Loving/The City Discussion Thread

[danfling]

"Ned's sister Lotty was Lorna Forbes' cellmate, and later married Curtis (I believe when Burke Moses was playing the role) and dealt with her scummy common law husband Eban Japes (Matthew Cowles)."

 

Lotty was also illiterate (which made her feel inferior to Curtis) and was taught to read by Lorna.

[John]

Lotty died off camera when Chip Albers took over as Curtis in 1989 correct?

[Soaplovers]

Lorna...a character that fell by the wayside even before she was recast.  I wonder if the change of writers was the rrason.

[dc11786]

Lorna always had interesting story potential (a romantic dalliance with Doug Donovan, a potential rivalry with Stacey, possibly aligning herself longterm with Dane and the Beechams against her own family) but none of that really went anywhere. I would say that Ava basically squashed Lorna in the long run, but I don't think that was Marland's original intent. I think the show would have been more successful if they had played a frienemies relationship between Lorna and Ava, unlikely allies who would occasionally stab each other in the back. 

 

When Nixon took over from Marland, the character of Lorna changed. Nixon, and possibly Ralph Ellis, shifted the landscape and Lorna's romance with Linc  Beecham went from a possible threat to the Aldens and AE to a more traditional conflict involving a secret wife, a faked pregnancy, and a wrongful murder accusation. None of this seemed to effect the Alden clan the way it should have. Lorna went from a damaged young woman with money who lashed out to a damsel in distress. Even if Parker O'Hara didn't take over, the character would not have been successful with that direction. 

 

I can see now why Nixon made the decision to make Lorna a more traditional heroine, but it limited the story potential. Lorna needed to be further entrenched into the affairs of the Alden family, not further withdrawn. Her romance with Zack Conway sounds lame and the crazy ex-sister-in-law didn't provide much long term conflict. I think there may have been some potential with Kelly Conway, Zack's daughter, as she was a troubled young woman who had many issues like Lorna had. It would have made more sense if it had happened down the line. Especially if they had gone the route of playing Linc and Lorna for a few years, then having Lorna become bored and sleep with Nick Diantos, the guy after her cousin Trisha. Then, they could have had Lorna go on trial for murdering Nick and introduced Zack and Kelly then. 

 

Lotty and Curtis left for Germany in November 1987, I think. Ned joined them several weeks later. I'm pretty sure when Curtis returned from Germany he said Lotty had died. 

[Sapounopera]

 

Patty Lutz's Ava was more like Nola, since Douglas Marland created her. At least this is how a remember her.  She was  a construction worker, the last kid of many, living with her widowed mother who ran a boarding house. 

 

Roya's Ava was mini-Ava and Lisa's was more like OLTL Tina. 

[rlj]

So was Stacey.  IMO og Ava was sexy and sultry, her and Jack were mutually attracted to each other, og Nola was desperate and obsessed with Kelly, reminds me of RH's Delia lol

You forgot Edy Vogel Donovan

[NothinButAttitude]

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[DRW50]

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[John]

After Watching Christine tudor confess as The LOVING Killer, I just cant buy Elizabeth Savage as Gwyn. Did others like Savage in the role?

[DRW50]

From the little I've seen of Tudor's first run she wasn't far off this. 

 

I do think Savage has a different style, but it works for me. The scene where she tried to kill Clay after he helped lead Trisha to lose her baby was good.

[NothinButAttitude]

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[DRW50]

It actually is jarring to see Tudor back in that first clip - I think it's the physical difference more than the acting. 

 

So what was this story with Wally's brother who is so bad (and is presumably played by the same actor)?

 

I've always wanted to see more of Ilene on Loving but a lot of this stuff has seemed very throwaway. 

[NothinButAttitude]

I didn't know that Monty liked Rocky. He seemed liked a genuine guy in the last episode when he was with Abril. Now it makes sense why Carly can't stand him. 

 

While I typically don't care for stories surrounding paternity of babies (as they are so outdone), I find this to be intriguing. I'm loving how Carly and Abril's stories somewhat mirror and are bound to cause havoc upon them being unraveled. 

