The fog of war in that book is clear in that Thom Christopher gives Paul Rauch credit for putting him and Tonja together. That of course never happened.

Tonja has always been uh, a little off.

41 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Gottlieb only had herself to blame as she was the one who was probably responsible for Elaine's Dorian getting a stronger response from fans. And yes, Robin's return story was not good. I would say it took well over a year for the show to figure out what to do with Robin's Dorian. 

Thanks for the quotes from Gottlieb and Tonja Walker. Tonja had a presence and certainly had some fans on GH but I do question how 'ballistic' viewers went over her being written out. But who knows. 

Gottlieb's quote about prison confuses me as DuAnn didn't go to prison - she died. I didn't remember LeeAnn "LuAnn" in prison either.

Those bondage scenes with Carlo and Alex were scorching at the time and there's no way they'd ever get on now. 

I can definitely see Tonja being very passionate in arguing for her character. Those first few years with Alex were mostly good. Up to somewhere in 1995.

I was also confused by Gottlieb's quotes about the prison scenes. I thought I might have missed something. I'm glad someone was also confused. Having read the entire book, it's amusing to me how often people disagreed about the same events. You really get the feeling that the OLTL set was not the friendliest/closest of sets. Elaine Princi was not mentioned in the book as far as I could tell which I found interesting. They don't even get into Strasser's return to the show or all the problems that came with that return. I can't remember if Strasser ever spoke about the problems on her hotline or on twitter. 

I also wanted to point out something that I found while looking for something about Elaine Princi. I came across an anecdote tells about Marcia Cross being angry that Erika Slezak got to shoot first for the day. 

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

And yes, Robin's return story was not good. I would say it took well over a year for the show to figure out what to do with Robin's Dorian. 

What was Robin's return story? I just remember Dorian luring Clint to Vermont to catch Viki & Sloan's romantic trip.

Tonja was……..something. She was obsessed that she used to be on GH and then downgraded to OLTL. True story: I was visiting the actress who was Tonja’s dressing roommate at OLTL. Tonja had a big, framed photo plastered on the dressing room wall - her GH credit Tonja Walker as Olivia Jerome with the classic GH logo. Tonja’s dressing roommate found it obnoxious. And I can tell you first hand by what I witnessed that day was Tonja causing chaos on the set. This was during the transition period when Rauch was gone and Gottlieb had not started full time yet. (Gottlieb was in and out of the studio depending on her schedule of finishing up other projects before starting OLTL full time.) Gottlieb was not in the studio that particular day. Tonja was holding up production by not being on the set and the director (Peter Miner) was screaming over the studio loudspeaker for Tonja to get on the set - NOW. I did meet Tonja that day as she came into the dressing room when I was visiting her roommate. Tonja was………something. 

1 hour ago, Franko said:

What was Robin's return story? I just remember Dorian luring Clint to Vermont to catch Viki & Sloan's romantic trip.

I'm sure I'm missing a lot, but that, and having Emily Haynes lie Sloan sexually harassed her, and the final break of her relationship with Jason. There was also unintentionally causing Cassie to lose her baby, which I thought was a very crass story choice.

Clearly, they wanted viewers to hate Dorian enough to where they were fine with Viki and Sloan wanting Dorian to be locked up for life, but it was overkill. And Robin also seemed unsure of how to play the material.

@chrisml Thanks for the fragments. I thought Marcia had blasted Erika in the book, which would have made me laugh (and not shocked me as she seems like a bit of a handful).

I transcribed a lot of this stuff when the book first came out, much to the ire of Jeff Giles. (I really should've done less.) I was overenthusiastic about the book. I do remember the Marcia anecdote.

2 hours ago, chrisml said:

They don't even get into Strasser's return to the show or all the problems that came with that return. I can't remember if Strasser ever spoke about the problems on her hotline or on twitter. 

Giles explicitly said in interviews he came back during Carlivati's run, and was much less interested in exploring the in-between years from the '80s/'90s til '07/'08. He also said Robin (among a few others) was a handful to talk to, and was not keen on a long interview. Which is typical of Robin, really.

I think Princi did wonderful work from what I've seen, but it'll always be Robin for me even at her loudest. I don't fault her for her reentry being a little shaky, but for most people outside of here Princi seems to be a footnote.

Edited July 1Jul 1 by Vee

11 minutes ago, Vee said:

I transcribed a lot of this stuff when the book first came out, much to the ire of Jeff Giles. (I really should've done less.) I was overenthusiastic about the book. I do remember the Marcia anecdote.

Giles explicitly said in interviews he came back during Carlivati's run, and was much less interested in exploring the in-between years from the '80s/'90s til '07/'08. He also said Robin (among a few others) was a handful to talk to, and was not keen on a long interview. Which is typical of Robin, really.

I think Princi did wonderful work from what I've seen, but it'll always be Robin for me even at her loudest. I don't fault her for her reentry being a little shaky, but for most people outside of here Princi seems to be a footnote.

I think I avoided most at the time because I have a love/hate relationship with those types of books (more often hate) but thanks for the time you took.

Princi also has some support in Youtube comments, but there's no doubt Robin is the Dorian many are more likely to remember. I think it's easier to have a different opinion when you go back because she had some very strong material, character-defining material, in her run, and then she left, whereas, aside from 94-95, Robin had a very rough road for most of her second (and third) runs.

16 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I'm sure I'm missing a lot, but that, and having Emily Haynes lie Sloan sexually harassed her, and the final break of her relationship with Jason. There was also unintentionally causing Cassie to lose her baby, which I thought was a very crass story choice.

Clearly, they wanted viewers to hate Dorian enough to where they were fine with Viki and Sloan wanting Dorian to be locked up for life, but it was overkill. And Robin also seemed unsure of how to play the material.

