The Doctors Discussion Thread

[DRW50]

Can anyone tell me what you thought of Virginia Vestoff when she filled in for Liz Hubbard on the Doctors? How long was she there?

I loved loved loved loved loved Virginia on Dark Shadows and to this day I'm still upset that her only other soap work is unavailable.

[Paul Raven]

Virginia Vestoff was there for a year 1969-70.Unfortunately,that is before my time,so I can't comment on her performance.

She died young,age 42.

[Chris B]

I hope the news that the company that bought The Doctors is negotiating with two networks works out. I'd prefer they start releasing it on DVD or stream it online honestly. I think that would be easier to get off the ground. It's amazing to think that such a long forgotten soap could possibly return and we lucked out because it actually looks very good. I've seen one episode from 1981 and it was very good and that was the end! I was also impressed with how different Kim Zimmer was. It showed that she is possible of playing other types of characters.

[Paul Raven]

April 76

After Mike's stormy session with Mike, he has all the symptoms of a heart attack and is rushed to the hospital by the trauma unit. Fortunately, he is found to be suffering only from stress. Maggie is relieved, but Nick still wants to examine Matt thoroughly and Hank urges Matt to stay home for a few days.

Martha's friend, Ernie, had been suggesting to Mike that he consider working in the police lab, when Maggie called to tell Mike that Matt was in the hospital. She insisted that under no circumstances should Mike join her, but has kept her previous promise to keep him posted on Matt's condition.

When Mike relays the stress diagnosis to Martha, she suggests that perhaps Matt is going through male menopause.

Eleanor is continuing to have her problems. No matter what womanly wiles she tries on Scott, he will have no part of her, sexually. She complains to Althea that both Wendy and Scott are merely doing their duty with absolutely no love involved. Althea rages at Eleanor for burdening her with her problems. Althea has also advised Eleanor to forget the past and go on with the future. Scott shows up at the height of Althea's outburst and takes Eleanor away as Althea apologizes for behaving rudely.

Dr. McIntyre had run into Eleanor as she was on her way to visit Althea. McIntyre is at the hospital for an interview with Matt. The meeting goes very well and Matt tells McIntyre a decision will be reached in a few days. Matt showed up at the hospital in spite of Hank's advice to the contrary, as Hank knew he would.

M.J. tries to talk Steve into calling in the police again to find Carolee. Mona, at Ann's contrivance, interrupts M.J.'s meeting with Steve.

Mona asks Steve to come home and help prepare for Erich's birthday party. Ann takes it upon herself to call a booking office and hire an entertainer for the party, but wishes to do so anonymously.

Jerry has told Penny an unbelievable story about his mother. After saying his mother dreams of someday having a five room apartment, he tries to locate her in Switzerland where she's skiing.

Erich's birthday party ends in disaster. The only thing Erich really wanted was Carolee's return. He's convinced himself she's on her way. Erich even implored Billy to check flight arrivals of planes from New York.

Jeremy, the clown, arrives and for awhile manages to bring some brightness to the party, but gloom descends when Jeremy admits that Dr. Ann Lorimer hired and sent him to entertain. Erich is deeply hurt and Billy races off to have it out with Ann. His anger has been heightened by Mona's taking Ann's side and telling everyone how grateful they should be that Ann sent Jeremy.

Billy Warns Ann

At Ann's office, Billy explodes, will accept none of her explanations, and rushes out after threatening to keep an eye on Ann and make certain that she will never worm her way into Steve's household.

Eleanor might just as well not be in Scott's household, either. Scott treats her so perfunctorily correct, while ignoring her sexually, that Eleanor is beside herself. Wendy suggests Eleanor take one day at a time. Eleanor is curious to learn if Scott is interested in another woman, but is afraid to find out.

Wendy has told Penny that Scott is becoming ragged around the edges and thinks Althea should see and be with Scott. Penny, coming down with something, says Althea is too moral to see Scott while Eleanor is in the picture.

Scott has visited Althea earlier to plead his own case, only to find Althea having dizzy spells. Nick comes to look her over, can find nothing wrong, but insists that Althea have a full time nurse. Until she does, Nick will stay with her.

Earlier, Penny had refused to move back home after Althea turned down Penny's request for a loan. Penny had hoped to use the money to transfer to another school for the summer.

Dr. McIntyre is getting settled in when Stacy enters looking for Dr. Wilson and mistakes Dr. McIntyre for a cleaning man. He offers his services to Stacy after he introduces himself, but Stacy says she's crazy and no one can help her.

No one can help Joan Dancy, either, but her mother reads about her in the paper and books a flight home.

