j swift

The thing that I don't get about Camille is that she is amusingly self-effacing in her 1:1 sessions (remember her humor about having multiple nannies in S1?) and then she is so haughty with the ladies. Also, from DeeDee, (the makeup lady), to Kimber, (the water pourer?), it makes no sense why she takes her hired helpers to social events. One doubts that the great hostesses of society past brought their paid staff to mingle with other upper crusters.

It seems to me that Dorinda's social media posts about Colin Cowie's party planning is the same thing as Ramona asking for pictures in exchange for Larry Scott's party planning. Both required the wives to drive an hour for a PR stunt in service of a free party (with candy in large glass jars at both sites).

Yes, Linden House - what was the etymology of its name?

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think of Erica having an animus toward Donna which may have also kept her out of Palmer's circle for awhile. Also, did Erica's return to Pine Valley coincide with the publication of her first autobiography? I recall a failed appearance at a parade around the time of her return and that she lived with Mona during that period (maybe due to the death of Dr. Tyler?), immediately prior to her relationship with Adam. Did she buy her house after her divorce from Adam and prior to her marriage to Travis? And can anyone recall the name of Erica's house? Finally, was Nina's later friendship/bridesmaidhood with Erica due to Nina's relationship with Matt Connolly who was close with Jeremy?

I think Cassie is a flawed idea given that Minx had switched Brick and Channing at birth, which established Minx as a serial baby concealer. The suggestion that Minx allowed her daughter to be raised at an orphanage (with boys who made regular visits to the Capwells) while years earlier she couldn't bare the thought of her grandson being raised in the Capwell mansion, (right next door), strained logical reasoning. As for storyline potential, the Lockridge estate was always on the brink of foreclosure due to a lack of new income, so Cassie was not immediately wealthy when she came into the family. There was no conflict with Lionel feeling betrayed by having a long lost sibling. There was no discussion of finding Cassie's father. The Angela/Warren coupling was not worth complicating. Cassie and her Musketeers played with Mason as children which would have made her years older than Warren. Finally, the exposition about her birth required the written contortions of both Minx's de-Sorasing and the retcon that Warren was not a Lockridge, (two soap tropes that are not usually appreciated by soaps fans), indicating that Laken was the only child in the family who was actually raised by her biological parents. If the Lockridges fed their only legitimate child her pet pidgin, perhaps Cassie should have been more grateful to those nuns...

My memory is that had more to do with Erica's friendship with Opal, as opposed to being "close" with Palmer.

It's an interesting issue. Around the time of Nina Courtland's first wedding, Phoebe English (I forget if that was her maiden name or if Brooke was her maternal niece) Tyler Matthews Wallingford had banned Erica from most social events due to her mother Mona's relationship with Phoebe's ex-husband Dr. Charles Tyler. Erica was explicitly banned from the country club, nor was she welcome in the yacht club. This was one of Erica's motivations for moving to New York that summer, because her prospects in Pine Valley were sparse. Phoebe, (who was Palmer's next door neighbor), also expressed that she would not attend Nina's wedding if Erica was invited. However, perhaps due to her association with the Kingsleys and the Bogarts, Palmer relented and Erica attended the wedding. Years later the animus between Erica and Phoebe was mostly forgotten and the relationship with Palmer was always cordial but never close; maybe because she never got involved with any of his relatives.

RHOBH - Real question: When the ladies say that they want to "get past" an issue, what do they mean? BTW, this post does not indicate that I condone the behavior of her husband in any way, I just don't know how the woman would measure a resolution beyond simply submitting to their point of view.

Can we talk about the weirdness that was Kristen's party set up by Ridge and Eric for her to meet the "top bachelors" in LA? 1. The Bachelorette owes everything to this episode, from the introductions of the men in tuxedos, to the fact that everyone is casual about this being a 10:1 group date, to the various guys attempts at trying to get "alone time" with Kristen. 2. B&B's odd incestous tone continues, Kristen is in a room of ten single men but chooses to have the first dance with her brother, then Stephanie comes by the pool filled with guys in speedos but she only has eyes for her son, and finally Ridge stares longingly at his sister when she comes into the party (meanwhile, I still contend that Thorne was always cuter and came with less baggage). 3. The dancing would have been campy even in 1988. Styles range from a waltz, to a couple of guys doing the Russian squat dance, to an 80's era slamdance, all culminating in a group dance to an elevator music cover of Janet Jackson's Control. 4. Ridge has speedos brought in for all the guys on a silver platter ("one size fits all"), but poor Storm chooses to wear some baggy briefs. 5. Some of the guys mention on how well Ridge is doing professionally, but nobody comments on the fact that he, and his grown siblings, are all still living in their parent's home. 6. The truly bizarre juxtaposition of having scenes of Kristen's party happening in the same episode that Caroline is dealing with her sexual assault and Donna is about to be exploited by a photographer (maybe Kristen was single because all guys in LA were either unattainable professionals or sexual predators).

