OK, maybe that is true, but what about her writing for Ryan's Hope?

The funny thing is, Ryan's Hope is possibly to be my absolute favorite soap! That made her last two headwriting stints even more disappointing to me. RH had the best dialogue of any soap I've ever had the pleasure to see, I doubt its standard of quality could every be replicated in present times.

I also think Labine's age might have something to do with her quality decline. I mean, if she's pushing 70, there's no reason why she should take on the laborious task of headwriting a soap.

Claire has always been a writer who has encountered a lot of network backlash. It would be interesting to see if she were given free reign to write a serial, without any or little outside interference. However, in these times, that is very doubtful.

Edited May 27, 200718 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

I don't know about LML but I'll tell you who shouldn't go: Ed Scott. Oops. Too late.

I know Rauch/P&G tampered a with a lot of her stuff on GL and Clarie was reportedly never happy there, but her failure on OLTL is squarely on her imo.

I think that GL situation is a lovely example of how some pairings work out great (Rauch and Lemay) and how some don't work at all (Rauch and Labine).

THANK YOU.

I don't hate Phyllis.

I hate the way Phyllis is WRITTEN.

Phyllis has ALWAYS been a hypocrite.

An enjoyable hypocrite (more often than not) but still relatively rootable.

But ever since JS & especially LML took over she's gone from enjoyably feisty individual to an obnoxiously smug, needlessly histronic sociopath.

And she definitely aint the only one.

-Nikki's come to embody all the aspects of personality that she used to constantly deride in her husband as well as become a parody of herself.

-Lauren's a simpering coward who's lost her relatively strong moral compass & all of the unique sense of style she once possessed.

-Victoria's lost every bit of backbone & fire she once had only to become a tea servin, hand wringin emotionally masochistic doormat.

-Drucilla became a screeching banshee more concerned with snatchin skanky hoz up at work then bein with her family who were in dire need of her love & attention.

-Mackenzie became a perky, shallow, hypocritical, bubblehead with nothin better to do between stints of slingin coffee & doin her impression of bein the most boringly drab wallpaper EVER.

-Lily's a whiny, flaky little moron who's too absorbed with everyone else's problems to see and/or deal with the problems that have been inherent within her marriage from jump.

-Colleen's become a smirky, self absorbed, twit who refuses to accept any responsibility for her actions & blames everyone else for her problems.

-Katherine's an unapologetic shrew & retired baby theif who doesn't have anything better to do then interfere in her menopause aged daughter's life & give self righteous speeches about incompetency.

-Jill's a desperately pathetic middle aged woman actin like a panting teenager that's more worried about keepin the attention of a man than she is runnin a successful business.

-Amber. Well..she's Amber.

-Gloria. See Amber...except Gloria.

The only one that exhibited any POSITIVE growth was Sharon who went from dingbat with a heart to semi-dingbat with a heart.

And even she's backslidin now that Drucilla's MIA.

ITA with everyone you wrote here! She's another McTavish when it comes to writing strong female characters.... meaning there are none! It just shows how plot driven Latham's vision is.

I once sang the praises of her hiring..... goodness gracious what was I thinking. CBS/Sony can sing all those ratings increases all they like, fact of the matter is look at any message board on the internet and legions of long time Y&R fans are denouncing this woman's vision of the show. I guess CBS took offense to being called the Senior's Network by Frons, they are taking a page from his handbook letting this woman write the show.

Y&R used to be the most stable show and during the 90s I secretly wished that it would go through some backstage drama just so that my fav AMC would overtake it in the ratings. (Sorry Y&R fans. I was really competitive back then.) But it remained so solid that nothing could bring it down. Now however, I predict there will be a new number 1 within the next year. Possibly GH or BB?

Edited May 28, 200718 yr by Jonathan

Well as I mentioned in my previous post, despite all the fan protest and the backstage drama the show still is managing these solid ratings. A rise of .3 in HH last week. Which boggles my mind. I only hope it will soon begin to catch up with Lynn.

I still say alot of lapsed DAYS viewers are padding Y&R's numbers. That's just one theory.

Can you imagine the headlines if Y&R actually lost its crown? Oh I am sure Latham would definitely be fired then.

FALL Y&R FALL!!!!!

Jill's a desperately pathetic middle aged woman actin like a panting teenager that's more worried about keepin the attention of a man than she is runnin a successful business.

The crazy thing about this is that Jill has more than enough stuff to blackmail Katherine with. And these two are FAMOUS for their feud, why does Latham avoid all of the interesting aspects of a character driven story? No way Jill should have to beg Kay for what she wants.

A rise of .3 in HH last week. Which boggles my mind. I only hope it will soon begin to catch up with Lynn.

It looked good, but still a 4.3 is lower than their normal average and they could only go up with a big stunt following a huge ratings slump. Thats also lower than when Dru died, but you see how quick the ratings dropped after that.

