I'm not exactly sure who you are addressing this to because, frankly, it feels a little passive-aggressive but I'll bite.

I wasn't outraged over the cancellation. Disappointed? Yes but not outraged. If you look back at that time, the ratings threads were basically a weekly thunderdome pitting AMC against OLTL for which show was more likely to die first. Personally, I had already quit watching AMC for about six months but I came back for the birth of the Hubbard baby and that's when the shows got cancelled. If AMC hadn't been cancelled, I probably would've quit watching once the Hubbards' story ran its course.

As for PP, yes I do feel like they gave me a superior product and that's why I don't want the show to return to ABC. I have things that I want from a soap: meaningful diversity, layered female characters with jobs who know about and use contraception, a couple of scenes that pass the Bechtel Test every now and then, social issue stories, more drama and less "soapy goodness", etc… PP gave me all of that and more. After that, why would I want to go back to a version of the show with alpha dogs and concubines; rich, skinny, white bimbos getting knocked up at the drop of a hat, and people coming back from the dead every fifteen minutes?

People were upset with the cancellations because as long as the shows were on the air there was a chance they could get better and because even as awful as they might've been there were still things to like/love. What's so confusing?

Also one of the main reasons some of us want to keep the shows from ABC is because we know that if The Mouse gets the rights back, Cartini will waste no time putting their noxious "stamp" on the characters and stories. Don't underestimate how much some of us (okay, just me) desperately wants to make sure that RC and FV never get the chance to touch these shows again

Nobody ignored your question in those threads, Max. You've asked it before and been answered.

I personally don't care where the shows air, ABC or otherwise. But I understand why other people feel the way they do. ABC disenfranchised these soaps for years, putting them in the poorhouse, stripping them for parts, micromanaging them creatively and then shoving them off the air. Cancelling them for lousy, cheap reality programming was just the final insult. People love the shows and the brands, they don't love the way the network treated them over the last 15-20 years. But you knew that already, of course.

I'm not running them for pageant queen, Max, and what you're saying isn't relevant to what I was talking about. I think the execs behind PP are lousy, I always have. I only care about the shows they put out with the production staff they hired. Those EPs, those casts, those crews - independent of the management, they put out a very good show for both AMC and OLTL IMO. That's all that mattered to me.

As for which execs are worse, PP or ABC, they both lied to the public, their casts, their crews, they both have a multitude of sins - so who [!@#$%^&*] cares?

You got your answer: People loved these shows, they hated how ABC treated them over the last few decades, they wanted something better. They didn't want them cancelled, they wanted them helped. They didn't care who did it. I still don't care who chooses to value the programs, whether it's ABC, PP or someone else. And for my time I got a good show again for both AMC and OLTL, so I was happy for it, brief though it was.

You've been grappling with your "confusion" as to why people who watch ABC soaps felt like their shows should be saved when yours wasn't for at least the last four years, Max. Maybe you should consider letting it go, or just acknowledging what everyone else already knows - that you deeply resent the way we feel about our shows and that we got what you didn't.

ABC, specifically Frons, even lied to Susan Lucci when she was on her book tour that the show wasn't being cancelled. Nothing PP did has topped that, imo!

Oh for the love of God, not this again.

It's actually extremely simple. I was upset at the cancellations because cancelling them was touted as the best/only option for them. No major attempts to rejuvenate the shows took place, despite what that random ABC employee wrote in that insulting internet message, and ABC gave up on their own product without thinking critically about ways to help them regain relevance. ABC had that power. No matter who the EP was or HW was or ANY OTHER PERSON was, ABC had the power to put in charge people who could inject something new and lively into both shows, but they played the same old tired, uninformed cards over and over again until they gave up and cancelled them.

Then PP came along and did the things that ABC could have and should have done (with a bigger budget and more publicity, mind you).

Not to be rude, but I feel like I answered this in 2012 and in 2013.

I think we all did.

AMC was moved to LA because it was overbudget and they thought getting it out of NYC, where everything had already begun costing more for production, would cut their costs. There's no other reasoning behind that. That's a fact.

ABC originally wanted to cancel OLTL first - aesthetically, Brian Frons preferred GH and AMC - but AMC continued to be a drag on finances despite the move. Because OLTL was still under budget, this failed strategy left them with egg on their face. Thus, they opted to cancel both rather than change course, because overall ABC believed the day of the soap was done and that cheap variety programming was the future. Frons begged clemency for Bob Guza's GH and got it.