So, now that I've found the B&B vault can someone tell me the episode number(s) or date(s) of Kristen's top bachelor in LA toga party when Ridge and her father tried to find her a date? I've seen the pictures and read the articles and now I feel as if I am ready to see the actual episode.

I think the Zoom confessionals are an interesting choice and they add some intimacy to the interactions (especially when Avery zoom bombed her mother talking about Elyse). But, much like every Zoom call that I am on IRL, I wish they would wear earbuds to reduce the ambient sound.

https://classicsodloving.tumblr.com

Agreed, but listening to the lyrics, they don't make any sense. The juxtaposition of the idea that "there's always tomorrow" doesn't fit with the concept that the we "only have one life to live." To me, the idea that we only have one life indicates that we should seize the day, make this moment count and, make the most of the time we have. It does not mean that if this day sucks (or the rain won't end) we should wait until tomorrow for it to get better. Here's where you go When it looks like the rain won't end (Where is he suggesting we go? Lllandview? Asa's house? Llandfair?) and then in the second verse (which we only heard on days with extended end credits) he changes the entire meaning of the song Let's live today And find someone to share it with Cause we only have one life to live Maybe it is just the pandemic, but in hindsight, Peabo lacks logical consistency.

Through a 2020 lens, the casting of Connor Oilvera, (the son of El Patron who was facing deportation), is as anachronistically amusing as his appropriation of new jack swing music. Unlike All I Need, Lady in Red, or (Think of) Laura, Connor's lyrics have no association what so ever with the love story of Anna and Robert. Now That You're Here? Anna and Robert spent years around each other while pursuing other lovers, (and were never written as each other's destiny), so it is not like they just found each other. A more appropriate title would have been Now That We've Exhausted All Other Options (including the alien in my garage and your virgin pianist girlfriend). But, I guess, that's harder to dance to. I'm also amused by the rehearsal dinner scene where Mac had founded a jazz club for live music, but the performers lip synced to video backing footage, very 90's cabaret... Lastly, can we talk about the insta-wealth that all GH characters achieved in 1991? Mac went from an environmental activist to a jazz club owner. A family inheritance caused Bill Eckart to go from a dockworker to buying that gorgeous lighthouse. And his sister Jenny (who for some reason did not benefit from that wealthy dead relative) went from student nurse housing to the Quatermaine mansion! Gloria Monty gave up all pretenses of relatability as soon as those ratings drooped.

After commenting on the 1991 SOD thread I researched Connor Olivera and came up with this old thread: What ended up being Connor's storyline? according to, http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/7967/mlynch.html "His character was a singer at TheOutback, and he was pals with Mac. He also used to teach Robin dance moves. He had a crush on Dominique, but she was hung up on Mac, and ended up marrying Scotty. Connor found out that Sean Donnely is his biological father. Connor left PC to further his music career." Sean Donnelly's son? Did he go to the wedding with Tiffany? How long was he on the show? The actor and his song styling did not age well, but the idea of an expanded Donnelly family tree is intriguing. If anyone has any additional information on this character I would appreciate it.

I appreciate that I'm not the only one who searches for New Day in Eden videos on a regular basis

Andy Cohen mentioned on his radio show that RHONY and RHOBH are subject to delays due to editors who had been unable to complete episodes prior to the shelter in place orders. RHOBH specifically had only finished shooting 3-4 weeks before the lockdown orders were in place. Understandably, the editorial process is difficult to achieve while working from home. Just think about the brilliance of the story editors on both show who are able to interweave flashbacks, music, and hours of footage to create a story. That requires people to log every minute of footage and maintain a database of multiple seasons of filming. These shows film for eight hours a day, five days a week, for months in order to get a cohesive plotline that lasts for 20-22 episodes. Which means someone has to sift through at least 40 hours of footage to achieve a 40 minute weekly episode, or one hour of filming for every one minute of an episode. I was compelled to mention this because I read a comment on Facebook suggesting that the shows were re-tooling to edit out insensitive material; much like RuPaul's Drag Race had done with season 12. However, the obvious difference is that Drag Race was filmed and edited a year ago, so it was achievable to be able to go back and cut out a character and substitute other talking interviews. RHONY and RHOBH stopped filming in January and February respectively, so it would be impossible to back and try to change plotlines. The Bravo shows are simply trying to keep up with current production demands and any conspiracy theories about their motives seem ill-informed.

Thank you for this detail But, it still doesn't fit with the character of Alex that we saw within the plotline of the show. Alex was an upstanding citizen, he fought crime, and younger men, like Tony and Trucker, looked to him for moral guidance. So, what made him become a con artist for those few years? Also, I know the Forbes disappeared after the first years of show, but was the mansion always the Alden's? Or did Roger and Ann live in a different mansion than Cabot and Isabelle? Weren't the Forbes also rich on their own, given the facts of the pilot?

OMG, I totally forgot that Roscoe and Randall were married until I read it in the 1991 SOD on that thread.

