j swift

I think the disconnect for Dakota's introduction was the de-evolution of the character of Jill. Jill had a bout of amnesia when she met Dakota, which in typical soap style caused her to change her hair and wardrobe, rather than seek medical intervention. A later version of the same plot was attempted on GH when Felicia hooked up with Decker Moss. The result was that both women looked foolish to fans. Jill was a sophisticated Manhattan attorney, why would she suddenly wish to run around with a perm and ripped jeans? The idea that a professional woman fantasizes about escaping her work responsibilities by living on a boat in the Hudson River was not appealing then or now; and seems a little anti-feminist in retrospect.

The conundrum in Dennis's case is that he didn't change his last name when he lived in Texas and found out the Alex was his father, nor was he given inheritance rights to the Wheeler estate (I believe those went to his mother and uncle). Also, when Iris returned to Bay City she didn't call herself Iris Wheeler, by then she was mostly credited as Iris Cory. Finally, when she found out the identity of her mother she certainly was never introduced as Iris Kosloff. Given the co-existing, (and previously discussed) Frankie Frame situation, I can only conclude that Bay City existed in a parallel matronymic culture. Who knew they were so progressive?

In hindsight Nancy Don was an awkward name. I could accept Nancy Dawn, or just Nancy, but the middle name Don, coupled with the fact that every character used her full name was an odd writing choice.

Speaking of the Love family, does anyone recall the source of their family's wealth? I don't remember any reference to "Love Inc." I do recall that Peter worked in the legal department at Cory Publishing, Nicole was a model, and Donna dabbled in interior decorating when they were introduced. However, how did Reginald become so wealthy and why did none of his heirs become involved in the family business? Also, was Michael Hudson's odd foray into spying for a federal agency on Lucas ever fully explained? Was his tech company just a cover for his spying? Looking back, Michael and Donna were constant c#*& blockers for Felicia. From Carl all the way to Lucas, it was wonder she didn't dislike them more.

RHOP: Gizelle's nonverbal reaction to Monique's reveal about Jamal has haunted my thoughts since Sunday. Her humiliation was undeniable, and deserved or not, it was compelling. She worked so hard to suppress tears mixed with the furor of feeling exposed and I could not look away. We've watched Gizelle struggle with a desire for attachment. I am empathic to the fact that she must feel so alone, raising her daughters without the benefit of a companion. She clearly wants to be in a relationship, and as an audience we don't have a sense the variables that have prevented her from finding commitment. She is beautiful, (despite her poor taste in furniture, clothes, and men), she seems attentive to the needs of the men in her life, and she is charming. So, unless the issue is a lack of availability, it hard to understand how she has only dated shmucks who don't return her devotion. I feel Gizelle likes to stir the pot, and enjoys dispensing some judgment on her friends. However, she is not cruel, and while she may repeat the word on the street, she would never go as far as Monique to actually try to dredge up information solely for the purpose of trying to hurt the feelings of the other women. While it is also true that there has not been enough focus on how the rumors of Monique's infidelity, so soon after the birth of her son, affected her life and her marriage, I think the pleasure she took in humiliating Gizelle was reprehensible. RHOA : Latoya is a try-hard and I am glad she's not a full-time housewife so we don't have too focus to much on her story. Drew's scene with her husband was difficult to watch. However, I never watched The Game, so I don't understand how she played a character named Drew? I read the wiki for the plot of the whole show and other actresses played characters with different names so it was hard to understand why her character shared her full name. Also, can we all agree that the pronunciation is bio-pic not bi-opic? The etymology is a biographical picture, not half of an optical image.

It is odd to me that Chris Robinson, the guy who overinvested in beanie babies, held such power over the production team at Another World that they changed their plotlines to suit his whims. https://medium.com/@wodenworks/first-the-bubble-then-the-burst-cf3d0b9d3260

How early did we know that Jill was adopted? Of course I remember the introduction of Bess, Maggie, and Ben, as well as the infamous line from Faith about Jill being unwanted. However, I don't recall Jill's adoption as being a salient part of her backstory until later in the series. Does anyone recall the circumstances under which we first found out that Jill, Faith, and Roger didn't share the same biological mother? Was it a retcon or was that fact always part of Jill's bio?

