Others have said it, but I agree.  Best 2002: Guiding Light.  The Interim hiring Team of Millee Taggart and Carolyn Culliton finally got the show back on track after the dark age of B&E running the show into ground.  Unfortunately all the improvements were flushed down the toilet the next year with John Conboy.  In 2003 the show was way worse than Brown/Esenstein, perhaps the worst ever.

 

Worst of 2003.  Perhaps the worst year ever for the show.  Serial killer Ben Reade, Alex stalking Reva in a painful mid-story re-write, Marilyn Carrouthers. wasting Peter Simon after finally getting him to come back the year prior and never giving us the teased story about his time in Africa.  

1 hour ago, Spoon said:

Others have said it, but I agree.  Best 2002: Guiding Light.  The Interim hiring Team of Millee Taggart and Carolyn Culliton finally got the show back on track after the dark age of B&E running the show into ground.  Unfortunately all the improvements were flushed down the toilet the next year with John Conboy.  In 2003 the show was way worse than Brown/Esenstein, perhaps the worst ever.

 

Worst of 2003.  Perhaps the worst year ever for the show.  Serial killer Ben Reade, Alex stalking Reva in a painful mid-story re-write, Marilyn Carrouthers. wasting Peter Simon after finally getting him to come back the year prior and never giving us the teased story about his time in Africa.  

I love Millee & CCulliton anywhere, anytime! I detested John Conboy at GL only, but his whole tenure there. And, there's a whole 'nother degree of hatred that I reserve for she who was hired only by Conboy, HW Ellen Weston!

Sandy & his infernal sock puppet. Eden & the underbelly of Springfield. Ben Reade, first as a sex worker & then as a serial killer & last as a suicide. Matt Bomer deserved better. So did Fletcher. Maryann Carruthers & retconning 20+ yrs of history of 5 local men to throw suspicion on the innocent. Carrie Nye. Adolescents tunneling fall through the ceiling of Danny & Michelle's new apartment. (What show is this again?!) Marty West hired to play Shayne, exposing his buttocks in one scene & bringing down CBS Standards & Practices upon them & selling tapes of himself wrestling.

1 hour ago, Spoon said:

Others have said it, but I agree.  Best 2002: Guiding Light.  The Interim hiring Team of Millee Taggart and Carolyn Culliton finally got the show back on track after the dark age of B&E running the show into ground.  Unfortunately all the improvements were flushed down the toilet the next year with John Conboy.  In 2003 the show was way worse than Brown/Esenstein, perhaps the worst ever.

GL was must-see-TV in 2002. Their last great era.  

Agreed @MichaelGL  DAYS & GL ("my" two shows) were tied for #1 in 2002 as the best. 

3 hours ago, Tonksadora said:

 

@carolineg Speaking of the best of JER, I may hold a minority position because his best to me is by far the '5 siblings of Kristen Blake'. You can't beat Kristen, Susan Banks, Sister Mary Moira, Penelope & of course Tomas. JER has an assist from Eileen Davidson.

 

I don't think the Kristen/Susan story was bad, but 5 was a lot of characters for ED to play and very silly at the end.   Kristen initially turning to evil, deceiving John, her rivalry with Marlena, and her teaming up with Stefano was all good.  By the time the story reached it's climax John was dumbed down really bad, Marlena became the most self-sacrificing person in the world, and it was all a little too wacky for me.   1997 starts off awesome, but everything fizzles out after the main stories reach their conclusion and we get to Roman's return and Hope/John's trip to the jungle It's absolutely a story I have watched more than once, but if I had to go with my favorite stories of that era I would choose:

1. Aremid

2. Maison Blanche

3. Carrie/Austin/Sami

3. Paris

4. Kristen/Susan

5. The Possession

 

1 hour ago, carolineg said:

By the time the story reached it's climax John was dumbed down really bad, Marlena became the most self-sacrificing person in the world, and it was all a little too wacky for me.   ... but if I had to go with my favorite stories of that era I would choose:

1. Aremid

2. Maison Blanche

3. Carrie/Austin/Sami

3. Paris

4. Kristen/Susan

5. The Possession

I would say that John being dumbed down is a regular event, although, sure, some times can be worse than others. Similarly, I would say it's not shocking seeing Marlena as self-sacrificing or even as Little Miss Goody Two Shoes. I think it's in her DNA. The lady is hard-wired, often to her detriment as people think she is just too good to be true. Me, I always bought her. She seemed consistent & true & there were always throughlines.