Mrs. Dancy tries desperately to awaken Joan. She refuses to believe her daughter cannot be saved. She berates Jerry for not having told her the truth about Joan's drug addiction. Jerry shows his mother a plane ticket he bought for Joan two years ago. He'd begged Joan to use it, fly to New York and enter a rehabilitation center. Jerry insists that no one could have saved Joan; that all he would have accomplished by telling Mrs. Dancy the truth would have been his mother's death as well as his sister's.

Matt runs into Mike and Toni in the hospital cafeteria. Matt and Mike each make an effort to break through the barrier that separates them.

Matt is Mending Fences

in several directions. He's calmer now and is even agreeable to taking a vacation. Maggie is ecstatic. Matt amuses her further by his sudden compassion for the love between Greta and Billy, though he does admit his concern over where that love might lead.

Billy has turned to Greta for comfort after delivering an ultimatum to Steve. Billy, upset at finding Ann again in the house with Mona, has demanded that Steve must choose between An and the kids.

Now Billy, aware that he's only a foster child, feels he may have gone too far. He fears that by forcing Ann out of the house, he may have achieved getting himself pushed out, instead.

Ann is determined to change Billy's mind about her. She is also determined to help Steve finish an uncompleted manuscript. Steve wasn't even aware that Mona had given his rough draft to Ann.

Rico, unhappy in his relationship with Stacy, has turned to Penny for consolation. Penny is recuperating from a minor illness at Matt and Maggie's. She's refused to stay in the hospital as she now refuses to be a substitute for Stacy. Penny does agree to consider future dates with Rico.

Nick finds it necessary to baby sit with Althea in order to keep her at home. He verbally paddles her for having driven alone to the hospital.

Stacy Moves In

Stacy is moving in with her grandmother and Uncle Steve. As she unpacks, Mona sees a sculpture Stacy has done. She is ecstatic as she places the piece on the mantle. She thinks the piece is absolutely marvelous! Stacy begins to look at it again. She approaches it with an almost breathless awe, as if seeing it for the first time. "It's nice," she says. The words seem like such an understatement.

Althea is concerned that she has recurring headaches and blurred vision. She looks at her x-rays with Dr. Iverson and they both concur: the x-rays show nothing. Why then, the blurred vision? Althea decides to talk with Dr. McIntyre.

Maggie is very worried about Matt. He's obviously in a weakened condition.

Steve Confronts Ann

Billy's ultimatum has struck home. Steve tells Ann that they can no longer see each other. Ann, a true diehard, agrees to stay away from the house, but not from Steve.

Toni, unaware that Steve has gone to Ann, goes to Steve to tell him that she intends to keep a close eye on his actions towards Billy.

Penny goes to Althea to apologize for her past behavior and declare a truce. While there, she encounters Scott. Scott had arrived a few minutes before to declare his love for Althea and ask her if she would marry him. Althea had admitted that she would, but reminded him that he has a wife at home.

Mrs. Dancy has been told by the doctors that even in Joanie were to regain consciousness, chances are she would be little more than a vegetable. Mrs. Dancy, however, has put all her faith in God, and continues to fervently pray for a miracle. The doctors agree that nothing short of a miracle would bring about Joanie's recovery.

Penny and Althea are on the way to a hamburger lunch when Althea abruptly stops the car. She admits to Penny that, for minute, she didn't see the car in front of her. Is her vision problem a physical one or is it, as Dr. McIntyre suggested, her way of blocking out an agony she doesn't want to see??

[All My Shadows]

I just found this full-length version of the late 70s theme song. WoST had a much shorter version that faded out, but this is the whole thing, and good lord, it's so 70s:

http://www.tvpmm.com/documents/453.html

Click on "Main Theme v2" in the player.

[FrenchFan]

Don't forget "The Doctors". Here is a yearly summary from 1977:

Paul and Stacy announced their secret wedding and her pregnancy and he made it look as though Althea was negligent at work. Stacy advised Paul to confess. After learning his son had died retarded, Paul began fearing Stacy’s baby would be handicapped. Jason learned that a photographed had been tipped off by Paul that something was going to happen at the hospital when Joan died. He figured out that Stacy pulled Joan’s plug. Paul rushed to Canada where Stacy miscarried and died. He promised her to tell the truth just before she died. After an overdose of booze and drugs, Paul confessed his sins to Matt and was jailed. Matt was freed of suspicions.

The Dancy father Barney arrived in town with hepatitis while Eleanor kept giving Luke money for his art school. Luke was ready to leave with money but had a crisis of guilt and begged Eleanor for forgiveness. They reconcilied but she asked him to move out for a few weeks while her daughter Wendy visited. When Wendy learned the truth she was shocked and said Luke was a gigolo.

