One thing I’ve really noticed watching 1990-1996 GL is how the show basically is entirely about acting from trauma. Basically the “good” characters had at least some familial love they could rely on. (Though it’s funny how even Frank/Harley were abandoned by both parents and the supposed good parenting Buzz did involved basically raising his daughter as a homeless grifter.)

I’m curious since I never see it come up with Alex in these 1990/1991 episodes-is the Brandon abuse Alex talks about in the mid to late 90s a retcon to explain Alan’s sociopathy and her protecting Alan even as he repeatedly screws over her nephews she claims to love like sons or was Brandon onscreen depicted as consistently cruel and abusive?

16 minutes ago, Spoon said:

@alwaysAMC

1993 Lucy intro Promo

1995 Phillip return promo

1996- 5 short character promos

1993 Lead-up to Roger's shooting promo

THANK YOU! I love this!

So how long did Lucy keep up the southern drawl accent? She definitely didn't have that in 1995 haha.

I like the last Phillip promo of that set the best - where it featured Alex, Alan, Amanda and A-M...even though that story was a dud.

I was always wondering if Dinah got much promo attention since she dominated the show from 1995-1998.

Always love Roger's "Quick! Turn on the light!"

1997 Annie Promo

January 1999 Amnie Promo

1990 Reva exit Promo

1986 Cain and Reva promo

@alwaysAMC IIRC, Lucy's twang went away quicker than Reva's early, thick twang. I think Lucy was from Arizona, although they traveled a lot. Even with GL's troubles- they got regular promos unlike troubled sister soap, Another World over on NBC.

GL, Clarence rap promo 1990

WCBS, Clarence courting SB viewers over to GL

1990 Gilly, Kat and Hamp promo

1996, Some Dinah GL promos around 10:00

Corny 1991 CBS holiday promo

1983 promo featuring "Nick"

I think "Nick" shows up again at either Christmas 1999 or 2000, def around 2004 under Wheeler/Kreizman.

45 minutes ago, Spoon said:

1997 Annie Promo

January 1999 Amnie Promo

1990 Reva exit Promo

1986 Cain and Reva promo

Love the Annie promos! Thanks again :)

39 minutes ago, Spoon said:

@alwaysAMC IIRC, Lucy's twang went away quicker than Reva's early, thick twang. I think Lucy was from Arizona, although they traveled a lot. Even with GL's troubles- they got regular promos unlike troubled sister soap, Another World over on NBC.

Interesting. I always wonder about characters that lose their accents over the years, were they originally intended to be short-term characters and got extended, or did the actors just get tired of it (like the recast Eleni and her Greek accent haha).

32 minutes ago, Spoon said:

1996, Some Dinah GL promos around 10:00

These were great! That A-M/Lucy honeymoon boat sinking promo was good.

I can't believe they had a Gilly/Vivian/Griffin promo - gross haha.

Way too many Lonatrat promos thoughtout the year, with both Harts.

Happy to see Blake/Ross/Rick/Amanda get a couple promos too!

I'd love to see any Lucy/A-M/Brent/Marian promos from 95/96. I didn't see any with a quick search sadly.

Edited Saturday at 06:23 PM2 days by alwaysAMC

1 hour ago, GL95 said:

I’m curious since I never see it come up with Alex in these 1990/1991 episodes-is the Brandon abuse Alex talks about in the mid to late 90s a retcon to explain Alan’s sociopathy and her protecting Alan even as he repeatedly screws over her nephews she claims to love like sons or was Brandon onscreen depicted as consistently cruel and abusive?

When Brandon was shown in the late 1970s, he was a sick, broken man in a nursing home. The backstory was that Alan had stolen the company from his father, the implication was that he was a terrible father, but as far as I can remember, few real details were given. Alan seemed a little bit sh!tty for neglecting his sick father, in fact.

Alan talked to Hope about his family when they were on the deserted island, but, again, he gave very few details. He did confess that he thought he hadn't been a very good father to Phillip up to then, but that he was still a way better father than Brandon.

Brandon retaliated for Alan stealing the company by leaving all his Spaulding stock to Amanda without ever explaining that Amanda was Alan's daughter. (Yeah, I know, that was changed later, I refuse to acknowledge it).

During the Dobsons and Marland eras, it was never mentioned that Alan had any siblings. Alex was mentioned the first time just before she returned to Springfield. They explained her long absence by saying she floated around Europe most of her adult life.

