1 hour ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I never watched Popular, but it SHOCKS me that a Ryan Murphy show, even before he teamed up with partner-in-crime Brad Falchuk, had a good first season and then fell off the rails!  *SHOCKS ME*

*smacks head* We never even mentioned Glee. On the other hand, I wasn't really saddened by the decline. It was more of an inevitability.

Three shows that I haven't seen mentioned yet:

 

The X-Files.  The first six seasons were pretty fantastic. Ho boy did this show get very messy in its last three seasons and during its recent revival. There is a lot to pinpoint; David Duchovny's boredom, Chris Carter making it up as he went along before trying to write some "Aliens as God" crapola, FOX kept renewing the show even when a series finale had be written(Season 7 and Season 8). I think if the show hadn't been so reliant on Mulder and Scully and/or if it was rebooted/retooled for Doggett and Reyes it could have lasted longer, but Carter always, always self-sabotaged  himself along the way. Carter's mythology for the 2016 and 2018 revivals was embarrassingly AWFUL. Chris Carter can never come up with a satisfying conclusion for what he starts, and it's the reason why he's never been able to do anything else yet while Vince Gilligan, Howard Gordon, Frank Spotnitz, John Shiban, Glen Morgan, James Wong, Jeffrey Bell etc. all become successful elsewhere and obviously knew the show better than Carter did himself. 

 

 

LA Law: The moment Steve Bochco abandoned the show it was done in for. I still remember Dan Castellaneta guest starring in a Homer Simpson costume for an entire episode. Not to mention at then end of Season 7 a lot of decent characters were gotten rid of to make way for a bunch for characters from a failed Bochno show to appear in Season 8, which happened to be LA Law's last. I still can't believe the way the show treated A Martinez, and as a result a career for him in prime time never happened ever. 

1 hour ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I mean I was NEVER a fan but I suppose Sex and the City counts--I think Darren Star left after season 2 and what most fans seem to love is really Michael Patrick King's Sex and the City not Star's.

 

Under Darren Star, character development on SATC was sacrificed in favor of relentless sex scenes that looked painful and were painful to watch.  Under Michael Patrick King, characters were explored a bit more.  However, the more power Sarah Jessica Parker exerted over the show, the more it became a gooey Cinderella fantasy and excuse for SJP to feel good about herself.

 

35 minutes ago, Franko said:

*smacks head* We never even mentioned Glee. On the other hand, I wasn't really saddened by the decline. It was more of an inevitability.

 

That's always the issue with Ryan Murphy's shows.  No matter how wonderful they are at the beginning, they're always a hot, steaming mess by the end.

Edited November 24, 20187 yr by Khan

31 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

I still can't believe the way the show treated A Martinez, and as a result a career for him in prime time never happened ever. 

What was the story there? A wasn't even on for two full seasons.

33 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

LA Law: The moment Steve Bochco abandoned the show it was done in for.

 

I think it was the moment when David E. Kelley, who had been the show runner after Bochco and Terry Louise Fisher, left to create and produce "Picket Fences."

 

Speaking of PF, their final season was a disaster without DEK at the helm.  The quality fell sharply and quickly.  No one can write a DEK show except DEK.

Edited November 24, 20187 yr by Khan

The Walking Dead...literally a description of the show itself.

 

A couple of seasons ago. I asked myself Why am I still watching this? Endless episodes of 'deep and meaningful' conversations,occasional zombie massacre etc

I still remember how disillusioned I became by Sisters around the time the show fully moved away from it's more melancholy-goofy tone into such horribly depressing, sick, incoherent material, most of it involving what had been the heart of the show (Georgie and her family). 

Just now, Khan said:

 

I think it was the moment when David E. Kelley, who had been the show runner after Bochco and Terry Louise Fisher, left to create and produce "Picket Fences."

 

Speaking of PF, their final season was a disaster without DEK at the helm.  The quality fell sharply and quickly.  No one can write a DEK show except DEK.

 

I gave up on Picket Fences when they became so focused on out-grossing and out-"wackying" themselves at the expense of whatever characterization or foundation had been left. It was around the time that Leigh Taylor Young's character was ran out of the mayor's office on a rail, and those annoying sons were using swans as hockey pucks.

7 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I still remember how disillusioned I became by Sisters around the time the show fully moved away from it's more melancholy-goofy tone into such horribly depressing, sick, incoherent material, most of it involving what had been the heart of the show (Georgie and her family).

