CBS Daytime

[Paul Raven]

CBS owned daytime throughout the 50s and especially the 60's where the mix of reruns in the morning, soaps/game shows/variety in the afternoon dominated every timeslot.

Meanwhile ABC and NBC were constantly juggling their lineups trying to break through.

Finally in the late 60's NBC made headway as Days/Doctors and AW began winning their timeslots forcing CBS to make changes. Then GH asserted itself and the 70's saw all 3 networks battling for domination.

CBS made a lot of changes in the 70's. Introducing Y&R was no doubt their best move.

Let's discuss CBS Daytime over the years.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Paul Raven

[Contessa Donatella]

I believe it was in a 1996 LA Time article where it was revealed that CBS had asked Bill Bell to create a new soap for them, the year before in 1995. Bill Bell wanted nothing to do with this & wanted to be left completely out of it. Their plan was to replace the P&G soaps. They were so brazen doing this in the open & P&G threw whatever is a business "fit" & there was a battle of words between CBS and P&G. P&G won, sorta. CBS agreed to abandon the idea of new soaps and to retain ATWT & GL but they had conditions. 

For ATWT it was a different way of telling stories, different narrative style. Lynn Liccardo calls it pod story-telling. Where the traditional style could be said to be weaving a tapestry where different strands from different stories were connected in pod story-telling people & their stories would be isolated, standalone. 

For GL it was a new production model, drastically different. 

I believe both these changes contributed to the demise of the shows. 

 

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Edited August 6, 2023 by Donna L. Bridges
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[kalbir]

My favorite CBS Daytime era was 1989-1992. All four soaps were hitting their stride plus the game show block. The Price is Right and Family Feud were my favorites of the game show block in those years. I liked Card Sharks, Now You See It was all right, but I wasn't really down for budget mode Wheel of Fortune (when the wheel has $50 and $75 spaces, yeah that's budget mode).

I'd say CBS Daytime was really shaken up in the early 1980s with ABC's huge rise. That's why so many changes to the line up and the shows themselves.

Another shakeup was in the mid-1990s with Reilly's Days huge rise and the aftermath of OJ. Y&R went off track for a few years. B&B hit a lull then rebounded a bit, but eventually starting tanking. As the World Turns and Guiding Light were already in trouble before OJ but never really recovered after OJ.

I think the best eras for each of the soaps were

Y&R: 1983-1998 but really thrived 1984 through first half of 1986, 1990 through first half of 1994, second half of 1997 to end of 1998.

B&B: Bill Bell years but really thrived 1989 to 1993.

As the World Turns: Douglas Marland years 1985-1993 but really thrived 1986 and 1987. 

Guiding Light: Robert Calhoun/Pamela Long/Nancy Curlee era 1989-1991.

Edited August 7, 2023 by kalbir

[j swift]

Obviously, ratings trends are multifactorial, but we should never rule out the huge impact of the expansion of Price is Right to an hour.  Check out that timeline, and see its effect on Y&R ratings. 

I tend to believe that storylines don't create significant audience increases, but it makes the ratings less variable.  In other words, a great plot will cause people to not want to miss a day, but compared over time, it does little to attract new viewers. As I noted the in the 1980s ratings thread, if the variability of viewers week-to-week exceeds the variability year-to-year, then any changes have to be attributed to chance.

Edited August 6, 2023 by j swift

[Contessa Donatella]

This is a list from Wikiwand so should only be considered tentative knowledge without confirmation but I thought it was interesting to look at what they say the slogans were. I'm a Baby Boomer & I was always interested in promotion. 

 

[GLATWT88]

That's surprising and would have ended in disaster most likely. All soaps had been losing ground since the mid 1980s. A new soap wasn't going to solve the issues which led to these decreases.

I always say that it's a testament to GL's quality that it performed so well in the late 70s and early 80s up against GH's peak. It was a very consistent soap from 71 - 84, maintaining a steady rating in the 8s (and obviously it was wildly successful in the 50s and 60s but those were different times and conditions). To maintain in the Top 5 soaps during GH's strongest years and with insane numbers is truly incredible. It wasn't until 84/5 that the numbers took a drop, but this is true for the soaps in general. Just as the 1984/5 season was the peak for primetime soaps, I believe it to be the peak for daytime soaps as well. 1984 was also the peak of daytime revenue in ad sales. There was a steady decrease for the rest of the decade, in sales and viewership. 