Was Robin or Randall's debut timed to coincide with the opening of the Crystal Palace? Also, did RH ever have a Studio 54-esque disco, because they all felt a bit too young to hang out at a Rainbow Room-esque establishment?

According to Another World Homepage, Paulina was born on San Cristobal, off the coast of Panama (I'm guessing it is not the same San Cristobal where Reva Shayne ruled as queen on Guiding Light) and her mother was Maria Hernandez Desilva (which doesn't explain why she called herself Paulina Cantrell, but that's another story). Ken and Mac met Maria while they were reporters. That may account for her blond hair, but certainly not her New Jersey accent (lol). http://www.anotherworldhomepage.com/paulinaf.html With regard to Remy, I've always chalked that up to newer writers who forgot (or never researched) Paulina's history because she and Derek were not raised in Bay City so there couldn't have been an adoption judge in town with more information on the child. Unless, there was an unexplored underground illegal ring of family court judges who worked on the Donna, Paulina, and Sylvie Kosloff (Iris's mother) cases, because that midwestern town sure had a lot of iffy adoptions...

When we re-read SOD from that year in a prior thread the transition from Cali to Judi became clear. Judi moved back to the east coast after working on Days (she may have also had a recent divorce). She tested with several east soaps and finally AW made her the best offer and then they fired Cali. It was toward the end of the "Who shot Jake" storyline, so there was a possibility that Tom Eplin may have been on his way out any way. However, SOD characterized the hire as AW's attempt to raise ratings based on the popularity of the actress because Days had shot to near #1 status during her time on that show. I agree that Cali was the superior Paulina. Despite the fact that both actresses were very waspy blonds playing a South American born character (casting that probably wouldn't fly today). I was a fan of Cali from her time on Ryan's Hope. She conveyed a delicate balance between conniving and vulnerability. She wore those early 90's bandage dresses like no one else. And, she had portrayed a sexuality that Judi never brought to the part (despite her pairing with perma-speedo-clad Julian McMahon). Of course eventually, Paulina went from a South American con artist to an Italian chef with a long lost child who somehow knew to try to find her in Bay City, but that's soaps.

If I were to play time-traveling-imaginary-writer, I would have written it that Alex went to Corrinth to tell the Alden's that Clay was presumed dead. However, when he got there the family assumed that he was Clay. In order to spare their feelings (and because he always wanted to be part of a family), he played along with the ruse. Dan (the other secret agent) or Ava could have served the expository function in order to flesh out Alex's motives. The other issue that was never adequately explored was his attraction to women like Ava, Egypt, and Tracy. Why was Alex always going for the schemers? What was the masochistic origin of his desire to engage with women who always had a trick up their sleeve, and left him feeling as if they were never fully committed to the relationship? Loving was pretty good at exploring characters like Ava, Curtis, and even Stacy. We understood their perspective and most of their choices seemed organic to their values and beliefs. For example, we watched how Ava's early baby-buying story informed her later relationships and desire to have a child. We saw that Curtis always felt like second-best in both his family and relationships and therefore was constantly looking validation. And, even an ingenue like Stacy was allowed to grow after being betrayed by love. However, Alex was purely a plot device. Given the time that soaps have to tell their stories, it always feels like a missed opportunity when the audience doesn't get an analysis of the characters.

What was Alex Master's original motive for "stealing" Clay Alden's identity? He didn't seem to be in it for the money, because he never tried to con the Alden's or raid the coffers of their business. In fact, he was never written as money-hungry, or even particularly ambitious. He didn't initially hate Clay. Their rivalry seemed to build once Clay returned to Corinth and Alex was hypnotized into trying to kill him. He also never expressed any animosity toward the Alden family. He was kind to Trisha and tried to be a stabilizing force to Curtis. Finally, he didn't seem to be trying to uncover any mysteries that would necessitate him going undercover as Clay. I read that the Alex's reveal occurred during a writer's strike and I wonder if that was the cause of the lack of inquiry into his motives. He was one of those odd soap guys, (like Roman Brady or Shane Roberts) who arrived without a backstory but within a few years their entire history became totally convoluted. Alex was not only an escapee from a prison camp (twice), but also a spy-for-hire who was married to Egypt, and a federal agent who had an affair with Tracy Quartermaine when he investigated the mob. Age-wise he was old enough to be the father of Rick (who seemed to be in his early 30's in the mid-1980's), Trisha, and Curtis, (who was nearly the same age as Ava), but young enough to have fought in Vietnam. Also, (much like Roman Brady), only in a soap town could a man who was once brainwashed into being an assassin become the chief of police (there should be a list of all the former spies, foreign traitors, and assassins who join small town soap police forces; I talking to you Anna Devaine and Robert Scorpio). So, I'm left with a couple of questions. Did Alex know Clay was alive when he came to Corinth? Does anyone recall any exposition about his plans? Did Alex ever mention his family of origin? I found this great resource, but there is very little discussion about Alex's true motivation http://www.stybz.com/monszter/RM/lov88.htm

I was referring to early Phoebe and early Liz, before they both developed a sense of humor