Latham plays for stunts, the rest of the time the ratings are in the toilets. Of course if you say Nick or Dru is dying or Sheila's back people will start watching, but once that dies down (extremely fast on her plot driven show) the viewers leave.

ITA with everyone you wrote here! She's another McTavish when it comes to writing strong female characters.... meaning there are none! It just shows how plot driven Latham's vision is.

I once sang the praises of her hiring..... goodness gracious what was I thinking. CBS/Sony can sing all those ratings increases all they like, fact of the matter is look at any message board on the internet and legions of long time Y&R fans are denouncing this woman's vision of the show. I guess CBS took offense to being called the Senior's Network by Frons, they are taking a page from his handbook letting this woman write the show.

Exactly, amcfan. But Latham & McTrash are far from the only ones guilty of not bein capable of writin successful women. That's a disease currently affectin television in general. It's just more prevelant in Daytime cause there's so much more time & material to work with.

Since it ascended to #1, Y&R has been the epitome of Daytime Drama but it's rarely if ever gotten the respect it's rightfully deserved from critics and/or The Emmy's.

But Y&R's fans were familar with & greatly appreciated quality & consistancy.

Two of the biggest criticisms Y&R's ALWAYS recieved is it is/was too "self serious" & it moves too slow.

And despite Y&R acceptin everything in stride those particular criticisms caused a huge rift between as well as a great deal of contempt & apathy from fans of other shows & the industry in general IMO.

However, now that the business has become about pursuin the youth dollar above everything else, CBS really wants to the DOOL "fanatical" fanbase for Y&R.

So what they've done is hired a writer who has a long resume of failures & disgruntled fans of other shows that's dedicated to pushin the show into a mold that it just isn't equipped to handle so as to "update" it.

ABC soaps are ABC soaps.

NBC soaps are NBC soaps.

CBS soaps are a different animal than both.

But as long as the industry chooses not to understand that it can't homogenize soaps or their characters it's gonna be difficult times for everyone.

The crazy thing about this is that Jill has more than enough stuff to blackmail Katherine with. And these two are FAMOUS for their feud,

The Mother-Daughter retcon is killin them.

TPTB need to undo that mess ASAP.

why does Latham avoid all of the interesting aspects of a character driven story?

She has absolutely NO idea who Y&R's characters are or how they're supposed to act individually or with each other, so she avoids character driven stories & emotional climaxes as much as possible which is why she focuses on plot driven storytellin above all else.

No way Jill should have to beg Kay for what she wants.

Exactly.

There's NO way Jill should be almost grovelling for ANYTHING from Katherine.

Mother or not, there are just some things Jill would NEVER do.

once that dies down (extremely fast on her plot driven show) the viewers leave.

Because stuff is convoluted for absolutely NO reason.

As much as I adore MR, BW & VI, they didn't/don't belong on Y&R.

Which has very little to do with the actors/actresses & just about everything to do with the writers.

Now however, I predict there will be a new number 1 within the next year. Possibly GH or BB?

Y&R is the cornerstone of the CBS lineup, if it fall significantly, so will the entire CBS lineup. Hell, many ABC soap fans start off their day with Y&R, so if it falls so will the rest of the soaps on the air. The industry should be very worry if Y&R decreases significantly, because it will take the other existing soaps with it.

Y&R is the cornerstone of the CBS lineup, if it fall significantly, so will the entire CBS lineup. Hell, many ABC soap fans start off their day with Y&R, so if it falls so will the rest of the soaps on the air. The industry should be very worry if Y&R decreases significantly, because it will take the other existing soaps with it.

I agree with this... I don't see some soap staying stable (certainly not rising) while YR falls... I just don't... so if YR falls, so will the others...

The Mother-Daughter retcon is killin them.

TPTB need to undo that mess ASAP.

There's NO way Jill should be almost grovelling for ANYTHING from Katherine.

Mother or not, there are just some things Jill would NEVER do.

I still like the mother-daughter-twist because since when aren't daughters not at odds with her mothers!? Especially when Mommy Dearest has pulled SUCH stunts...

But with such sh*tty writing, what shall we expect.

Just last week when Hurricane Jill cam to the Chancellor manse and was creaming "Katherine!" I was cheering because this was old-school-Y&R. Of course everything is falling glatt like always on this f*cktacular show but still.

I still like the mother-daughter-twist because since when aren't daughters not at odds with her mothers!? Especially when Mommy Dearest has pulled SUCH stunts...

The problem with the Mother-Daughter "twist" is it runs counter to their entire relationship.

It would be like makin Victor, Jack's Father.

Just last week when Hurricane Jill cam to the Chancellor manse and was creaming "Katherine!" I was cheering because this was old-school-Y&R.

It was a parody of old school Y&R IMO.

Jill and Kay should have never been made mother and daughter. If Latham wanted to take the bull by the horns and instead of dreaming up this plot driven angst that is Cane, she should have undid Jill being Kay's daughter.