[victoria foxton]

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[dc11786]

I jumped a bit all over the place this weekend with "Loving" so forgive the scattered nature of this post. 

 

Watched the scenes of Chip Albers' Curtis coming home from Germany. I always forget that Ann was recurring at the time. It was kind of bizarre seeing her and Curtis together, though I did enjoy his passing shot about Jack at the Alden family dinner. Curtis' return was a lot better handled than I expected with the scenes with Gwyn, Trisha, and even Ava. I have a much better appreciation for Albers, but I still feel his Curtis was a light weight. I don't necessarily blame Chip Albers for that, but rather the writers. I wonder how Albers would have done if they had written him more like Rick. In particular, I would have been interested in seeing someone with more history (Curtis) involved in the Jack / Stacey / Lily story in 1987-1988. 

 

I didn't realize that Dave and Tally Hindman, the children of Officer Hindman, were around as long as they were. Saw both characters at Trisha's bridal shower / bachelorette party where Curtis and Dave appeared in drag to be among the women. I believe I also saw another actor, Eric Griffin, credited in one of the later 1990 episodes that have been posted.

 

I watched the April 1990 episode that is available on youtube. I really liked the Dane / Ava story as they had history during Dane's first go around. I believe he spotted her the money to give to her sister Sherri so she could buy baby Johnny off her. I cannot tell if Dane is tricking Ava into thinking he is dying or if she has just jumped to conclusions. Either way, I thought the scenario was fun even if Ava faking a phone call to a mechanic was overdone even by 1990. 

 

The April / May 1991 episodes are surprisingly strong. I thought the B-story involving Stacey and Jack moving into the mansion complete with Ava poking around the Forbes house (which I never realized was Stacey's childhood home) was pretty humorous. When Trisha and Trucker arrived, I thought it was logical to have them rent the house. I really hope more of that story pops up with Jack and Stacey. I thought the scenes with Carly at the Paradise Bar were really remarkable. It was nice to get more insight into Carly and Paul's past. I actually have a lot of trouble deciding who I want Paul with. This story also allowed Lisa Peluso to play Ava's vulnerable side, which Peluso does so well. The Ava-Carly dynamic is so rich it really is a shame that no one thought to bring Coleen Quinn back on a permanent basis. I think I would much rather have seen Paul and Carly, separated, back in Corinth and not seen Tess and Buck. 

 

While watching the November 1991 episode, I'm not only struck by how quickly things change in Corinth. Trisha, who wanted Tommy because she was infertile, is remarkably pregnant again. I thought the Checkers scenes with Michael/Ruthie (is that the girl's name) and Paul / Ava were sweet. I wonder what happened to Ava's boutique. I'm not overwhelmed by the Hunters in Corinth though I could see why bringing Ceara in would make sense given Matt's story. Matt Ford was really interesting. Was that Jason Wiles as the drug dealer, Reggie? I always like seeing what happens to people who worked mainly under Claire Labine. Munisteri's period definitely has a Labine-esque feel without the noteworthy dialogue that usually accompanies a Labine show. Maybe this episode just was a rarity. It reminded me a bit of Paul Avila Mayer and Stephanie Braxton's work on "Search for Tomorrow," but I think their dialogue for certain characters was spot on while others was clunky. 

 

There were some really lengthy therapy scenes with Stacey and Jack in there somewhere when Perry Stephens was still in the role. I thought those were pretty rich scenes that gave Stacey and Jack some more depth than I expected. I didn't remember, or possibly know, that Jack had implied that Stacey was overtly sexual with Rick. For one, it's hard to imagine Lauren Marie Taylor as overtly sexual, but its also a rather fascinating layer to the Jack / Rick conflict and the tension in Jack / Stacey's marriage. I really cannot see any show today even attempting anything like that with any sort of depth.

 

The credits are always funny. Wesley Addy is listed one minute in April, but Joe Breen and Augusta Dabney aren't. There were a couple of other mistakes I picked up. It was also interesting to see that Tom King departed the writing staff in mid-April leaving Millee Taggert to fly solo until she was booted; I believe for Mary Ryan Munisteri.