Looking back, I think there were some key elements missing from the setup of the plot and the payoff was deeply unsatisfying. This was mostly due to recasts and other production elements that were beyond the control of the writers. On paper, meeting the patriarch of the Love family and having him be involved with the matriarch of the McKinnons was intriguing, but the execution was flawed. I think fans were ultimately disappointed when a plot that should have established the backstory cannon of the Loves and the McKinnons turned into the expansion of the Hudson clan and the conflict between brothers John and Michael. First, the children that were most affected by Mary's absence were not the central focus of the story. There was a lot of hubbub regarding Reginald's return on the relationship of Donna and Michael (whom by all rights should have already bought their own penthouse and moved out from living with her adult brother and sister long before Reg even came to town). Cheryl, Vicky and Marley really should have been the center of the story. AWHP reports that Mary came on in August 1986, but Marly left the first time in September 1986 for a year, Vicky left in December (who would have know Rhonda Lewin would have been such a flop) and Cheryl left (with Scott) by July 1988 after being backburned for a few awhile. MJ was given most of the dialogue about accepting her missing mother back into the fold, but there was very little exploration into how the loss of her mother played into her youthful indiscretions into porn and drugs. However, I think the show missed a beat by not focusing enough of the storyline on the impact on the youngest kids. It has already been mentioned that Donna's de-evolution into a weeping victim damaged her as a character in ways that could only have been resolved by Anna Stuart's return to the role and the ensuing retrograde amnesia of never mentioning Reg again. However, having Cheryl and/or Marley being terrorized by Reg would have fit better with those characters. Then, an emboldened Donna and Mary could have helped them fight back. I also agree that more exploration into the marriage of Elizabeth and Reginald, through the eyes of Jason Frame and Mary McKinnon would have been preferable. The whole timeline of when they both left (and why) was resolved through exposition which was very unsatisfying. Imagine how great a set of flashbacks with Anne Heche as Elizabeth and Tom Eplin as a young Reg to let viewer see their relationship would have been? The loss of Elizabeth could have gone a long way to humanize Reg and his motivation. It would also have served to make him more of a plausible angle in the Mary/Reg/Vince triangle. And Anne as Elizabeth would have explained Reg's attachment to Vicky. Finally, a nitpick that I have with all return-from-the-dead stories, just once I would like to see a soap play out the beats of how one re-establishes their life after returning from the dead. It was instantly assumed that Reg owned the Love mansion and controlled the businesses. However, years earlier Carl had embezzled from the family business and Donna was able to mortgage the house to pay off the debt. So, it would have been nice to have some explanation about how he was able to immediately repossess all of his belongings, especially after defrauding his investors by escaping to South America. I've always wanted one scene where a character like Mary has to go to the DMV and try to get a driver's license after being declared missing for years. Just something to acknowledge that appearing back in town doesn't indicate that all of your rights and properties are immediately returned to their prior ownership. Speaking of the undesirable focus on the expansion of Michael's family, does anyone recall when the girls went from being Love's to Hudson's? Vicky was frequently referenced as Vicky Hudson, but she couldn't have been adopted by Michael because the twins turned 18 soon after she arrived in Bay City (when Marley was supposed to receive her trust fund). So, when did they change their last name?

I just read an excerpt of Helmet Burger's memoir in one of the British tabloids (he played De Vilibis). He noted being miserable playing the role that he felt was too melodramatic. He was having addiction issues that plagued him until his death and Joan Collins later wrote in one of her memoirs that she did not like working with him. So, I wonder if that put the kibosh on the whole storyline including Ms. Scannell's part? Structurally, Nicole felt more like a temporary barrier to ease the transition for Jeff from Fallon to Kirby.

Time switches are a funny thing. Y&R switched time slots in LA over a decade ago, (I think they may have later switched back to the original time), but once you fall out of a pattern of watching a soap, it is easy to never get back to it, even if it is on the DVR.

I think one other issue that has gone unmentioned was the lack of reestablishing Alice and Sally's relationship. There was no mention of how their maturity had affected their rapport. I don't recall Sally (or even Aunt Liz) catching Alice up on her many weddings or life events that Alice had missed. Meanwhile, Ada and Rachel's relationship changed over time and they discussed their evolution from Rachel being judged by Ada during the Steven years, to Ada's support during the Mac years, and finally Rachel being able to care for Ada when she moved onto the Cory estate. While Sally never seemed disappointed or resentful that Alice went missing for most of the traumatic events in her life, Alice was so critical of Sally's choices both with David and Caitlin (being holier-than-thou was a Matthews family trait). From my history of posting on this board, one can tell that I was never an Alice fan, but her relationship with Sally before Sally's demise negated most of their early history. I mean why did Alice fight so hard to adopt Sally from her uncle and grandmother if she was going to completely ignore Sally in her early 20's?

