up a lot of talk on the boards. This show's ratings should have been well into the 4's by now if he was oh so critical.

It's simple, good consistent writing,good consistent writing for your strong characters, good production always make me want to watch. And I don't want to have to keep repeating, didn't I just see this storyline 1 year, 6 months, 3 months ago.

LML was not that very good but I never complained about the show this much when she was writing. But MAB for me is much much much much worse because I expected so much much much better from her. Disappointing would be an understatement.

[MarkH]

1. I disagree that the "Bells are tapped out". See, there were never "Bells". There was ONE BELL. When he died, we always knew his son was -- at best -- a pale imitator...someone who (maybe) picked up some of his shock/awe/camp sh!t, but didn't get any of the deeper emotion behind it. So too, with Maria, because she DOES have a vision of Y&R that says "spin your stories on the backs of Chancellors/Newmans and sometimes Abbotts/Fosters", she first seemed to be repairing a drift-from-core that LML had introduced.

Of course, you can spin stories for Lauralee Brooks herself, and it doesn't mean sh!t if the story you spin involves Lauralee revisiting her unabortion from 1972, in a hitherto unknown tryst with Terrible Tom. And then if Lauralee is suddenly murdered by a powdered donut jammed down her throat by a mind-controlled Amber...it ain't history, it's flushable.

2. I am reminded that MAB's soap experience was REALLY at B&B. I think that explains a lot of what is happening at Y&R.

3. Many of us were lambasted as apologists for MAB. Personally, I have always been clear that my loyalty is to Y&R -- the show that has been a big backdrop in my life -- and so like others, that means I give it wide berth. It has to get REALLY, REALLY sh!tty before I'll accept that the show is unwatchable.

Sadly, when I'm enjoying B&B more than Y&R (this week), that's saying a lot for me. I'm skipping days.

More importantly, this team has been around long enough, and their creative direction is clear enough (despite promises of improvement last Fall), that at this point (for me) it is clear that this team can NEVER pull it off.

Now, some will say "ah, but you ignored our wisdom--we saw how sh!tty MAB's team was 55 months ago". Maybe, maybe. But for me, the thing is (in life, not just here) I give folks a lot of room to prove themselves. I let the evidence mount (and mount and mount) before I draw firm conclusions.

I think the evidence is clear.

4. Therefore, I'm quite pleased to see the 431K dropoff in households last week, and especially the big drops in key demos. My sincere hope, despite the Jack Peyton axiom (when they leave they don't come back) is that this persists for AT LEAST six weeks (maybe longer). The suddenness of it, and the failure to bounce back, WILL send a message. That's not saying anyone in power will listen to the message or care.

5. Now, to be clear, I assign blame for this product to MAB...but I only assign blame as I would to the CEO of Goldman Sachs or Toyota. She's stewarding a whole team that is betraying its customers. I include in that team Sony/CBS (which I know makes eyes roll, and brands me as an apologist). But the fact is that Sony/CBS "notes" are part of the equation, and MAB's inability to find clever ways to surmount these is a part of the story.

6. We said, in the past, that Y&R would likely fall in 2016. We then revised it, based on Moonves and creative direction. I don't think Y&R/B&B will go in 2011, but I think the one-year renewals will not continue that much longer after.

7. I agree with Sylph that the die has been cast. I do not think a single showrunner, even given a 24-month repair period, will either reverse the ratings erosion or significantly creatively rebuild this show. This is, in part, due to the many moving parts that make Y&R sh!t these days...and I don't think a new showrunner will have the power to fix all these moving parts.

As a loyal Y&R viewer, I'll probably be one of the last 2 million viewers standing--so will many of you? But we're definitely circling the drain.

[Jay]

...in the last scene.

[Sylph]

But how come it took you so long to realize many of those things, Mark? Yes, you did complain about a thing or two in the past months, but it was genereally satisfaction gallore with the show.

The show is following the same path it did months ago and you can only see it now? Or you just hope for the better? Supported it thinking I don't know what?

It's really abysmal and there will be no salvation. This is the endgame.

At best, Hogan Sheffer, Scott Hamner and Paul Rauch will be fired, but then Maria Arena will replace them with another team of hacks ("a person who works solely for mercenary reasons, hireling", "a writer who works on order", "a writer who aims solely for commercial success") who will just do pretty much the same thing these three did, slightly different.

Then just rinse and repeat, circulus vitiosus ad nauseam.

[dm.]

For some reason, and don't hate me for this, I also have a feeling that the show is done. No writer, no matter how good they are, will ever be able to repair the damage done to the show. There will always be the feeling that the show has been ruined beyond belief. The audience won't erase their memories containing everything that's been going on for the past few years. It's done. It's crooked, tainted, over. At least for me.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I agree.

I used to think a new writing regime could come in and save the show at least creatively, but that's no longer the case. Y&R will be canceled like the others soon enough, and they'll probably ride out the wave with this HORRENDOUS current writing team.

[DaytimeFan]

That's how I feel now. I think the Y&R we all loved is dead and there is no hope for a renaissance.

[DeeeDee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38wx8C7VmB4

[MarkH]

It's not that I didn't see what you saw...but I never react instantly. Never. I believed it could possibly reverse itself. I don't accept something is a pattern till it is TRULY a pattern. We are now ONE YEAR post-Chipmunk. That is long enough to see that something is not going to get better.

I am patient to a fault, and I admit the "fault" part.

I agree with you, but not for the reason indicated. I think they have turned off viewers. Those people are gone. So, even if there is a creative renaissance, the people they p!ssed off won't come back to see it.

That sets in motion a cycle. Numbers stay lower. Budgets get cut. The show sucks more and more. Soon it is written by a washed-up-hasbeen-showkiller and the high schoolers he/she can afford to hire as BDW/SW. If a lapsed viewer DOES tune in to sample, they see such utter sh!t they run away again in horror.

My feeling is that we'll probably see one last desperation move, but we likely will see MAB stay in some face-saving capacity (e.g., EP). But honestly, because of the many hands in the broth, I think even if your fave writers from GL wrote the show, it would be almost as sh!tty. I think there is a SICK SYSTEM in place, and not even a good writer (and no, I'm not claiming MAB is a good writer) could right the ship.

We now know, for a fact, from both the Cordays and Bells, that soap-auteur talent has ZERO genetic component. Not that MAB shares any genes Marrying into the Bells does not make you Bill Bell, LOL