I'm not known for liking JER's work after he became a solo HW, but I could credit Carrie/Austin/Sami and 5 Siblings.

13 minutes ago, Tonksadora said:

I would say that John being dumbed down is a regular event, although, sure, some times can be worse than others. Similarly, I would say it's not shocking seeing Marlena as self-sacrificing or even as Little Miss Goody Two Shoes. I think it's in her DNA. The lady is hard-wired, often to her detriment as people think she is just too good to be true. Me, I always bought her. She seemed consistent & true & there were always throughlines.

I'm not known for liking JER's work after he became a solo HW, but I could credit Carrie/Austin/Sami and 5 Siblings.

This is all very true, but John was dumbed down to the point he couldn't tell the difference between two people while sleeping with them, he didn't realize Kristen wasn't pregnant even when she lived with him and shared a bed, and was oblivious to Marlena swooning at him the minute he walking in the room.  It was Austin level stupidity.  And I know we aren't supposed to think John is dumb as viewers.  

Marlena being self-sacrificing is a throughline for her, but, again, we were at the point where she was moping around alone waiting? hoping? John would catch a clue about Kristen.  At what point does being self-sacrificing do more harm than good?  That's where I think Marlena was at in 1997.  She knew Kristen was evil and lying to John, she knew John loved her, but helped drag everything along for reason after reason which wasn't helpful to anyone in the situation and actually made Kristen more crazy and evil lol. 

I am probably drifting this thread into the Classic Days thread territory, so I will just say I think 1996 on Days works much better than 1997.  1996 I can't think of a story I didn't like.  I even liked the kooky Aremid characters.  I am sure I am forgetting some C plot that was bad, but the only thing I thought wasn't great was Bo/Hope's stories.  1997 had Kristen/Susan et all and the big endings to all the major stories throughout JER's run, but the show was terrible in the last 3-4 months of that year.  Fauxman, the Jungle story, Hope/John teasers, Kristen doing a whole lot of nothing, Jack/Jen/Circus, etc.  But that's my opinion.  I feel like GH and Days were the two strongest soaps in 1996 from my standpoint.

 

1 hour ago, carolineg said:

couldn't tell the difference between two people while sleeping with them, he didn't realize Kristen wasn't pregnant even when she lived with him and shared a bed, and was oblivious to Marlena swooning at him the minute he walking in the room.  It was Austin level stupidity.  And I know we aren't supposed to think John is dumb as viewers.

You're right about how bad John was in those terms. In soap tradition many men have slept with a woman & not realized who he was sleeping with & as an audience member I have yet ever to buy that. It is simply not credible. I hum la-la-la-la & put my fingers in my ears, not literally, just mentally. But, there it is, a worst case example, as are the other examples you list.

23 hours ago, carolineg said:

I am probably drifting this thread into the Classic Days thread territory, so I will just say I think 1996 on Days works much better than 1997.  1996 I can't think of a story I didn't like.  I even liked the kooky Aremid characters.  I am sure I am forgetting some C plot that was bad, but the only thing I thought wasn't great was Bo/Hope's stories.  1997 had Kristen/Susan et all and the big endings to all the major stories throughout JER's run, but the show was terrible in the last 3-4 months of that year.  Fauxman, the Jungle story, Hope/John teasers, Kristen doing a whole lot of nothing, Jack/Jen/Circus, etc.  But that's my opinion.  I feel like GH and Days were the two strongest soaps in 1996 from my standpoint.