Alex comes back with a clear vengance agenda against Alan because she thought he conspired with her father to steal her son from her. Because this was the point where Chris Bernau made his first exit from the show, they didn't spend a whole lot of time on this. Clearly, Alex wanted her father's love, she named her kid after him, but the implication again was that he was a terrible, very controlling father.

Then they brought Brandon back to life--ugh, another thing I prefer to ignore. They concentrated on the mystery story more than the relationship between Alex and Brandon. They did reveal that their mother died when Alan was born (but not before she killed someone) so they grew up motherless.

The one time Alex and Alan had an honest discussion about their father was during the storyline when everyone thought Reva was going to die. Alan had switched DNA results to make it look like Josh wasn't Marah's father. Alex found out and was going to tell him. Alan reminded Alex how they always looked after each other, how he had protected her from their father. Because of this, Alex agreed to keep the secret.

So there was another heavy implication that Brandon was an abusive father. If not physically, then mentally and emotionally. They were clearly terrified of him when they were growing up.

So, no, Brandon being an abusive father was not a late retcon--it was implied for many years.

Edited Saturday at 06:44 PM2 days by DeeVee

46 minutes ago, Spoon said:

I think "Nick" shows up again at either Christmas 1999 or 2000, def around 2004 under Wheeler/Kreizman.

He definitely shows up other Christmases--1986 (he gets Alan to help out blind and homelss people), 1987 (he helps Chelsea deal with Phillip's lingering feelings for the "dead" Beth), and 1988 (he helps Alan Michael and Harley who are fighting about getting married). I would assume 1989 because Long was still writing the show, but I don't remember that one.

15 hours ago, DeeVee said:

I recall there was a TV Guide article about the process of casting for soaps, and they used Sam's casting as a case study. Interestingly, Long was not for Suzy Cote. There was a blond actress in the running that she preferred. (Unfortunately, I can't remember her name). So she was overruled. I think she liked the other actress for more reasons than her physical appearance, but it is interesting that they didn't stop to think about family resemblence.

When they cast Amanda's mother Jennifer and sister Morgan, the three of them looked like they could really be related--they all had the same freckles! And definitely when they cast Grant and Carl as Phillip and Alan Michael, they both looked like their biological families. Rick I think was meant to look like his mother Leslie. And the Reardons...every single one of them looked like they belonged in that family. (Except for Sean, he was an outlier, LOL. But his son and daughter looked like Reardons).

Or course, appearance shouldn't be the primary reason they cast someone, but it is nice when people in the same family look related.

I remember Suzy Cote said that Calista Flockhart (Ally McBeal) was heavily in the running for the role of Sam... so I'm gathering perhaps Calista was whom Long had in mind for the role of Sam. She later played the bit part as a babysitter that neglected Marah causing Marah to be kidnapped during the Sonni story so perhaps the casting people threw her a bone with that bit part after going with Suzy Cote as Sam.

To everyone's point about GL and their lack of long term rivals, I kind of liked that the show didn't operate with that trope. There were times watching Y & R with Jill/Kay that I thought the long term rival trope really diminished both characters and made them both look petty and pathetic.

Nadine/Vanessa didnt like one another and it was usually stemming from two particular elements.... classism (Nadine was working class that wanted more while Vanessa was a purebred snob) and over a man (originally Ross and later Billy). Once Billy finally opted for Vanessa... Nadine eventually retreated back to the world she tried to escape and actually grew as an individual.. becoming a warmer person that learned to love what she had instead of always focusing on what she didn't have while Vanessa eventually moved on with Billy and later Matt. I recall that Nadine was even at the wedding of Vanessa and Matt.. which surprised me, but perhaps they let bygones be bygones.

To me, the only examples of long term feuds I could think of were Roger/Ed (with periods of a truce between them), Alex/Mindy (and that diminished both characters after awhile), and Alex/India (benefited from India coming and going on and off during the years).

Edited Saturday at 07:07 PM2 days by Soaplovers

4 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

I remember Suzy Cote said that Calista Flockhart (Ally McBeal) was heavily in the running for the role of Sam... so I'm gathering perhaps Calista was whom Long had in mind for the role of Sam. She later played the bit part as a babysitter that neglected Marah causing Marah to be kidnapped during the Sonni story so perhaps the casting people threw her a bone with that bit part after going with Suzy Cote as Sam.