Steve began divorce proceedings while Ann told Carolee’s doctor that nobody in Madison remembered his patient whose name was Maryellen Smithfield. M.J.’s brother, Darren arrived in town and tried to convince her sister she had to fight for Steve. Stephanie developped rhumatic fever and Steve asked Ann to marry him after she saved the little girl’s life. Carolee ended up remembering her home and ran away to hop a bus for Madison but Dr. Brandt found her. He called Althea to talk about Maryellen which Althea remembered was the name of Paul’s first wife. M.J. recognized Carolee that Dr. Brandt brought to Madison but she could not stop Steve and Ann’s wedding in times. Steve learned about Carolee who reverted to catatonia after overhearing Steve and Ann were married.

Maggie noticed Nola was neglicting her baby-sitting chores to flirt with Matt. She was consoled by an architect who just moved, Kyle Wilson. Kyle had a wife Janet who used her handicap to keep him. However, Maggie and he shared a time of passion.

Jason began investigating the mysterious Mrs. Lomax who told Dr. Brandt about Carolee. Feeling better, Carolee moved in with M.J. and resumed her job. Steve decided to ask for a divorce but she learned she was pregnant. He promised Carolee he would divorce after the baby was born. Dr. Brandt finally identified Ann as Mrs. Lomax. Ann skipped town. She was found by Jason and Steve in South America. She convinced Jason that she had micarried even though she hadn’t. She signed the divorce papers on the condition she didn’t have to face Steve.

After Matt, Nola began flirting with Jason but Jason’s estranger wife, Doreen arrived in town. She made plans with Kyle to build a children’s wing dedicated to her late daughter Stacy. Luke took an interest in Doreen and her money and two-timed Eleanor with her. Nola went to Europe with Jason for a romantic holiday. Through Wendy, Eleanor’s lawyers stalled approving financing of Luke’s club venture and Doreen volunteered to be his money woman. Barney found out what was going on. Luke became the new owner of Andre’s but Doreen began wielding her controlling interest power. Eleanor began having suspicions. Luke hired Nola for the club but Doreen did not like the idea. Wendy noticed her mother was hitting the pill bottle. Luke fired Nola and Doreen instigated a plan to get Nola out-of-own singing engagements. Jason learned Doreen made a financial agreement with talent agent Earl Rodgers to lure Nola to New York. He decided to divorce Doreen and proposed to Nola. Wendy found out Luke was living with Doreen but Eleanor refused to believe it and took more pills. When Eleanor tried to kill herself, Luke skipped town. She recovered but told Wendy to butt out of her life. Sarah brought her brother back to Madison and he offered his interest in Andre’s to Doreen in order to repay Eleanor’s money he used.

Penny and Jerry had an argument over their finances and she left for Japan to join her father. Althea and Jerry joined her in July. Meanwhile, M.J. began dating newcomer Tom Caroll. After a short courting, he proposed to her. He admitted that he may have a hereditary nervous disease and was afraid to have children. He had nightmared about his first wife, Doris. He also told M.J. his mother was dead but it was a lie. After the wedding, M.J.’s sister died in a car accident and she promised to take care of her son Ricky. Tom was reluctant and began having nightmare about striking a Vietnamese orphan. M.J. fretted when Tom hit Ricky on two occasions. He moved out after M.J. caught him as he was about to pitch boiling water onto Ricky. He attended Parents Anonymous meetings and M.J. realized her attitude drove Tom to his abuse of Ricky. They agreed to live together again.

Mike was devastated when he learned Toni died in a plane crash. Matt urged his son to return to his medical career. He began dating Sarah. Meanwhile, Greta began spending time alone with Billy and Matt did not like this idea. They got it on despite parental disapproval. Greta overhead Maggie and Kyle discuss their brief affair. Matt finally learned of the affair thanks to Greta and Maggie moved out.

Mona did not like the idea of her son marrying Nola and sided with Doreen. She said Virginia she could not stay an employee once Nola and Jason are married. Doreen finally signed the divorce papers. Barney tried to acquire more money for Nola’s wedding but lost what he took from Virginia on a bad bet. Doreen tried to convince her father Evan that Nole was repsonsible for her marriage failure but Mona confirmed Doreen slept her way around and Evan disinherited her. To revenge, Doreen blabbed that Jason took part in breaking up Nola’s singing career and Nola broke her engagement.

Carolee and Steve planned to remarry but realized Erich did not adjust to their plans. They reassured the young boy before tying the knot before Thanksgiving. Nevertheless, Erich was still disturbed and wanter to stay living at Mona’s. Carolee was worried.