Agreed 100%  Especially when looking back, yes, you had great payoff in the comeuppances of Kristen and Sami, but even in the first half of '97, you can see they were dragging the Marlena/John/Kristen and Sami/Austin/Carrie stories during the winter and spring to have the big summer climaxes. Bo/Hope/Billie/JL King wasn't intriguing enough, and Jack/Jennifer was non-existent with Jack spending the first half of the year in prison. 

The second half was when DAYS started their hokey-jokey junk with the circus story and Vivian & Ivan dressed up as french fries and Lil' Bo Peep and the naroleptic Jonesey and his townhouse. Plus, Susan Banks. After the Kristen payoff in June of '97, Susan's presence was always comedy cringe. 

10 hours ago, Gray Bunny said:

Agreed 100%  Especially when looking back, yes, you had great payoff in the comeuppances of Kristen and Sami, but even in the first half of '97, you can see they were dragging the Marlena/John/Kristen and Sami/Austin/Carrie stories during the winter and spring to have the big summer climaxes. Bo/Hope/Billie/JL King wasn't intriguing enough, and Jack/Jennifer was non-existent with Jack spending the first half of the year in prison. 

The second half was when DAYS started their hokey-jokey junk with the circus story and Vivian & Ivan dressed up as french fries and Lil' Bo Peep and the naroleptic Jonesey and his townhouse. Plus, Susan Banks. After the Kristen payoff in June of '97, Susan's presence was always comedy cringe. 

Yeah it's clear they are dragging both main triangles out to have a summer climax, where I think you could have spread them out better.  In fact, I would have ended John/Marlena/Kristen first and kept Sami/Austin/Carrie for the summer.  I tend to think the Jack/Jen/Peter story stalling might have been a personnel issue, with Missy leaving and Jason Brooks being off the show as well and not intentional.  I don't have much to say about Bo/Hope-almost all the stories JER wrote for them were bad.  He clearly wasn't a big fan lol

The tone got really bogged down after those two major stories ended too.  I feel like entire weeks of show would take place with everyone moping around almost dead Roman's bedside and no one was really happy except Austin/Carrie, but the tide was already turning on that and people wanted her with Mike.   And the attempts at lightheartedness like the Jonesy story gave me second hand embarrassment for Louise Sorel and Ivan G'vera.  They didn't deserve that.  And I agree 100% that Susan outlived her usefulness, but then got significant airtime after the reveal and I kept assuming she'd leave and go back wherever but didn't lol. 

Anyway, after a great 1996 I thought 1997 was rough for Days and GH.  I think GH's 1997 was worse than Days, but GH rebounded pretty quickly in 1998 and I don't know if Days ever did.  

Edited April 21, 20223 yr by carolineg

I'll need to check out 2002 Guiding Light then, I had always assumed the show was half dead by the turn of the millenium but at least it still had a leg to stand on then.

2022:

Best, GH: despite it's bloated the cast and subpar writing, it still attempts to make stories interesting

Worst, Y&R: poor production value, boring lifeless stories

*honorable mention for WORST, B&B- more interesting than Y&R but exteeemly repeditive dialoge, poorly planned--short impact plots that eat the show for months at a time rather than having several well-planned plots run concurrently.

 

Edited April 21, 20223 yr by ironlion

What was happening on GL in 2001, as it seems the ratings were quite strong. Although, 2002 seems to be where it took a bit of a dip. 

Re: Guiding Light

2001 was Lloyd Gold taking over from Claire Labine. His tenure started off ok, Claire Ramsey and Alan Spaulding were mixing it up in Springfield as antagonists in quite a few stories. I think you still had some of the Richard/Cassie/Beth/Edmund story playing out, and Edmund/Beth being featured heavily. Introduction of Gus Aitoro, and him mixing it up with Harley and Danny/Michelle. Blake/Ross were given a fatal attraction storyline involving law student Tory Granger. San Cristobal earthquake. Also you had Tony/Catalina/Marah/Romeo story playing out with Catalina's murder mystery. Gold's tenure seemed to unravel when he penned the time travel story involving Josh/Reva/Olivia. When Taggart joined in 2002, she attempted to bring Gold's storylines back down to earth and while attempting to honor the show's history(2002 was the show's 50th Anniversary on TV).