WOW, that's INTERESTING. Again, I don't remember the name of the actress that Long favored, so yeah, it's absolutely possible Flockhart is the one being referred to in the TV Guide article.

And you know what? Flockhart would have been more believable as a Marler!

@DeeVee I meant from where AlwaysAMC is at in 1999, I didn't make that clear. The one with LuJack was replayed in that 90s Christmas clip show.

Edited Saturday at 07:18 PM2 days by Spoon

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

When Brandon was shown in the late 1970s, he was a sick, broken man in a nursing home. The backstory was that Alan had stolen the company from his father, the implication was that he was a terrible father, but as far as I can remember, few real details were given. Alan seemed a little bit sh!tty for neglecting his sick father, in fact.

Alan talked to Hope about his family when they were on the deserted island, but, again, he gave very few details. He did confess that he thought he hadn't been a very good father to Phillip up to then, but that he was still a way better father than Brandon.

Brandon retaliated for Alan stealing the company by leaving all his Spaulding stock to Amanda without ever explaining that Amanda was Alan's daughter. (Yeah, I know, that was changed later, I refuse to acknowledge it).

During the Dobsons and Marland eras, it was never mentioned that Alan had any siblings. Alex was mentioned the first time just before she returned to Springfield. They explained her long absence by saying she floated around Europe most of her adult life.

Alex comes back with a clear vengance agenda against Alan because she thought he conspired with her father to steal her son from her. Because this was the point where Chris Bernau made his first exit from the show, they didn't spend a whole lot of time on this. Clearly, Alex wanted her father's love, she named her kid after him, but the implication again was that he was a terrible, very controlling father.

Then they brought Brandon back to life--ugh, another thing I prefer to ignore. They concentrated on the mystery story more than the relationship between Alex and Brandon. They did reveal that their mother died when Alan was born (but not before she killed someone) so they grew up motherless.

The one time Alex and Alan had an honest discussion about their father was during the storyline when everyone thought Reva was going to die. Alan had switched DNA results to make it look like Josh wasn't Marah's father. Alex found out and was going to tell him. Alan reminded Alex how they always looked after each other, how he had protected her from their father. Because of this, Alex agreed to keep the secret.

So there was another heavy implication that Brandon was an abusive father. If not physically, then mentally and emotionally. They were clearly terrified of him when they were growing up.

So, no, Brandon being an abusive father was not a late retcon--it was implied for many years.

Is that Marah test story also around the time Alex and Alan have flashbacks of when he protected Alex from Brandon's abuse by saying he broke a vase, rather than her cat?

I think it was you or @P.J. who mentioned how various regimes would change how Alex and Alan felt about Brandon, sometimes in the space of months or a year.

The Spauldings had such an unnecessarily convoluted backstory and sometimes I'm surprised they lasted to the end. I guess bringing Alan back is what cemented their longevity, as you could always have him around to twirl a mustache.

3 hours ago, DeeVee said:

This had to be deliberate because Long was actually VERY good at using history in her stories. As you said, it becomes awkward because then it reminds the audience that Roger was a serial rapist, not someone who raped Holly because he "loved her so much," or whatever. There was total rewrite of history, both to keep Roger a viable leading man, and to keep up their "star-crossed" lovers schtick with Roger and Holly.

Also, by making the choice to write out Alan the first years of Roger's return, all the nuances of their rivalry from years before were pretty much gone once Alan was brought back. He should have been there for the time Roger was married to Alex. Back in the day, Roger was the major threat to both his personal/family life and his business.

Even the way they wrote Alan out--having him chase Roger with a gun--was completely out of character and went against their history. He had the perfect opportunity to kill Roger when he "faked" his death. But Alan never went that far, and he certainly wouldn't dirty his own hands. To him, money was the way to solve problems, not violence. By the time he returned, Roger was in no way a threat to Alan. He had reason to hate his @ss, sure, but no reason to kill him. HOLLY had more reason to shoot him.

Obviously, bringing Roger back was the right move. And at that point, save a very few, Roger hadn't actually interacted with anyone still in town. I just wish they had found a way to handle the Roger/Holly interaction differently, not as "star crossed love" but as a clearly toxic relationship that Holly got to put behind her.

@DRW50 I'm not sure Alan and Alex ever really changed how they felt about Brandon, but there were times that their relationship would change on a dime.

Edited Saturday at 09:28 PM2 days by P.J.