April 20-24, 2009

[SteveFrame]

That last part is the key. You cannot put the same characters on day after day. That is what leads to the same conversations over and over or to the plotting problems.

Why not compare daytime to primetime, because to me that is what daytime has become. It seems like for the most part most of the time they are trying to write the shows as if they are hours of primetime. They try to pack so much into an episode it seems they forget they have a whole week to tell that story.

The Josh story for instance seemed like 3 primetime episodes right in a row. If they had slowed it down the story would have worked much better.

Sure speed up the pace but instead of trying to write 5 primetime episodes a week - why not write one and spread it out over the week.

But again you can't do it by showing the same people every single day.

you mentioned Bill Bell slow. Back in the 70's perse with Bill and Laura - the story that he took the longest to tell - you didn't have that story or it's principles featured every single day. you might have them about 3 times a week. He would have 3 or 4 a stories going and each would get 2 to 3 days a week and then he would have a bunch of minor stories going and you got them as fill-in scattered throughout.

Even with tighter budgets today, the shows have enough characters that they can still do this. They just keep choosing to write for the same ones over and over and over and over and over.

[CSF]

Yes, exactly! And what I noticed about that, Y&R in particular, they will show like 2 or 3 clips for the following episode, making you think X,Y and Z won't be on, but they are and I think that's a problem because people will not tune in thinking "okay Jill isn't on tomorrow so I'm not watching," but she is, she just wasn't in the preview.

Very important key here, Steve. The same could apply to Lincoln and Kelly Tyler on AMC. They married and left. Had they remained, I'm sure they would have broken up and gotten back together many times. However, I wish they would have had a son to keep the Tyler name alive today. Even a daughter for that matter.

As for Luke and Laura, when Guza broke them up after 18 years (or maybe that was the writer after he left), to me, it made sense, because Luke and Laura got boring and if they were going to be happily married, what storyline could they have? They were a couple based on action and adventure stoylines, it was the GH of the past. They had pain and suffering because of the Cassadine's. Nikolas and Lucky hated eachother. Luke and the Cassadine's hated eachother. Laura was in the middle. There was suffering. Granted, the storyline could have been a lot better. Also, I wish they could have given both Luke and Laura a story where they both move on and fall in love with other characters, giving the theme that nothing lasts forever, but time heals all wounds and you can love again. For instance, I enjoy the scenes with Tracy and Lulu and I wish there was more to the Step Mother/Step Daughter dynamic there. Tracy was a spoiled little brat. Laura is ill and Tracy should really mentor Lulu and then Lulu comes into accepting Tracy as another mother figure. It would be a nice touch to have that. Tracy could become the mother she never was to Ned and Dillion.

[CSF]

IMO, I think it is very important that storyline's move in a slow pace. For example, I love when I'm watching Y&R on a Tuesday, because it's really still Friday in Genoa City. Because that mean's so much is going on and you are able to keep track of it all.

I remember Agnes Nixon once said they write their stories out for an extended period of time, and have them climax during the sweeps period. They build everything up for the sweeps months. That makes total sense. Today it's like GH has a big shindig planned for November, but the whole back story takes place in October. It's all crammed in. What's the point in turing after May then? There are 3 or 4 sweeps periods? So should we only watch for those amounts of months and a little beforehand to get the back story? That isn't good story telling. When you have a story pan out, we get to see the character's develop. What makes them tick, what makes them smile, etc. Those are important. Watching your character's just sit back and talk about nothing is important. It's important because it's relatable. The whole point of television is to entertain in a way that makes us forget about our problems and the next day at work, we have those "water cooler" conversations. "Did you see what Erica did on AMC yesterday? OMG CSI was nuts last night. I can't believe that happened, did you watch it?"

I remember back in college taking one last class for my major and I recall a study that showed out of all the viewing options we have today, the majority of viewers would prefer to watch a program where they have very little interaction with it. They can sit back and get into it. You can do that easily with Y&R. I say that not because I love it and watch it and because it's number 1, but because I can quit on Monday and return to it in June and I won't be lost. Those same character's will be there doing the same things they always do. They are familiar. Storylines may change, but it will be easy to put it together. Once you sit back and watch, things fall into place. I put on GH and it's like "wait? Claudia is pregnant? Did she have sex with Sonny? When did this happen? Wait, how many kids does he have now? Wasn't Kate just shot?" It's too fast. That's another reason why I stopped watching ATWT. I recall a time where I didn't watch for 6 months and I put it on one day and I was able to pick it up right from where I left off, and this was when FMB was still the EP.

When I watch Y&R at my mother's house when I'm visiting she knows who is who when she sees it, and she doesn't even like it or watch it. Only a glance when I have it on. She's watched AMC since 1977. She watched OLTL from 1977 as well but stopped pre Linda Gottlieb. She began watching OLTL again in the early 2000s, yet she has to ask my sister (who's been watching the ABC soaps since the 90s) who is who because a lot of the character's that were on pre-1990 aren't around today.

[SteveFrame]

I have noticed many of the same things you do. My daughter visits a lot esp. while I am watching Y&R. She never watches the show preferring AMC, but each time she comes over she talks about Y&R as if she knows what is going on. She talks about how she wished that AMC was a little slower because she feels lost if she misses a few days.

You don't do that with Y&R. And the characters are a big thing too. People watch soaps to follow characters they love. Way too many of the characters that fans love and are attached too have been gone. Every soap needs new blood but they have to be anchored by the old and familiar. If people tune in and can't relate they won't stay.