Oof, that does sound like a lot, even over the course of a year.

I do really look forward to diving deeper into Princi's years. She is quite impressive, and more nuanced than Robin often was in her 2003-2013 run (because Robin was frankly hurt and scared that she would be let go again if she didn't run at 200%, and said so repeatedly). But I'm waiting for the rest of '91 to go up.

18 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I think I avoided most at the time because I have a love/hate relationship with those types of books (more often hate) but thanks for the time you took.

It's a great book, and very, very candid. There's just enough in there about the middle years from JFP to Carlivati for me.

I wish there were more stories about the JFP years in the book. I'm not a fan of the show during that time, but of the behind the scenes drama lol.

@TEdgeofNightThat story about Tonja Walker makes sense especially with how she behaves today. It's always been my understanding that her contract dispute happened before Gottlieb and that Gottlieb saved her job. I thought that was reported in the press. 

@VeeYour post unlocked a memory. When the book first came out, someone  asked Strasser about the book on twitter and she was upset that she had not been paid to be interviewed. Giles had to explain that this was not a book that would allow for that sort of thing.

The Emily Haynes story was so bizarre. It was one of the few missteps in the Gottlieb era. I don't know what they were going for what that story. I thought Strasser was actively bad when she returned and it made it worse that Princi had been so good. As someone who had not seen Strasser as Dorian before, I was extremely annoyed by the switch. Strasser's return was one of the reasons I stopped watching because I really didn't care about the reignited Dorian/Viki feud. I would later go back, but not for a while.

 

IIRC someone posted a lot of clippings in the last year about Tonja's initial 'exit' in summer '91, which came right as Gottlieb was coming in. I think it was in the wind even under Rauch as they were turning her psycho over Bo and Laura Bonarrigo's new Cassie before he and his team exited, and I'm not sure who executed the famous Loon Lake remote. Pretty sure it was Gottlieb. Much was made in print of how Tonja's final scenes were to be either right after when she was apprehended or very shortly thereafter in custody, and how that changed on a dime.

That happened because Gottlieb reversed this in very short order and Alex was back onscreen in jail while Bo fretted about getting her to confess, etc. maybe a week or two later on-air. Initially she was announced to be out alongside people like Nicholas Walker (Max #2), Hunter Guthrie and Andy #1, Rika Price, et al.  Then a week or two later (per soap press) it was Tonja is staying and James DePaiva is back as Max after all.

I think Tonja was great on the show and rewatching her in the early '90s you see both how funny and terrifying she could be, but she has always been a little bonkers. I remember the years in online chats while she was off the show in the 2000s where she insisted Lindsay Rappaport had to be violently murdered (specifically, this) in order to make space for Alex again.

2 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I have a love/hate relationship with those types of books (more often hate) but thanks for the time you took.

While he was (briefly) here, Giles was also the one who said Thorsten Kaye and Susan Haskell declined to go on the record (and Thorsten refused to return in '11 to cameo because of the acrimony around her firing) but said he was told by someone who would know that Susan gathered the whole cast around on her last days in 2011 and said she'd never been treated so poorly in her career. That's where that anecdote comes from.

Edited July 1Jul 1 by Vee

9 minutes ago, Vee said:

IIRC someone posted a lot of clippings in the last year about Tonja's initial 'exit' in summer '91, which came right as Gottlieb was coming in. I think it was in the wind even under Rauch as they were turning her psycho over Bo and Laura Bonarrigo's new Cassie before he and his team exited, and I'm not sure who executed the famous Loon Lake remote. Pretty sure it was Gottlieb. Much was made in print of how Tonja's final scenes were to be either right after when she was apprehended or very shortly thereafter in custody, and how that changed on a dime.

That happened because Gottlieb reversed this in very short order and Alex was back onscreen in jail while Bo fretted about getting her to confess, etc. maybe a week or two later on-air. Initially she was announced to be out alongside people like Nicholas Walker (Max #2), Hunter Guthrie and Andy #1, Rika Price, et al.  Then a week or two later (per soap press) it was Tonja is staying and James DePaiva is back as Max after all.

I think Tonja was great on the show and rewatching her in the early '90s you see both how funny and terrifying she could be, but she has always been a little bonkers. I remember the years in online chats while she was off the show in the 2000s where she insisted Lindsay Rappaport had to be violently murdered (specifically, this) in order to make space for Alex again.

While he was (briefly) here, Giles was also the one who said Thorsten Kaye and Susan Haskell declined to go on the record (and Thorsten refused to return in '11 to cameo because of the acrimony around her firing) but said he was told by someone who would know that Susan gathered the whole cast around on her last days in 2011 and said she'd never been treated so poorly in her career. That's where that anecdote comes from.

I wonder how Tonja felt about Alex's '97 exit...

I do remember her being a character.

I remember some of those Susan stories now. Frank may be nice to you (if you're on his good side) but Marty was done so dirty. I'm half surprised he didn't kill her off.

Just now, DRW50 said:

I remember some of those Susan stories now. Frank may be nice to you (if you're on his good side) but Marty was done so dirty. I'm half surprised he didn't kill her off.

I'm just pleased they got those couple of lines in on GH a few years ago where Kevin and the visiting Nora made it clear Marty was sane, well and out of trouble, practicing medicine again. (We'll just blame that murder of a shrink on the tattoo people.) Kevin is her friend and colleague, it seems.

1 minute ago, Vee said:

I'm just pleased they got those couple of lines in on GH a few years ago where Kevin and the visiting Nora made it clear Marty was sane, well and out of trouble, practicing medicine again. (We'll just blame that murder of a shrink on the tattoo people.) Kevin is her friend and colleague, it seems.

Glad to hear that. As I think you've said before, they have done well by OLTL, overall, in the GH mentions/appearances.