[Paul Raven]

Thanks Cedric for keeping The Doctors thread alive. Doug Marland was the writer at the time.

Does anyone know who played Doreen's father Evan?

[FrenchFan]

Yes Douglas Marland wrote this year until leaving for GH and being replaced by Mel and Ethel Brez.

[saynotoursoap]

I browsed this topic for the first time and wish to make some comments.

Douglas Marland did not create the Dancy family. Joan and Jerry were introduced by Margaret DePriest. Marland merely expanded the family already on the canvas. Curiously, Marland was unable to work ratings magic on The Doctors. The serial's ratings fell from a nine rating into the low sevens during the transitional year that DePriest and Marland wrote the series. For most of Marland's stint as sole writer, The Doctors fell into the high sixes. NBC wanted to expand The Doctors to an hour, and Colgate-Palmolive were game, but two trial, expanded episodes failed to attract enough viewers.

In March 1976, The Doctors aired a highly publicized 90 minute special in which Gerald Gordon, immensely popular as the mercurial Dr. Nick Bellini, raced back to Madison to save the life of Althea after she tumbled off a ladder and crashed through a plate glass window. The following year, with Marland as writer, the serial expanded to one hour for its anniversary episode, in which Jada Rowland joined the cast as Carolee. The anniversary episode also debuted the new opening title sequence of cast drawings and re-orchestrated theme music. None of it succeeded.

The Doctors continued to lose ground to The Guiding Light, making a major ratings comeback on CBS. Writers Mel and Ethel Brez continued Marland's direction, particularly with the story of teenagers Billy and Greta experimenting with sex, which resulted in Greta's pregnancy and a serious rift in the friendship between the Aldrich and Powers families. Then, Linda Grover and Elizabeth Levin, with assists from David Cherrill, wrote some wonderful material rife with familial discord, but the series was too uneven. From 1979 onward, it was all downhill except for Harding Lemay's all too brief writing tenure.

IMHO, the period of the early to mid-70's, with Eileen and Robert Mason Pollock headwriting and Allen Potter producing, was The Doctors' best. The Pollocks had a natural facility for creating campy, high melodrama and combining it effortlessly with strong characterizations. Compared to General Hospital, the doctors at Hope Memorial had larger egos, broader motives, and bigger bal*s. Steve Aldrich and Nick Bellini were both brash playboys rather than genteel, dedicated interns over at GH.

The Pollocks also developed a very effective formula of presenting one villainous member of the medical staff. The first was Dr. Dan Allison, who developed a pathological jealousy of Steve. When Steve accidently knocked up Carolee, and she spurned him to spare herself the indignity of his marrying her out of necessity rather than love, she married Dan instead. What she didn't know was that Dan had been diagnosed with terminal heart disease. Dan overheard Carolee confess that she loved Steve, would never love any man but Steve. Dan plotted in many eloquent monologues his intent to commit suicide and frame Steve for the crime so that even in death, Dan would triumph over Steve.

No sooner had that story concluded, Althea went on vacation and met the suave English psychiatrist Dr. John Morrison, played to sleazy, manipulative perfection by Patrick Horgan. This was 1972, and Althea was on the outs with Nick at this point. John quickly wormed his way into her life. When it looked like she and Nick were drifting back to each other, John married her and then feigned paralysis to keep her loyal. Nick was being pursued by an unstable nurse named Cathy Ryker. Cathy sought psychiatric treatment from John. He deftly used therapy sessions to manipulate Cathy's emotions, leading her to believe that she could have every thing she wanted if she seduced Nick and became pregnant with his child to trap him into marriage. Cathy did just that, but the plan backfired. The baby died in uteruo. That and John's subtle goading drove Cathy insane. She kidnapped infant Stephie Aldrich from the Hope Memorial, and disguised, rented a room in a residential hotel under the name Mrs. Norman. Cathy thought she was living with Nick's son. The hotel's nosy manager wondered why Mrs. Norman's baby bore an uncanny resemblance to photos of the kidnapped Aldrich baby he saw on tv, and when he discovered that Mrs. Norman's baby son didn't have any junk between his legs, he called the cops. The police and Nick descended upon the hotel. Cathy snatched Stephie and crawled out on the narrow window ledge 14 stories above the street. The sequence went on for episodes and episodes as Nick and Steve tried desperately to talk Cathy down. Reluctantly, John Morrison was called in. He lied and schemed effortlessly to get Stephie away from her. When Cathy saw Stephie in Steve's arms, she snapped back to reality. John gently took Cathy's arm. In the same reassuring tones, he told her that everything would work out, just as they discussed in their sessions. A horrified Cathy screamed, "Oh, yes, you got what you wanted...Althea. Everything worked out perfectly for you, Dr. Morrison, but not for me!" Cathy pulled away from his grasp, lost her footing, and plunged off the ledge, her screams echoing as she fell to her death on the streets far below.