Lucy and Alan-Michael's wedding at Universal Orlando was just released on youtube. Note: if you're marrying the most eligible bachelor in town, get an elegant private space or tropical destination, not a public amusement park with strangers stepping on your gown and long lost relatives who can just drop in at a moment's notice. I wonder if there was a publicity tie-in with the opening of Universal because it seemed out of character for the entire Spaulding clan (and Reva) to suddenly go to Florida on a whim?

With Pat as Grace Coddington... Iris 1.0 and Steve 1.0 were never financial wizards. Steve needed John Randolph or Willis to manage his construction business and Iris used to hang around in a feather peignoir set until noon. Neither character fit into the late 20th century yuppy business model. But, it would have been interesting to see the interactions of their recasts. An Iris/Steve pairing would have driven Rachel and Alice nuts.

You make an excellent point I guess I was thinking of Mitch as a threat because he pinned for Rachel, whereas Steve dismissed her advances (except for his return from the dead, but I think of that as an Aussie doppelgänger). BTW whomever made the point about the Blackhawk value being threatened by a single deal also made a great point. Couldn't Aussie-Steve leverage his mansion in Bay City and a few of his daughter's horses to cover the loss? On the other hand, I hope Cory Publishing eventually made the move onto the internet because Brava would be worthless today.

You make an interesting point about killing Steve, although permanently sending him out of town would serve the same purpose plot-wise, I think you have to get rid of Steve in order to have the double wedding with Blaine and Sandy become a refreshing of the show. If Steve was always around as possibility then Mac becomes a second choice rather than the endgame that AW lore posited him to be for Rachel. I'm still amazed that they didn't kill off Mitch after his first stint. As Matthew's father Mitch was much more of a potential threat to Mac and Rachel happiness. However, as I recall, Mitch's return in 1986 did not have a significant impact on their relationship. Rachel was annoyed by his presence, and it affected her relationship with Felicia, but overall Mitch's return was kind of a dud. If it wasn't for his long lost brother and mother, I think they would have cut their losses and shipped him off to Africa much sooner. But I am bias because I've never liked characters whose sole trait is that they are brooding.

Jonah was styled to look like Manson, (scruffy bread, long hair), both stories played on pop culture fears about the use of LSD, he used young women to do his bidding like Manson, and the story began at the time of the Manson trial. So, that is at least four ways to suggest that it is not outside of the realm of possibility that Slesar was inspired by the events.

Didi and her police lover Calvin were always supporting characters although her performance during ISIS was memorable. I'm surprised that you've neglected to mention Cliff. Although he disappears from the canvas during the later years, he is a treat for when you revisit the Slesar period. When I watched originally in the 1980's I had no idea that there had been a change in head writers. However, at the risk of stating a controversial opinion, I think Slesar may be a bit overrated. His long term plotting was excellent and he created many unique characters. However, upon reflection, there was also a lot plot pilfering. Draper on the run after a prison train wreck and hiding in an abandoned circus owes a lot to the TV version of The Fugitive. There are obvious inspirations between the Keith Whitney story and Charles Manson. The Serena Faraday plot shares elements with Sally Field's popular tv film Sybil. The Clown Puppet murder story seems reminiscent of the contemporaneous Anthony Hopkins' movie Magic. And Faux Sky Whitney's stay at the Bryson Clinic for International Spies in need of Plastic Surgery may have been inspired by the Humphrey Bogart film Dark Passage. While it could be argued that many soap writers have "borrowed" ideas from other genres, I find the prior film fingerprints all over so many of Slesar's stories devalues my opinion of some of his creativity.

https://deadline.com/2020/10/the-masked-dancer-craig-robinson-host-masked-singer-spin-off-fox-1234604904/ It is amusing, but how could anyone identify a masked dancer? Dancers don't have signature moves that would translate to a masked competition. Call me when they do the Masked Artist and I'll be there in front of my TV.

