Jack likes the crazy.

Maybe that's why I like him so much with Mary Jane, who is just delightfully insane. It's funny to see three actors absolutely WASTED by AMC now doing brilliant work on Y&R, Billy Miller, Elizabeth Hendrickson and Stacy Haiduk.

No. But I thought that was good acting. My mistake.

I didn't say it was bad, just...so much. Thursday or Friday's episode was titled "Sharon's Breakdown" and I thought to myself "Isn't that everyday?".

(borne of a shared hatred for Phyllis)

No.

It wasn't.

I'm sorry but the Winters should HATE Phyllis. There should be a rivalry there. If CK could do more, Lily should have some vendetta against Phyllis. Not that it was Phyllis's fault for Dru going off the cliff, but I just don't think that Lily should be doing photo shoots with Phyllis and stuff. There should be some subtext between these two women.

EXACTLY!

Maybe that's why I like him so much with Mary Jane, who is just delightfully insane.

Indeed.

Jack loves the crazy & the crazy loves Jack.

If Mary Jane keyed a heart into Jack's car door he would propose.

I'm sorry but the Winters should HATE Phyllis. There should be a rivalry there. If CK could do more, Lily should have some vendetta against Phyllis. Not that it was Phyllis's fault for Dru going off the cliff, but I just don't think that Lily should be doing photo shoots with Phyllis and stuff. There should be some subtext between these two women.

Definitely! I seem to recall some very cordial Phyllis-Neil scene recently (I can't remember context now), but I thought total bullsh!t.

ETA: I'm wrong about the origins of the Sharon-Dru friendship?? What was the origin story?

Edited May 23, 200916 yr by MarkH

Definitely! I seem to recall some very cordial Phyllis-Neil scene recently (I can't remember context now), but I thought total bullsh!t.

ETA: I'm wrong about the origins of the Sharon-Dru friendship?? What was the origin story?

I don't know - i was on tour during that whole year and I've only read synopses and scene clips and stuff.

It's funny to see three actors absolutely WASTED by AMC now doing brilliant work on Y&R, Billy Miller, Elizabeth Hendrickson and Stacy Haiduk.

Amen!

Tamara Braun & her elbows should be on B&B soon.

Actually, it was a more general observation, Ann_SS, and I wasn't actually disagreeing with you--just drawing a general inference. I think your observation is actually in the majority! Think how hated Lauralee's Christine is/was (for a variety of reasons). I think these shows continue to try to give us the traditional 'innocent vinctim heroine'...but I don't think she's very appealing to the audience anymore. I think the "sharp witted soap heroine" would be much more popular.

lov

THAT SAID, and I very much like EH as Chloe...would you call her a "heroine"? That label doesn't seem to apply to her, for me. But if you do think she's a heroine, I wonder when she became that for you?

I consider Chloe a soap vixen very much in the mold of Carly Tenney on ATWT. Chloe is capable of scheming and doing questionable deeds, but is not all bad. I do not like every soap vixen on the soaps that I watch, but I do like Chloe just as I liked Carly when she first appeared on ATWT. Hendrickson has sold me on Chloe like Maura West sold me on Carly. Her Carly was ruined when she got involve with Jack and I fear the same thing is happening to Chloe with Billy.

I have not liked any of the Macs. I find the character has always been uninteresting. I do happen to like some good old traditional soap heroines though I like them even more when they have personality. I loved the first two versions of Colleen. ALColleen's bitchy toast to Victoria at her engagement to Brad was classic. I have never liked CKLily, but was a huge fan of DSLily. I loved Greenlee on AMC before her involvement with Ryan. I love Robin on GH. I like some bitchiness and sharp edges in my soap heroines.

Edited May 23, 200916 yr by Ann_SS

I consider Chloe a soap vixen very much in the mold of Carly Tenney on ATWT. Chloe is capable of scheming and doing questionable deeds, but is not all bad. I do not like every soap vixen on the soaps that I watch, but I do like Chloe just as I liked Carly when she first appeared on ATWT. Hendrickson has sold me on Chloe like Maura West sold me on Carly. Her Carly was ruined when she got involve with Jack and I fear the same thing is happening to Chloe with Billy.

I have not like any of the Macs. I find the character has always been uninteresting. I do happen to like some good old traditional soap heroines though I like them even more when they have personality. I loved the first two versions of Colleen. ALColleen's bitchy toast to Victoria at her engagement to Brad was classic. I have never liked CKLily, but was a huge fan of DSLily. I loved Greenlee on AMC before her involvement with Ryan. I love Robin on GH. I like some bitchiness and sharp edges in my soap heroines.

Yeah, like I said, I think yours is the majority opinion, and one I share. But I think what was said upthread...that "heroines" (in the classic sense) don't really exist is probably also true. I don't think that is necessarily a bad thing.

I loved Greenlee on AMC before her involvement with Ryan.

GreenPea was a heroine?

The real problem is that heroine has become synonymous with victim. Perpetual victim. Marty is a heroine on OLTL because her whole character is about her victimization, Christine was a heroine because she was constantly being attacked by various evil people, Lily is a victim because she's dumb as a box of rocks.

Heroine should be more than about how many people can make you look like a fool.

Heroine should be more than about how many people can make you look like a fool.

Quote worth keeping!

Tamara Braun & her elbows should be on B&B soon.

Flan and Tams would probably hit it off, if you know what I mean.

The real problem is that heroine has become synonymous with victim. Perpetual victim. Marty is a heroine on OLTL because her whole character is about her victimization, Christine was a heroine because she was constantly being attacked by various evil people, Lily is a victim because she's dumb as a box of rocks.

Heroine should be more than about how many people can make you look like a fool.

Lily is a text-book heroine. She is very sweet, not too bright (Oh hey you're from Austrailia, tell me about your life history- now that we're on our honeymoon), she's very moral and not the easiest to get in bed and bad things happen to her. She was so much interesting in her s/l with Kevin.

Flan and Tams would probably hit it off, if you know what I mean.

From the teasers it looks like there's a twist in the MJ storyline about Victor's plan to destroy Jack. Do you think the twist is that Victor wants her to kill him? Or frame him for something horrible?

And did you catch the voicemail she left for Victor stating that it's all back to business - the way Victor wanted it. So I guess Victor didn't approve of her sleeping with Jack.

From the teasers it looks like there's a twist in the MJ storyline about Victor's plan to destroy Jack. Do you think the twist is that Victor wants her to kill him?

Don't read if you don't want to know what I've heard, and please don't hang the messenger, LoL.

I've been told that Victor will be going down a very dark path this summer and he's going to be operating in complete bastard mode when it comes to Mary Jane. I was also told -- by someone else (pretty reliable) -- that he's gonna try to get her to kill Jack.

Edited May 23, 200916 yr by Kennylicious