In fact in 1994 and 1995, there were weeks where GL was still beating both ATWT and BB in the demo. While the numbers for GL dipped in the mid 80s. From 1985 - 1994, it was a very middle performing soap. It wasn't performing at the bottom and wasn't too far off other more established soaps. It wasn't AW or RH. It also shows what good writing could do that GL jumped .4 rating from 90/91 to 91/92 season.

Furthermore, YR and BB were rare cases in the soap world. Of all the soaps to debut in the 1970s - 90s, only AMC, RH, YR and BB experienced much success. The rest pretty much stayed at the bottom of the ratings. One other exception which I personally feel performed well was Capitol and it wasn't given much a shot, but its success could have come down to scheduling (same could be said for BB). I am a firm believer that scheduling was a huge factor in the success and demise of soaps in the 1970s and 1980s. Also, SB had a bit of success, but it never left the bottom either. 

While I think investing in the quality and rejuvenation of the soaps was a good idea, and probably thanks to Bell not taking the offer, I don't think CBS went about it in the right way. I definitely don't think replacing GL and ATWT would have ended up getting CBS what it wanted as the truth was that the numbers just wouldn't be there for a new soap in the 90s. We saw it for The City, PC, SuBe, Passions. Not only did GL have to suffer through preemptions due to OJ in 1995. It also had to contend with a 10am timeslot move in major markets. 

[Contessa Donatella]

BITD a friend, soap fan was by career a statistician & he proved mathematically that primetime and daytime & late night were all doomed to decline, shallow at first but then steeper. I always said maybe soaps could reinvent themselves again & prevent the eventuality. He thought that was a pretty pie in the sky idea.

In her book Her Stories Elana Levine describes this period - 1995 & 1996 - when CBS wanted to dump &  run, instead of invest a period of instability. Actually she dates it starting then so 1995-2003. Upheaval, turnover, so many different EPs & HWs. Except not so for the Bells soaps. Y&R and B&B had stability. Partly because that's the way he ran his shows & partly because he wasn't being micromanaged & everyone else was already. As soon as Bell Sr. died they began almost immediately to be micromanaged like everyone else. 

And GEN which was a fine show but in that exposed vulnerable midday spot both up against half of Y&R and also not tucked safely between the lead-off hour soap & the #2 hour soap. Most of them had clearance problems too. But, frankly, beginning in 1946 the US soap business created 84 televised soaps & so very many of them failed between 2 & 6 years. Starting up a brand new soap was a huge risk. 

One market aired GL at 9 a.m. There's never been a successful early to mid-morning soap. Plus, the fans seeing at 10 saw one day & that afternoon a different day. It was a terrible practice & a killer for online fans. "Day Ahead" was created & had meaning in context. 

[kalbir]

Guiding Light entered cancel territory around 1995 or 1996.

1996 it looked like Bradley was preparing B&B to expand to one hour in time for the 10th anniversary in March 1997 but as we all know that didn't happen. Also notice B&B had a bit of a cast purge not long after the 10th anniversary.

Bill Bell Jr. and Maria Arena Bell had a soap bible Coming of Age that they attempted to sell to NBC in 1992 or 1993. I wonder if CBS would have used that for a new 30 minute soap in March 1997.

 

[Broderick]

I honestly kept thinking Coming of Age would be snagged by CBS, once "B&B" established itself as a potential winner in the CBS line-up. 

While Edge of Night was obviously doomed by the expansion of World Turns to an hour, I often wondered how it would've fared if CBS had held onto it.  Ideally, EON should've flourished on ABC in the early 1980s, as its lead-in was the most successful soap in ABC's entire line-up.  But it didn't flourish.  The show's low clearance was obviously problematic, but also its "film noir intelligence" seemed out of place in ABC's "love on the run" heyday.  The rapid ratings rise of the ABC line-up turned out to be a flash in the pan, and by the time viewers (quickly) tired of the ABC formula, Edge was left to flounder with low clearance and a lead-in that was bleeding viewers.  

If the show had still been included in the line-up with the newly-rejuvenated Y&R, Douglas Marland's crisper and more historically-based World Turns and the still-popular Guiding Light, I expect we would've seen it last far longer than its unfortunate 1984 demise, especially if it had remained under the craftsmanship of Henry Slesar.  

[Paul Raven]

If CBS had held on to Edge when ATWT expanded, where could they have placed it?

4pm would be a good fit but the show would have been isolated from other CBS soaps.

3.30 would have benefited from the All in the Family lead in but Match Game was doing well in that slot I believe.