Remember, this happened in February 1973. On the CBS soaps, married couples were still sleeping in double beds, organ music punctuated the scenes, and most characters sat around kitchen or living room tables sipping coffee discussing rather than doing. The Doctors was tense, exciting, and addictive.

[DRW50]

That's all fascinating stuff, I never knew any of that.

Did fans accept Jada as Carolee? The woman before her who had created the role from a tiny recurring part was popular wasn't she?

Did you ever see Virginia Vestoff as Althea?

[Sapounopera]

The Pollocks did something similar with Claudia on Dynasty.

[saynotoursoap]

I cannot speak for other fans, but I do believe that Jada Rowland was accepted immediately by most fans. Two things worked in her favour. First off, the storyline was well constructed. Carolee Campbell's last episode was in March 1976. The character Carolee discovered husband Steve Aldrich in the apartment of Ann Larimer after a one night stand. Carolee drove off in a rage. I will never forget this scene, because she was driving too fast and a cop pulled her over for speeding. Carolee quipped, "My husband is in the arms of his mistress breaking every law known to God, and you give ME the ticket!" Carolee ran off to New York, had a nervous breakdown, and disappeared. These events were written by Margaret DePriest. When Doug Marland became headwriter, he had Ann Larimer track Carolee down to a psychiatric hospital. Ann lied that she was Carolee's sister and gave a fake name. Carolee was catatonic, and kept her locked up in the psych ward (Marland later recycled the story almost verbatim on ATWT when Holden was in NY and developed amnesia). A year later, Carolee snapped out of her catatonia and made her way back to Madison, now played by Jada Rowland. The passage of time gave viewers a chance to forget about actress Carolee Campbell. Secondly, Jada Rowland was a superior actress to Carolee Campbell. I am not implying that Campbell was bad; she obviously had something going for her, as she was quite popular, but Rowland was more well known from over 20 years on soaps, and Rowland had a much greater range. I accepted her instantly.

[saynotoursoap]

Yes, I saw Vestoff a few times as Althea. The history books are inaccurate. Vestoff did not replace Liz Hubbard for a year; it was closer to six months. Vestoff took over as Althea in either November or December 1969. The first scenes I saw with her were over my Christmas break from school. At some point in late spring/early summer 1970, Hubbard returned. I don't recall the actual switch back to Hubbard, but by August or September of 1970, Vestoff had been cast on Dark Shadows.

I too loved Virginia Vestoff. She was excellent as Althea, though a bit jarring because the actresses were so physically different. I do not know if she was accepted by the audience. I suspect not because Liz Hubbard was insanely popular, and Vestoff was not in the role long enough to win the audience. I do think that Vestoff would not have remained on the series even if she had succeeded. From everything that I have heard about her, she only did soaps as a way to earn extra money. Her true passion was theater. She probably would have grown weary over time with the repetitiveness of daytime drama, and she didn't have a family to support, which would have kept her there for security.

Virginia's story was very sad. She had a hard life from the beginning, losing her parents as a child. I met a friend of hers many years ago. She told me that Virginia was diagnosed with breast cancer in 1978 and eventually underwent a radical mastectomy to save herself. The surgery was not successful for the cancer had already metastasized to other organs, as she only later discovered. She passed within a few years, in May 1982 at age 42. It was such an unfair end. She was a beautiful and remarkably talented lady.

Edited July 11, 2010 by saynotoursoap

[DRW50]

Thank you so much for your very detailed answers to my questions, I can actually picture all of this in my head, as if I was watching the show myself. So was DePriest's stint on the show just one of many which didn't quite work out after the Pollocks left? I've heard people say she was a decent writer before the 80s.

Virginia's story is heartbreaking. I'm sorry that she didn't have more years and while I know she was probably very appreciated in her lifetime, what with her run in 1776, I wish she knew how many have loved her work on Dark Shadows, which is just electrifying.

So you saw all the Nolas, right? What did you think of Kathleen Turner, Kathryn Harold, and finally Kim Zimmer?

[teplin]

I thought all three Nolas were fantastic, each in her own way. Kathryn Harrold was so beautiful, Kathleen Turner was sex on a stick and Kim Zimmer was a force of nature. It's no surprise that each went on to greater success.