 

I will admit there was a point (probably when they suspended the "sauna room" openings in favor of a traditional prologue and opening sequence) when "Sisters" took a very dark turn.  To this day, Kat's rape storyline feels like something that belonged on a grittier, soapier series.

 

Not surprisingly, when Co-EP's Amy Lippman and Chris Keyser left to work on "Party of Five," their work on that series took on a similar tone.

Edited November 24, 20187 yr by Khan

2 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

Actually, I think it was the moment when David E. Kelley, who had been the show runner after Bochco and Terry Louise Fisher, left to create and produce "Picket Fences."

 

Speaking of PF, their final season was a disaster without DEK at the helm.  The quality fell sharp, and quickly.  The reason: no one can truly write a DEK show except for DEK.

 

There was the most BIZARRE thing when Susan Dey quite LA Law to star in own sitcom over on CBS only to be recast by Annie Potts shortly after the show started. I forget the name of the series but it went the way of most the CBS' other sitcoms at the time. 

 

Pickent Fences was a self-sabatoge act in itself in that fact it was always good, even in its fourth season TV Guide picked out an episode for its famous 1997 list of "list of 100 Best 100 episodes". Yet CBS never moved the show from Fridays in spite of its success. Chris Carter and Kelley had wanted to do a crossover but CBS denied, and eventually The X-Files became the most watched Friday night show before moving  in Season 4  to enjoy even greater success on a Sun night than Jessica Fletcher ever could have dreamed of. 

1 minute ago, soapfan770 said:

There was the most BIZARRE thing when Susan Dey quite LA Law to star in own sitcom over on CBS only to be recast by Annie Potts shortly after the show started. I forget the name of the series but it went the way of most the CBS' other sitcoms at the time. 

 

"Love & War," created by Diane English, who also created "Murphy Brown."

 

Why anyone believed Susan Dey could be funny, I'll never know.

15 minutes ago, Franko said:

What was the story there? A wasn't even on for two full seasons.

 

He was supposed to be some hotshot Hispanic attorney with a kid who they threw into Gwen's orbit but then they threw in a creepy stalker who resembled his dead wife who stalked Gwen and then Lisa Zane was cast into the mix. It was thought for like 2-3 episodes that A Martinez's character was the stalker himself and then all of the sudden we found he wasn't but Gwen dumped him anyways and left L.A. while Martinez remained window dressing and you're right, he didn't even make it all the way through Season 8. 

Actually, soapfan770, "The X-Files" was only marginally successfully on Sunday nights compared to "Murder, She Wrote," which was in the top 10 as late as its' 11th season, and only dropped out when Les Moonves moved it to Thursdays, opposite "Friends," in a successful effort to kill it.

2 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

"Love & War," created by Diane English, who also created "Murphy Brown."

 

Why anyone believed Susan Dey could be funny, I'll never know.

 

Thanks! The 1990's were not kind to CBS for the most part. 

 

Another CBS show that crashed and burned was Northern Exposure, which was sad because it was a phenomenon for its time and I loved it. Now, like other shows like LA Law, Wings, Picket Fences etc. NO ONE seems to remember it all. 

5 minutes ago, Khan said:

Actually, soapfan770, "The X-Files" was only marginally successfully on Sunday nights compared to "Murder, She Wrote," which was in the top 10 as late as its' 11th season, and only dropped out when Les Moonves moved it to Thursdays, opposite "Friends," in a successful effort to kill it.

 

Grannies didn't have internet access in the '90s though...

You could divide "Northern Exposure" into two eras: with Rob Morrow, and without.  The NE with Rob Morrow was often brilliant television.  The NE without him is better left forgotten.

 

(Not surprisingly, there's been talk of reviving the series...with Rob Morrow.)

 

5 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

Thanks! The 1990's were not kind to CBS for the most part.

 

That was due to Les Moonves, who trashed CBS' reputation as "the Tiffany network" in favor of series (mostly generic procedurals and misogynistic sitcoms) that alienated its' largely female audiences.

Edited November 24, 20187 yr by Khan

6 minutes ago, Khan said:

You could divide "Northern Exposure" into two eras: with Rob Morrow, and without.  The NE with Rob Morrow was often brilliant television.  The NE without him is better left forgotten.

 

Even with Rob I lost interest, mostly because I just thought they started trying too hard for quirkiness (way too much Ed), faux-depth (Chris - a character who had too many blathering monologues), and the tedious Joel/Maggie relationship.