[GLATWT88]

The best move would have been for Edge to go to NBC and placed right after AW.

It may have prevented AW's expansion - solving another NBC catastrophe. EON was an established soap, AW's lead in would have been good for Edge as AW's numbers were strong at the time of EON's transition. The most important factor would be clearance, but NBC seemed pretty good at that. Even low rated Texas and Doctors maintained strong clearance in spite of their numbers unlike soaps on the other networks. 

[danfling]

The Edge of Night, after being moved to ABC, may not have "flourished" ratings-wise, but it did flourish artistically.  April, Steve, Deborah, Logan, Calvin, Miles, Denise, Raven, Schyler, Jody, Winter, Derek, Gavin, Jinx and Kelly were all introduced while the show was on ABC and were beloved by the show's audience.

The demise of CBS as the leading network in daytime television was caused by two-fold reasons.

 

CBS had either purchased or introduced Love of Life, The Secret Storm, Love Is a Many Splendored Thing and Where the Heart Is.  The shows were in the company of the Procter and Gamble shows Search for Tomorrow, As the World Turns, The Guiding Light and The Edge of Night.

The early 1970 years brought about a "cancellation fever" at ABC.    Cancelled early were The Best of Everything, Dark Shadows and A World Apart. 

Procter and Gamble Productions (which was probably planning an expansion of its Another World on NBC) wanted a big block of its shows, so CBS was persuaded to comply with this.  Search for Tomorrow and As the World Turns  remained in their former time slots (These two starting times had always existed.)  Following were The Guiding Light and The Edge of Night in new time slots.   Love Is a Many Splendored Thing had a new timeslot (the one during which The Edge of Night was a ratings success), and the show eventually moved into a storyline about politics, etc.

Procter and Gamble even had its Somerset aired twice by NBC during the daytime.   In addition to its 4:00ET/3:00 CT slot, it was also aired at noon.

This did create a block of soap operas owned by Procter and Gamble: Search for Tomorrow, Somerset, As the World Turns, The Guiding Light, The Edge of Night and Another World.

Ratings for the CBS shows fell following these changes.  One executive at the CBS network wanted to cancel all of the shows that the network owned.    However, the only ones to be cancelled were Love Is a Many Splendored Thing and Where the Heart Is.

 

Even Procter and Gamble wanted to use the 1:00ET/12:00CT time during which the affliates are local news for expansion to forty-five minutes for Search for Tomorrow and As the World Turns.   (This was after two programs had been expanded on NBC).

Later, (in 1973) The Secret Storm was cancelled (and left the air in 1974) and Love of Life continued for the rest of the decade.

The decision by Procter and Gamble to create its block and the expansion of the thirty-minute shows were the reason that CBS lost so many rating points.

 

 

Edited August 7, 2023 by danfling

[soapfan770]

I am curious about something but why did the networks give up the full 4:00-5:00 hour over time? It seems to me that TSS and Edge enjoyed tremendous success in the late afternoon timeslot in the late 50’s/early 60’s. Not sure why that slot withered over time leading the networks fest cede the 4:30 slot around 1967 or so and then finally the 4:00 slot by 1986 just in time for the rise of Oprah.

Always been curious had The Brighter Day’s move to Television City from NYC and purchase by CBS from P&G had worked out. 

The three definitive soaps for CBS are obviously Y&R, ATWT, and GL. 
 

@kalbir is right IMO the Best of CBS Daytime was 1989-1993. Y&R was in its golden age and at its zenith, ATWT was in its silver age under Marland, GL was back to its roots and revitalized, and B&B showed significant promise by giving us the Spectra’s. 

[Paul Raven]

In July 63 CBS moved Edge from 4.30 following Secret Storm to 3.30 now leading in to SS. it swapped places with Millionaire reruns.

I think this was in preparation for the CBS Evening News to expand to half an hour. That happened in Sept 63 and in return for taking the expanded telecast CBS offered affiliates the 4.30 timeslot for local programming.

Rather than move both secret Storm and Edge up half an hour they elected to move Edge only to become the lead in for SS. It worked as Edge and SS continued with high ratings for several years.

[Contessa Donatella]

This is the earliest I've seen anyone put GL into that zone. I mean that was even before AW was canceled. Just remarking, is all. And, 1995 was the year that P&G pulled their Executive Shuffle where they took those 3 NY soaps & moved the EPs around except that, oddly, Laurie Caso got left out in the cold.