Loving/The City Discussion Thread

[DRW50]

Two more clips from this episode are up. From one of the previous clips it looks like the day was February 2 or February 3, 1994? Is that right? 

 

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[Vee]

As I'm coming up on the deaths of

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in the LM, I thought now was as good a time as any to finally watch the Loving pilot, full of people who will be out of the picture shortly. I hope you'll all accept my preemptive apology for questions you've all answered before.

 

- WEHT Merrill, Roger and Ann? And I guess Susan Walters/Lorna?

- When did "Clay," Gwyneth and Trisha enter the picture, and where are they?

- Is that really Geraldine Page?? (Who I last saw in John Schlesinger's brilliant and demonic The Day of the Locust, a film I do not recommend watching at the outset of a terrifying global pandemic)

 

The pilot is notably directed by Michael Lindsay-Hogg, esteemed music video director for the Beatles and the Rolling Stones who also helmed the original Brideshead Revisited miniseries a few years prior and the original Broadway production of Agnes of God, and long-rumored to be the illegitimate son of Orson Welles.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Vee

[Forever8]

According to the set of Loving Promos at 1:06. Apparently Gwyn debut in December of 84.

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[OzFrog]

 

Oooh look at how young some of those peeps were back then. And a small glimpse of Roya Megnot as Ava with whom I assume was Perry Stephens’ Jack during their “romance”?

[DRW50]

@Vee I think Roger is killed off (in a plane crash? I don't know). Merrill left, I guess with her affair with Roger ending badly, for a new job - the real reason being, notoriously, the bosses being mad that Patricia Kalember cut her hair. Ann stays on until 1988 or 1989. Her biggest story by the end is probably her triangle with Gwyn over Ava's ne'er-do-well Uncle Harry. 

 

Clay arrives sometime in 1987.  

 

If you ever have time to kill, there are blocks of Jack and Stacey clips from their 1987/88 breakup that aren't all available in the individual episodes. 

 

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[Vee]

The pilot was a mix of interesting and bland, but you can't say the dark, gothic roots weren't there from the start - most of what works about it was all Lloyd Bridges and more importantly, the truly demonic performance from Geraldine Page. Very EON and yes, very Loving Murders. Kalember and the guy playing Roger don't work for me at all. Few others drew the eye beyond poor Bryan Cranston and the loopy woman playing Ann Alden Forbes. Susan Walters had a long way to go!

 

I do wonder how Gwyneth, Trisha, etc. were introduced and why Curtis was there first. It is surreal to see Cabot and the Alden manor set with a predominant focus on not the Aldens but the Alden relations/in-laws, most of whom would be gone in under five years. The Forbes strand of the family is all but a nonentity by '95; no mention is made of Stacey's children being heirs. I know there's been some talk of the first year being more Dan Wakefield and Marland; I wish we knew more about Agnes' hand in things, as she clearly was keen on Chris Marcantel, took notice of Debbi Morgan and later (when?) introduced her next Erica/Mona iteration in Ava and Kate/the Rescotts.

 

A striking contrast: Watching the '95 episodes where Cabot and Isabelle say their sweet but heartbreaking goodbyes. Beautifully written and performed quiet, melancholy scenes, but jarringly contrasted by the hard cut to B&E's edgy new characters, some of whom work and some who just don't - pulsing '90s dance beats throbbing over canted angles as lecherous Danny hits on Cassie and Lisa Lo Cicero slinks about. I don't mind a lot of the hyper-stylization of the period, and I think the LOV of '95 is far more successful than the bulk of that pilot, but what a shift. Yet you can't say evil wasn't in Corinth all along.

Edited May 13, 2020 by Vee

[OzFrog]

 

The Rescotts arrived sometime in 1984, apparently, if this is anything to go by... 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Loving_cast_and_characters?wprov=sfti1

[Vee]

The writing + performance for the killer is so layered in the LM - 

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The moment at the end of #39 where the spectre of "Trisha" - long-haired, face unseen - 'kills' Gwyneth in her dream is terrifying, straight out of Japanese horror.

Edited May 13, 2020 by Vee

[Sapounopera]

 

Roger and Ann left for New York prior to Gwyneth and Trisha showing up. Roger was eventually killed in a car crash and a new Ann showed up. I liked the original actress much better, she was so regal. Peter Brown took over as Roger at some point.

 

I could be wrong, but I also remember Cabot and Isabelle leaving town for a while in 1984. 

 

Clay and his family were in Europe. 

 

The original Alden/Forbes family structure always seemed weird to me. 

[mikelyons]

You can  say that again. Curtis, Clay, Cabot, fake-Clay, Alex...the Forbes'?? Yeah... To this day, it makes my head hurt. Someone needs to write a history of LOVING as a Kindle Single.

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[Vee]

Yeah, it's backwards. By '85 or '86 I guess the Forbeses had all been supplanted by Gwyneth, Trisha, etc.? I wonder whose brainchild bringing them in was.

[mikelyons]

Agreed. Outside of the original pilot and two clip scenes on YouTube, I can't find a single episode of LOVING from 1983! There only seem to be a handful from 1984. I think seeing those episodes might help fill-in the blanks.

[John]

LOVING Reunion

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbM3rbcg0Qw

Edited May 14, 2020 by John

[Forever8]

Noelle Beck is a grandmother with two grandkids and lives in Miami Beach, FL. 

[Vee]

I see you, @EricMontreal22!