 

Left off that you also had Harley being pregnant with Rick's baby, and it being revealed at the Bauer BBQ in 2001. I found that particular story fascinating, as O'Leary and Ehlers played very well off each other. 

26 minutes ago, MichaelGL said:

Re: Guiding Light

2001 was Lloyd Gold taking over from Claire Labine. His tenure started off ok, Claire Ramsey and Alan Spaulding were mixing it up in Springfield as antagonists in quite a few stories. I think you still had some of the Richard/Cassie/Beth/Edmund story playing out, and Edmund/Beth being featured heavily. Introduction of Gus Aitoro, and him mixing it up with Harley and Danny/Michelle. Blake/Ross were given a fatal attraction storyline involving law student Tory Granger. San Cristobal earthquake. Also you had Tony/Catalina/Marah/Romeo story playing out with Catalina's murder mystery. Gold's tenure seemed to unravel when he penned the time travel story involving Josh/Reva/Olivia. When Taggart joined in 2002, she attempted to bring Gold's storylines back down to earth and while attempting to honor the show's history(2002 was the show's 50th Anniversary on TV).

 

Left off that you also had Harley being pregnant with Rick's baby, and it being revealed at the Bauer BBQ in 2001. I found that particular story fascinating, as O'Leary and Ehlers played very well off each other. 

Thank you. I was looking at the ratings and noticed that there were several weeks we’re GL outperformed GH in 2001. It could have just been that GH was having a bad year. However around July to October GL had several weeks were it did better than GH, but also before then as well. It also had a nice demo boost around July compared to the start of the year. 

I applaud Lloyd Gold - at least, I think it was Lloyd Gold? - for introducing a new, African-American family, the Boudreauxes, to GL, but it was clear almost from the beginning that that was not high on the list of Paul Rauch's or P&G's priorities.

1 hour ago, MichaelGL said:

Left off that you also had Harley being pregnant with Rick's baby, and it being revealed at the Bauer BBQ in 2001. I found that particular story fascinating, as O'Leary and Ehlers played very well off each other. 

I know the Pharley's (another CRAZY fan group) hated that story, but I think O'leary and Ehlers brought out the best in each other...O'leary did not get quite that much mugging in and he was written to mostly be a good guy who wanted the best for everyone (as opposed to the Blake situation where he was practically stalking her and could care less about his practically uncle Ross' feeling about the situation) as Rick/Harley/Phillip were stuck in a bad situation with no villains (a first for a Rauch GL "triangle") and Ehlers was not the love goddess or the shrill shrew yet. I am sure Ehlers wouldn't be thrilled but I think she would have worked well if they choose it, a long term Bauer matriarch, with a return of Mallet later to spice things up, but I never liked Gus so...I just liked Rick and Harley loving each other as friends and no great "romance" as I was so tired of the great "passion" ALL soap couples were supposed to have..(it would be exhausting to be a soap character.)

 

16 minutes ago, Khan said:

I applaud Lloyd Gold - at least, I think it was Lloyd Gold? - for introducing a new, African-American family, the Boudreauxes, to GL, but it was clear almost from the beginning that that was not high on the list of Paul Rauch's or P&G's priorities.

Yes, he did..and I do think it was interesting that Rick was in love with a woman of color and I liked the actress but they made Mel so boring.  O'leary needs someone with a snappy energy like Tersau or Ehlers to offset his either making Rick a sadsack or "comedic" (which he failed miserably when doing schtick,,) I thought it would be great to have Mel have a grandmother who lives in a neighborhood effected by the Santos crimes and maybe a lawyer who would be instrumental in bringing them down.

I also think it was a mistake not to use the earthquake and Alan and Olivia's misdeeds to finally end the San Crud storyline and bring everyone back and of course, the dumb time travel crap. Beth's split personality was a good idea to explain her odd behavior since her return but it reeked of typical Rauch influenced crap, with Chamerline showing her cleavage and everyone in SF too dumb to figure out its really Beth.