You elicited so many great EON memories. I'll start with what you described so well as a "waterfall of interconnected mysteries". It was excellent plotting to have each story meld into the next. I still recall being honestly shocked by the identity of the Clown Puppet Murderer (no spoilers as per this thread's title). Blame it on my youth, but I recall at the time thinking that this was a new plot that had nothing to do with the ongoing story, so I was delighted to see how it all evolved and culminated into the mystery surrounding Sky. Extenuating circumstances, such as Larkin Malloy's injury, slowed the pace of the plot and may have contributed to a dip in viewer support. All of the prior plots were told interwoven and quick, but the Sky story (as much I enjoyed it) did tend to go on and on. I'm still a bit confused about his alter ego who also had a missing identity and how they all loved Valerie Bryson, but that's water under the bridge. Agreed on Chris Egen, she brought back the police element that began to slip away a bit after Deborah and her Rookie's-like-trio (very old reference that some gen-y-er's may need to google) left town. Loved Alicia and ISIS. First, she was one of the only real adversaries for Raven. Martine and Jody were no match for Raven's wit, and were certainly never a threat when it came to romantic interests. Alicia made Raven insecure, which was not a weakness that Raven allowed herself to feel, but it demonstrated to the audience how much Sky meant to her. Also, I loved the way that ISIS played into the pop culture of the time. People like Mike Karr turning into literal couch potatoes, the ubiquity of cable boxes, and the privacy fears of satellites. The disco that played subliminal messages was pure paranoid camp and it predated John Carpenter's movie They Live by a couple of years. I enjoyed the Alicia/Logan pairing and again was really surprised by the outcome. Obviously, given my username, I am an old school Swifty. The Corell sisters were a low point. A 40-year-old virgin was not the person I envisioned for Miles after Nicole's death. But, I still associate Marcia Cross with EON not Desperate Housewives. One of the worst recasts ever. They immediately put her in the frat mystery story, she sank like log, and then she spent the rest of her time on the show on the back burner. Her breakup with Preacher wasn't because they were poorly suited, he just got bored of her tight ass ways. I need to know more about your thoughts on this matter because to this day I adore Sky & Raven. Unlike every other soap couple, they never tried to domesticate each other, they were true partners, and as an audience member, you knew that they were very experimental in the sack (after all Sky employed a leather daddy as his butler and Raven had "European desires"). Again, I think extenuating circumstances like Sharon Gabet's pregnancy diverted some plots, (like Raven's very long kidnapping), but overall they seem like a very modern couple. A couple of things that went unmentioned in your post that I loved of that period. The female friendships between Mitzi & Jody, Raven & April, and Nicole & Nancy were refreshing. The idea that everyone had a career and a specialty that they brought to the story, even paleontology. The lack of kids and baby fever (with the exception of my namesake Jamey) made the town feel so mature and cosmopolitan. The awesome sets like the Cavanaugh penthouse and the ISIS building. And the humor of characters without being silly.

Brad showed tush on the Y&R primetime special, (which may have been broadcast in conjunction with that year's daytime emmys). My memory of CBS's tush tour was that it was especially homoerotic because it was rarely organic (i.e. when else did Brad and Jack ever have a discussion while showering together at the gym?), and each scene always involved a tight shot of the butt and then a slow pan upward.

I guess we can site DAYS Mike C Manning (Charlie) as the opposite of the trend of this discussion, a gay actor who was out in the press prior to being cast on a soap. He is a hopeful example of the liberation that gay visibility has brought to the acting profession.

I'd love to know the economics of these types of stunts. Does he get a cut of the photos that are sold or is he playing the long game of keeping his name in the press to attract future casting agents?

I wholeheartedly agree! I often don't have the patience to watch entire old episodes online, but this series is so entertaining because they distill the history into bite-sized pieces. The music and the editing make these addict-ably watchable. I also adore their annual reviews and longer character pieces. I am especially bemused by the titles that they gave to certain characters in the older profiles on the channel, such as Tangie Hill - The Brief Citizen.

How did she allow herself to leave the house (let alone be filmed) in that wig?

At the risk of entering into a discussion with which I have little personal experience, I think this discussion point has been misconstrued both here and in the widely discussed Vice article this week. The issue is not that black women are held to a different standard or the legitimacy of stereotypes about women of color. My experience of MtM and RHOP is that there are so few tv shows centered around the experience of successful woman of color that they feel the burden of representation. Therefore, they are hesitant about the audience response to their lives because Bravo viewers are exposed to so few black women that they might generalize the experiences of this small group of women to the culture as a whole. Ramona Singer does not have to worry that her edit will reflect poorly on the entire population of Upper Eastside divorced women with boob jobs, because there are so many stories about the lives of those women that nobody would assume that they are all like her. However, the women of RHOP, RHOA, and MtM are virtually the only representation of middle aged successful black women in media so they are constantly confronted with questions about how they represent their community.