Members DRW50 Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Bill looks like Dr. Drew Pinsky after a lot of stressful hours trying to help the crazies of Genoa City. She...looks like Carolyn Hinsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bellcurve Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 It definitely made a point about you saying looks shouldn't matter, we should be focused on the work. But it's perfectly okay to objectify actors in the thread and guess if the characters are top or bottom based on the LOOK of the actor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Respectfully, I think you might have confused me with someone else...but your point is taken. I didn't mean to provoke defensiveness in expressing my personal discomfort up above, so I apologize that I seem to have done so. None of that, either way, is relevant to this drum beating thread. I think in the month or so since Alvin first posted it, we've had something close to growing unanimity that something in TPTB ranks needs to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 So... MarkH... How do you explain the fact that at first, it seemed, she got the Bill Bell trademarks perfectly and incorporated them in the show and then it all plummetted like a train off a bridge? She completely distorted them, historigasm-icized the show and made it all a big dark, sick show? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I doubt I can explain it, although I am surprised to say I agree with what you write above. My hunch is that it all relates to "Sudden Impact". (Yes, that timed with the arrival of Hogan Sheffer, but I think the HS arrival is more symptom than cause). The show discovered the "big event" (premised on a death), and used the big event as an umbrella story to drive high-emotional storytelling for a few weeks. It seemed to work, both in terms of good drama, and in terms of ratings spikes. Having taken the stunt drug once, it became instantly addictive...and so we have Kay's death, followed by Brad's death, following by the summer-of-psychos, followed by the trifecta of death (Colleen, Ashley/Sharon's baby, and Victor's near death). I think, as many of you more expert people here have said, it seems likely that the arrival of Sheffer and retention of Hamner are not accidental...it seems likely that these two men know how to generate stunts, and then MAB puts them in historical context (e.g., rather than write off Colleen, MAB's team suggests to her that Colleen DIE and -- ironically -- give Victor her heart; MAB then uses her team to milk many of the historical beats --JT, Steve, Traci...heck even Korbel and the grandmothers get mentioned). But I am also positive that the "more plot" and "more stunts" mandate came from CBS/Sony after Y&R experienced ITS MOST RAPID WEEK-TO-WEEK DECLINE IN ITS HISTORY during early 2008. I think this is a big reaction to the HUGE death trajectory the show was on during the MAB/JG era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I like this explanation very much. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Juliajms Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 How can saying positive things be bad? I don't see that as the same thing as picking apart the looks of non performers at all. But people do have the right to do both, so whatever. I'll admit I always pictured MAB as a dark haired sophisticate for some reason. A Sabrina type, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I did too! I assumed (with the "Arena") that she was of Latino/Hispanic origin. I actually thought I had read that she was a first-generation immigrant from a spanish-speaking country (probably Mexico). I obviously erred. She's a nice midwestern girl who met Lee Phillip Bell at Northwestern...and the rest is history! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted October 16, 2009 Author Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 If Eric Braeden is in fact leaving, now is not the time for Maria Arena Bell/Hogan Sheffer/Scott Hamner/Paul Rauch to continue on with their vision for Y&R. They aren't strong enough writers to gradually transition a show, hell they can't even transition organically between story arcs. So much of the show is built around the Victor character and numerous characters revolve around him in some way. The show would need a major overhauling, which it already needs anyway. Stronger character writing, stronger relationship dynamics between characters, and just good soap storytelling that isn't the bizarre trash we have now are all a must. All of this needs to be done regardless, but especially if Braeden doesn't want to come back. This writing team are not the people for that kind of delicate job, and given what we've gotten for the past 6-7 months or so, I dread the ways such a loss would impact the show with this writing team writing the show. This show needs a thorough overhauling of all things that aren't working, whether it be characters, actors, storylines, relationships, whatever, there needs to be some type of change. Not saying that the overhaul show should give the show yet another identity change (I don't even think Y&R has a true identity under the Maria Bell/Sheffer/Hamner regime), but a refocusing and and zeroing on bare essentials and the core of the show, while establishing fresh stories and well-developed character, whether they be old characters or new characters (which this current regime fails miserably at). For that we needs a stronger and more competent writers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Juliajms Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 It's sure not looking good. I posted an article in the spoiler section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DRW50 Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I have heard comments like, "Oh well Adam is a young Victor! They can just replace Victor with Adam." I'm sure DC and Branco and others who love Muhney will go along, but I wonder how the viewers will feel. Many viewers, especially the straight men who respect Victor and the women who may not like him that much but are used to him and can excuse him, will feel about some young punk like Adam taking his place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 Yup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DRW50 Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 This also shows how short-sighted and arrogant this team is, because if they knew tough negotiations were in store, then WHY did they turn Adam into a baby killer, a man who uses a molester to help him in his schemes, pull the stupid shock value gay sex with Rafe (which a lot of conservative viewers will probably always be annoyed by -- you never saw Victor fixing ties with Douglas Austin, even though the implication was sometimes there), if they wanted to groom him as a new Victor? Or are the vacuous Niktoria supposed to be heirs to Victor? They couldn't even be heirs to Donny and Marie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Juliajms Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think the answer is one of two things. 1) Shift the main focus to Jack. Bring back Kyle, Kemo, Diane and make this new girl Jack's. Then make either Nick or Adam into the secondary nemesis (Jack role). Or, if they really must turn Adam into the new Victor I think the only answer is for Adam to get away with his crimes for a very long time, if not forever. People do get away with murder in the real world, just like Phyllis got away with attempted murder on the show. I don't see how else they can do it (but I have a feeling we are going to find out how they think they can). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted October 16, 2009 Members Share Posted October 16, 2009 They can make Adam faux-Adam. You know they would totally go there. And Muhney is perfectly cast as an impostor. It really suits him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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