Paul Raven

Another World

3,850 posts in this topic

Funny you should bring up Lemay and Rauch decimating the Matthews and Frames. I've often heard it argued in the end they destroyed the success they had created.

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I don't think they meant to do that to the Frames -- they cast a lot of actors in those roles who were not interested in staying long term, they were mostly theater actors.

I do think they had some issues with the Matthews. Lemay's book suggests it was the actors, but I kind of wonder if they resented that this popular, established family was on the show and they had not created the family. They really broke that family up, they killed off or wrote out everyone but Pat and Liz and Russ and the Matthews father (who passed away in the early 80s), and it seemed like Pat and Russ left a few years after Lemay did. Susan came and went but never stayed. The family became very disjointed and scattered and that made it easy for later regimes to snuff them out.

Edited by CarlD2

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Hence my reference of Julia Shearer--Matthews related character played by a young Kyra Sedgwick AND Faith Ford only to meet a violent end.

Also I believe they started AW's trend of nabbing high profile actors for roles. Now granted this always occurs at every soap but it seemed more obvious and frequent at AW. In the late 70s AW hired quite a few for Y&R stars with William Grey Espy, Jennifer Leak, and Janice Lynde, in the 80s AW with multiple ABC stars, and in the the 90s especially in 1991 in which saw three major roles recast with three big daytime stars. However the show could never bring in the ratings, showing that star quality alone could not help the show.

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As regards the Matthews,that family was not really nurtured and positioned correctly to carry on into the 80's.

Firstly,Mary was killed off(rightly or wrongly)leaving Jim a widower.He never remarried,so the opportunity for stepchildren/grandchildren (from his new wife)never materialised.

Russ was married 4 times,yet never had children(Josie didn't come along to the late 80's.)Tracy could have had a child before her death,leaving Russ to raise the child alone(this child could have been sorased in the late 80's and filled the role of Josie.

Alternatively,the 'Josie' character could have arrived in the early 80's from a relationship Russ had earlier(a one night stand)This would have bolstered the Matthews at a time when they needed to be.

Alice was unable to conceive and her adopted daughter Sally,was given a lot of story in the early 80's.however the decision to cast Taylor Miller was,I think a mistake as it was more stunt casting than a desire to write for the character.Anyway,Sally was killed off and that was that.Her son Kevin was never brought back.

Alice was recast too many times after JC left and Linda Borgeson was terrible,When they got Jacquie back,she was backburner.Alice should have been the new matriach and perhaps married and had stepchildren.

Pat hung on through the Lemay years but was foolishly written out,never to return.Again Pat could have remarried and had stepchildren.Mike and Marianne were aged too quickly and written out,never to return,despite the fact they had a lot of story potential.

Liz was given an adoptive grandaughter Julia ,who was killed off after a few years,while her other'grandchild'Ricky,never came to Bay City.

Another way of continuing the family would have been to bring in a child of Janet Matthews(another character who was completely ignored)

Like so many other shows,the core families were left to wither.

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I don't think they meant to do that to the Frames -- they cast a lot of actors in those roles who were not interested in staying long term, they were mostly theater actors.

I do think they had some issues with the Matthews. Lemay's book suggests it was the actors, but I kind of wonder if they resented that this popular, established family was on the show and they had not created the family. They really broke that family up, they killed off or wrote out everyone but Pat and Liz and Russ and the Matthews father (who passed away in the early 80s), and it seemed like Pat and Russ left a few years after Lemay did. Susan came and went but never stayed. The family became very disjointed and scattered and that made it easy for later regimes to snuff them out.

Harding Lemay did not "decimate" the Matthews family. The only family member he wrote off was Mary, and Lemay was the writer who actually brought Liz and Susan back to the canvas. In many respects Lemay strengthened the family by giving Pat front-burner storylines and making her a stronger, more intelligent character and aging her children Michael and Marianne to create conflict in Pat's marriage to John Randolph.

I don't think Lemay resented anything about the Matthews family. His issues were with Ginny Dwyer and Jacquie Courtney because they refused to adapt to his theatrical style. Dwyer and Courtney wanted to continue playing Mary and Alice like a 1950's soap, which didn't work with Lemay's dialogue and tone. Lemay was often times arrogant and snobbish, but I believe he truly wanted to elevate AW to something other than predictable soap melodrama, and on most levels he succeeded. AW remained #2 or #3 during the majority of his tenure, and even when the ratings fell in his last year, it was only by one rating point. Three years after Lemay left, the show's ratings had dropped three rating points. In my opinion Lemay was far better for AW than Paul Rauch.

Rauch was the one who should have been replaced. He is responsible for decimating AW.

Edited by saynotoursoap

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Harding Lemay did not "decimate" the Matthews family. The only family member he wrote off was Mary, and Lemay was the writer who actually brought Liz and Susan back to the canvas.

That's true, but wasn't Liz only gone because the previous actress had passed away from cancer? I thought Susan was usually only a short-term character on her returns.

I didn't mean to overstate what happened to the Matthews family under his watch, but given how important Alice and Mary were to the family dynamics, losing them (or losing the actress most identified as Alice) must have hurt. Perhaps Courtney would have left no matter who was writer or producer.