I miss those water cooler conversations about soaps the most. Soaps just don't inspire them anymore or at least not as much as they used too. I know my boyfriend who is a fireman says that the talk at the fire department is in a big way about Rescue Me which didn't surprise me. He said on the day after the show is on everyone that comes in the door says did you guys see what Tommy or someone on the show did last night or it is about somethign they said. They also talk about Nip/Tuck and other FX shows like that too. But Rescue Me they really do. What is strange is that more times than he can count the stuff that people remember about the show are not the major plot points of the show but it will be stuff from minor conversations or stuff - the character stuff you could say.

[Angela]

1.(1) Y&R: Monday: 3.9/5,583,000 (+666,000)

2.(2) B&B: Monday: 2.6/3,606,000 (+329,000)

3.(3) DAYS: Monday: 2.1/2,829,000 (+138,000)

4.(6) ATWT: Monday: 2.1/2,778,000 (+479,000)

5.(4) GH: Monday: 1.8/2,453,000 (-32,000)

6.(5) AMC: Monday: 2.0/2,442,000 (+128,000)

7.(7) OLTL: Monday: 1.8/2,325,000 (+74,000)

8.(8) GL: Monday: 1.5/1,917,000 (-208,000)

1.(1) Y&R: Tuesday: 3.9/5,436,000 (-147,000)

2.(2) B&B: Tuesday: 2.6/3,426,000 (-180,000)

3.(3) DAYS: Tuesday: 2.3/3,105,000 (+276,000)

4.(4) ATWT: Tuesday: 1.9/2,529,000 (-249,000)

5.(6) AMC: Tuesday: 1.9/2,478,000 (+36,000)

6.(5) GH: Tuesday: 1.7/2,213,000 (-240,000)

7.(7) OLTL: Tuesday: 1.7/2,205,000 (-120,000)

8.(8) GL: Tuesday: 1.6/2,092,000 (+175,000)

1.(1) Y&R: Wednesday: 3.6/5,155,000 (-281,000)

2.(2) B&B: Wednesday: 2.5/3,457,000 (+31,000)

3.(3) DAYS: Wednesday: 2.2/2,921,000 (-184,000)

4.(6) GH: Wednesday: 1.9/2,353,000 (+140,000)

5.(7) OLTL: Wednesday: 1.8/2,352,000 (+147,000)

6.(5) AMC: Wednesday: 1.7/2,318,000 (-160,000)

7.(4) ATWT: Wednesday: 1.8/2,298,000 (-231,000)

8.(8) GL: Wednesday: 1.5/1,927,000 (-165,000)

1.(1) Y&R: Thursday: 3.4/4,780,000 (-375,000)

2.(2) B&B: Thursday: 2.6/3,444,000 (-13,000)

3.(3) DAYS: Thursday: 2.2/2,848,000 (-73,000)

4.(4) GH: Thursday: 1.9/2,401,000 (+48,000)

5.(7) ATWT: Thursday: 1.8/2,340,000 (+42,000)

6.(6) AMC: Thursday: 1.9/2,332,000 (+14,000)

7.(5) OLTL: Thursday: 1.8/2,302,000 (-50,000)

8.(8) GL: Thursday: 1.5/1,968,000 (+41,000)

1.(1) Y&R: Friday: 3.3/4,589,000 (-191,000)

2.(2) B&B: Friday: 2.6/3,508,000 (+64,000)

3.(3) DAYS: Friday: 2.0/2,797,000 (-51,000)

4.(6) AMC: Friday: 1.9/2,545,000 (+213,000)

5.(5) ATWT: Friday: 1.9/2,497,000 (+157,000)

6.(4) GH: Friday: 1.8/2,381,000 (-20,000)

7.(7) OLTL: Friday: 1.7/2,257,000 (-45,000)

8.(8) GL: Friday: 1.5/1,941,000 (-27,000)

[SteveFrame]

Wow AMC went up in the Men Demo, the 18-34 Demo and Girls 12-17 and gained 10,000 in the 18-49 but they lost in total viewers.

They must have big losses in the 50 and older crowd which Frons won't really care because he has always been about the youth.

[SteveFrame]

If this rating trend continues it won't be AMC that is the first ABC show to go. OLTL and GH are bleeding viewers. AMC has lost a lot but in comparison to last year they are down less than 50,000 while GH and OLTL are down more than 300,000.

[JackPeyton]

yay for Days staying above 2.0's all week. It deserves it.

[brimike]

I know this is a meaningless demo, but I find it so humorous that GH is DEAD LAST in men. Especially with all the Sonny/Jason posturing, and the mob stuff.

[JackPeyton]

Apparently, women like it.

Men prefer the real thing - you know... Scarface, The Sopranos, etc...

[dm.]

From 3.9 to 3.3 in a week? Geez Y&R...

And wow, look at DAYS holding steady... take that Fronsie!

[Y&RWorldTurner]

There were tons of Swine Flu preemptions overt the past two weeks, that had to impact a lot of the soaps in some ways.

[SteveFrame]

Not just that but Tennessee has so many times over the last 2 weeks in particular where we have had afternoons where the soaps didn't come on any channels at all due to bad weather.

Friday afternoon, I ended up giving up and not sure if they ever came back on or not. I checked back at about 2:30 and I know GH was not on. I never did check to see if GL came back on or not.

I talk to a friend in Alabama and they said that it was the same way there. He said in their area that the soaps had missed about 3 days in the last 2 weeks just due to weather.

[Ann_SS]

So GH's low ratings could be weather related. I am sure that GH will bounce a little by the time we get Thursday's ratings.

[Soapsuds]

Wow...GH with a 1.7 on Tuesday...LOL