August 28 - September 1, 2006

[cal3]

ABCD is playing with fire in the "lapsed" viewer category. I do belive there are lapsed or lapsing viewers out there like myself but ABCD is not making any real attempt to reach out to them and bring them back. I got the newest ABCD survey and it asked what soaps out of the nine I watched and how often and it then asked which out of those I said I didn't watch I had in the past. I selected GH and I wonder exactly what they might do with that info. More to the point what it would take to get me interested in watching GH again. I checked back in for the virus sweeps to see Robert but it was nothing more than a stunt and a bad one at that. I loved Robert and Robin's connection. Yet we got a poorly written you're an SOB dad for that and little more and Rober has functioned as little more than window dressing. Here's the thing I turned GH off because I hated Sonny, Carly and Jason. I'm not coming back for Sonny, Carly and Jason.

OLTL has undone all the right stuff Malone II did manage to accomplish. For all that Malone and Griffith did wrong they were correct in reestablishing Viki and her kids as a focal point of the show. Now FV is little better than JFP (actually he's worse). We're soon back to Jess and Nat with Viki as window dressing, NuClint who has lost the very things that always made the character a success and new characters that the audience has little connection to. Spencer, Paige and Hugh might as well be Sam, Lindsay, Will, Ben and Grace.

The longer ABCD lets their lapsed and lapsing viewers walk away the harder it is to get them back and they aren't coming back to watch the very things they walked away from. There is going to have to be real change.

[Toadstool]

Cal, I agree that ABCD is playing a very dangerous game with lapsed viewers. Speaking as a viewer on the edge of packing it in, once I do it will be hard to get me back. I'm starting to hold grudges, make ultimata about returning and down the road comes the indifference of "it's just another TV show" and "TV shows come and go all the time" - except soaps are not just regular TV shows and given their format must rely on stronger viewer loyalty than that. I'm angry, I'm frustrated, and I'm asking if it's all worth it - OVER A TV SHOW!

I've done my bit. I've given OLTL decades of loyalty; I've stuck it out while others gave up ages ago. But if they don't care anymore why should I? It feels as though my show ended years ago and I'm one of the last to know. ( sounds like OLTL and I need a marriage counsellor! - well often a marriage counsellor's job is to tell the partners when to call it a day)

I'm not at the point of no return yet for OLTL but I'm long past it with AMC and GH; I left them a while ago and haven't looked back (at least not on my TV screen). Once I reach that point with OLTL, and believe me the resentment will be even greater for my once favorite, I won't be back no matter what the improvements.

[cal3]

Me too.

I've noticed that I have had a complete change in attitude with regard to OLTL. There is something almost passive aggressive about the content of the show at this point which is inspiring my new tude towards the show. Under JFP and Tomlin I got bored and was just short of gone but I didn't have an anger towards the show. Now I'm angry. The manipulation is so in your face it's appalling. Add to that the bad writing, the bad acting and the vision to transform OLTL into some new show and I'm not in for the ride.

I think what Christmas at Llanfair will be this year or will it be more of a Vega/Williamson Christmas with Viki sitting alone?

[Toadstool]

If Llanfair is mentioned at all this Christmas, it will be about everyone dancing to the tune of "let's make this a good Christmas for poor traumatized John McBain"

[danthig]

I believe Hogan's theory on this one.You can look at the ratings archives from just the early 80's when it was in a ratings slump.Days can easily get their viewers back because the fans will watch when the show it is really good.Even when Reilly first came back he was able to bring back viwers temporarily when the Salem Stalker Killings.The show was dying under Higley's pen.The show even hit a 4.1 rating the day Marlena was revealed as the killer and put it right behind Y&R for weeks and then the novelty wore off.There is an audience of lapsed viewers obviously because they know Reilly is gone and soon good things are to come.Long Live Days.Hopefully if and when Hogan Sheffer makes the ratings rise that DAYs contract expires in 2009 that there would be now trouble with renewal.

[Jess]

There is something about Days that always made me as a former viewer want to go back. Now that I have gone back, it's a good show. I have to agree with Hogan, viewers do want to go back to that show. I don't know about ABC soaps. With me, it's more than just not liking the show right now. It's the disrespect that viewers are shown by the network and shows.