I guess what happened with Pat's and John's kids was more on Rauch. I never knew why they never brought Michael back.

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Russ was married 4 times,yet never had children(Josie didn't come along to the late 80's.)Tracy could have had a child before her death,leaving Russ to raise the child alone(this child could have been sorased in the late 80's and filled the role of Josie.

Alternatively,the 'Josie' character could have arrived in the early 80's from a relationship Russ had earlier(a one night stand)This would have bolstered the Matthews at a time when they needed to be.

Russ had another daughter name Olivia, aside from his daugther, Josie, with wife Sharlene.

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Another way of continuing the family would have been to bring in a child of Janet Matthews(another character who was completely ignored)

I've read Janet, like Alice, was also unable to have children. This was supposedly part of her backstory. It was why her first engagement was broken off, and she kept it secret for fear it woudl ruin future relationships.

That's true, but wasn't Liz only gone because the previous actress had passed away from cancer? I thought Susan was usually only a short-term character on her returns.

Nancy Wickwire didn't die until 1974. She even appeared on "Days of our Lives" as Phyllis Anderson after departing "Another World."

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Nancy Wickwire didn't die until 1974. She even appeared on "Days of our Lives" as Phyllis Anderson after departing "Another World."

Oh. For some reason I thought she'd stayed with AW until she passed away.

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Quick AW Today ( http://www.anotherworldtoday.com ) update: As of the latest episode posted, Cecile DePoulignac has been murdered! This has split fan opinion on whether it's a brave move or right up there with Maggie DePriest killing Frankie (although Frankie is actually back from the dead now).

Also, Kevin Thatcher, who has been mentioned in this thread recently, is in the AW Today text story as Kevin Fowler (the name of his dead uncle, which he took on). Kevin is involved with Amanda and representing Grant in his custody battle for Kirkland. Kevin vowed revenge on the Frames/Matthewses for sending him from relative to relative (including Aunt Janet who has been mentioned in this thread, because she couldn't have children) when he was younger, after Sally died and Catlin coluldn't take care of him anymore because Brittany was jealous.

Kevin is also involved with TeleNext's GL continuation as a lawyer handling adoption for Rick and Mindy.

Meanwhile, the AW Today Twitter roleplay is also still going strong. The Matthewses feature prominently in that. A tweet limit of 10-tweets-per-character-per-day has been established to make it easier to keep up.

TeleNext has also now set up a Facebook page for AW Today.

Edited by jfung79

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I refused to start reading AW Today because I find it to be a slap in the face as a huge fan of Another World. The show wasn't good enough to keep on the air, but was good enough to try and cash-in online with? (ten years later!) I find it appalling, and now after reading that last post on this thread where they have killed one of my all-time favorite characters, Cecile.....this whole thing saddens me for fans of AW.

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There are some people hoping Cecile did it to herself and it's a fake death. But that's probably wishful thinking. Maybe if enough people write to complain, they will undo the story.

I don't think they're really cashing in on anything since the only money they are getting seems to be from people clicking the clips on Hulu. The intention is good, the execution less so.

I have had problems with how they've rewritten Donna's history too. It was revealed that Donna kept Lucas kidnapped and hidden for years after he was shot to hide her secret about Jenna being her and Carl's daughter.

There are still lots of things I like though, so that's why I keep reading, and the Twitter roleplay is full of fans with great ideas, knowledge of the show, and good writing ability.

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There are some people hoping Cecile did it to herself and it's a fake death. But that's probably wishful thinking. Maybe if enough people write to complain, they will undo the story.

I don't think they're really cashing in on anything since the only money they are getting seems to be from people clicking the clips on Hulu. The intention is good, the execution less so.

I have had problems with how they've rewritten Donna's history too. It was revealed that Donna kept Lucas kidnapped and hidden for years after he was shot to hide her secret about Jenna being her and Carl's daughter.

There are still lots of things I like though, so that's why I keep reading, and the Twitter roleplay is full of fans with great ideas, knowledge of the show, and good writing ability.

From reading a bit of her, I loved Cecile, but, and this is because I have no real connection to AW, but killing her off doesn't seem like such a bad idea to me. I mean it seems she usually came in, caused [[email protected]#$%^&*], then left. Over and over again.

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From reading a bit of her, I loved Cecile, but, and this is because I have no real connection to AW, but killing her off doesn't seem like such a bad idea to me. I mean it seems she usually came in, caused [[email protected]#$%^&*], then left. Over and over again.

It wasn't as bad in execution as it seems on paper. Most of her return visits were lots of fun and full of delicious confrontations with other characters like Rachel or Felicia. When she was bad, she was never seriously bad, as the story was camp (like when she drugged Cass to give her an heir so she could be queen of Tanquir). In her 1989 return, she had bad ideas in mind, like embezzling a charity, but she changed her mind at the last minute.

The only return I didn't care for was the 1996 one, which was very crass and like all of that era, lacking most humor.

To me killing a character like Cecile is just tacky and a bit heavy. She wasn't that type of character.

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