The outpouring of support for Dan and Heather made absolutely no difference to ABC. I almost see Frons and Frank sitting in a big office smoking cigars and laughing about the fallout. The same thing applies to the total destruction of the Buchanans and the elevation of the Vegas and Williamsons. People don't like it, and it shows in the ratings, in viewer feedback and they just don't care.

So I think there is a difference between a lapsed fan, which DOOL has, and fans who don't see the same show anymore. OLTL is not OLTL anymore. I don't know what it is, but I don't recognize this show. Toups, I'm not sure backstage changes can make a difference if the core of these shows is gone.

What is stunning to me is the disrespect for viewers and also what appears to be a total, total misunderstanding of what inspires people to watch daytime. One last note: soaps aren't in trouble. Daytime soaps are. Nightime is returning to a soap format on many shows -- Grey's Anatomy, Desperate Housewives, ect. and those shows are rocking. Daytime might consider returning to what daytime does bes t-- good traditional character driven soaps -- like Grey's Anatomy. I think that is what Days is doing now.

Y

[Toadstool]

Exactly!

[SteveFrame]

Yes and now my local affiliate is moving ATWT back to 1 o'clock opposite it. I have never stopped watching ATWT and don't see giving it up, but what I have watched of Passions has been pretty good, and I am looking forward to JER pushing the limits in October.

I will just have to get my VCR working.

[RalphOrtiz]

The ABC soaps are trying too hard to look modern and cutting edge, especially AMC. The scenes in the bar are like watching a music video. Also, someone mentioned that the camera isn't as shaky as it used to be. True, but they should just go back to the original camera work. Their writing is already shaky enough.

[Sylph]

How is this calculated? As an average?

[bellcurve]

After having sampled a full week of MyNetworkTV, I believe AMC experimented with this to look as "cool" as those shows do, sort of as a pre-emptive strike.

Think about it: in addition to competing with daytime TV, AMC is also competing with primetime TV. SOAPnet and MyNetworkTV are in direct competition with each other for the 8 and 9PM hour.

I expect to see all the ABC shows go "film-look" crazy by 2007.

[rsmith2k2]

I think this is probably true, plus I read a quote somewhere that it's cheaper (probably the primary reason).

Alternate theory, JHC is trying to appear as though she's actually doing something as EP.

[Toadstool]

Yes, we've all had ineffectual bosses who resort to the "THUMBPRINT TACTIC", as in, this is the only mark I can make.

[cal3]

As long as the ABCD soaps concentrate on the look rather than the substance they will continue to fail. If the story, acting and characterization is bad then the filming, set and shirtless men aren't going to save it and when the film quality, sets and shirtless men aren't all that then it only makes a bad product an even worse product.

Example, I've never ever liked DF's Chris. I've always found him to be one note and boring and I've always found his Chris to be strident and hard to like when viewed against YM's Chris. I also don't find DF all that in the looks department. I know I will not tape OLTL to see him parade around without his shirt.

[David V]

I'm actually surprised, as a longtime B&B viewer, that B&B's ratings haven't taken a big dive yet considering the truly PITIFUL state Bell is running the show into. Character assassinations galore, boring and repetitive storylines, the list of complaints could go on and the only saving grace will be any stellar performances the likes of Susan Flannery can put on.

OK, I'll rant here if I can. People like to cite the OJ Simpson trial, having more women in the workforce, etc as prime factors in soap ratings' decline. They may or may not be factors, but IMHO they are NOT the prime reason for soaps' sharply falling viewership.

No no.

The reason soaps have fallen so much since 2000 is because the quality of most of the soaps on air now has deteriorated alarmingly. Until 2000 or so, the ratings decline over 20 years had been fairly steady and even though ratings back then weren't as good as the early 90s, ratings in the 90s weren't as good as in the 80s, even ratings in the 80s weren't as good as in the 70s- nobody back then seemed to worry about the state of the genre, the ratings decline was considered an accepted reality and soaps were still considered a viable medium. Viable enough for new soaps like Port Charles, Sunset Beach and finally Passions to have all been created in the past decade. Since 2000, however, the decline in ratings and interest appears to be much sharper and hence we all started worrying about the future of soaps.

Hence this vicious cycle:

- falling quality leads to falling ratings

- falling ratings leads to budget cuts

- budget cuts result in falling quality

- falling quality leads to falling ratings (again)

- and so on