That's all there is to it.

Also, your personal opinions about the shows on PP and their quality are completely irrelevant to the questions you're asking us about ABC and the soaps as they existed in their last 10-15 years on the network. Either you want to ask us questions or you want to tell us why we're wrong by presenting your thesis - pick one.

ABC ran these shows into the ground with bad headwriters and there was always the possibility if someone in charge cared to make them great again. PP brought in Agnes Nixon and her influence showed strongly on the internet version of AMC, which was the best that soap had been since the mid 1990s, imo.

On April 14th, it'll be 3 years since the cancellation announcement. Let it go.

I love the graphic and agree we've discussed this ad nauseam, but I couldn't resist putting in my 2 cents one last time.

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Edited March 29, 201411 yr by Nate4

I still enjoyed OLTL the last few years on network, so I'm not really in the target range for this question but it depends on the individual person's feelings. Some people see their soap limping along and want it to be taken out of its misery which is understandable. I'm the type of person who wouldn't want my soap to be canned because A) it's a comfortable niche I at least have the option of visiting everyday to see actors and characters I love. It's a niche and a comfort zone. I think having a "bad" soap on air is better than having no soap on air. While it's still on TV (or Internet or wherever) there's still a chance for improvement IMO.

I didn't watch either show but just being around these boards during that period I got these impressions.

People were still invested in the shows/characters on ABC even if the shows were not great. I think audiences wanted the shows fixed not cancelled and were upset by the treatment by ABC of such legacy shows. The cancellations received outrage simply because ABC made no real effort and didn't seem to care in the slightest. All decisions seemed to be business only and no real considerations were given to the creative aspect of the shows.

The move to PP was dreaded by some as the internet is still new for original content programming. There were no guarantees who would be involved or how good the product would be, if it would find an audience and survive. Plus as bad as network tv is, there is still a prestige over internet programming.

Once the shows aired, most seemed very happy and in fact excited about the shows and felt the quality, care and investment that had been missing on ABC was returned. Having had a better shows(s) during this period and knowing the kind of attitude ABC had towards them in the past, it would make sense that no one would want them back on that network.

It isn't a contradiction of emotions, you just have to follow the evolution of that period to understand it, even somewhat.

You got your answer: People loved these shows, they hated how ABC treated them over the last few decades, they wanted something better. They didn't want them cancelled, they wanted them helped. They didn't care who did it. I still don't care who chooses to value the programs, whether it's ABC, PP or someone else. And for my time I got a good show again for both AMC and OLTL, so I was happy for it, brief though it was.

This. I didn't like AMC's final years on ABC. I tried to get into OLTL in the early to mid 90s and couldn't and never bothered to go back, so I didn't care about OLTL's cancellation. Because of that, I resented the way the shows were presented by PP as a package deal.

Despite my dislike of AMC's final years, I didn't want to see the show END. I would have preferred that Lorraine Broderick be given a chance to actually do her job - the cancellation notice came out just weeks after she returned - and see if she could tell compelling stories and get the ratings up. They'd gone to a tremendous effort to move everything out to the west coast, and canceling it all just seemed like such a waste after so many people had uprooted their lives for the show.

I was enthusiastic about PP's version at first, but I soon realized that while it did have some good qualities (excellent production value, and Agnes' obvious touch in making Jesse and David both more layered and less one-note characters), it simply wasn't appealing to me personally. I didn't like the story direction, and the changes in the number of episodes per week messed up the pacing. Perhaps if PP had had the funds to continue with a second season, it could have gotten better. I would have been willing to give a second season a shot anyway.

Regardless, if PP or ABC or anyone else wants to produce AMC again, I'm willing to give it a chance and watch and see if the stories draw me in and keep my interest. I'm torn as to the ABC/PP lawsuit. I do think ABC attempted to sabotage PP, but IDK how much of that will translate to a settlement or award. I think PP mismanaged the reboot in a lot of ways, but at least they tried. I'm not sure that rooting for ABC to get the rights back is going to result in us ever seeing AMC again.

I will speak for myself when I say that as many problems as I had with both (and I had plenty), they shouldn't have gone off the air before General Hospital. No way in hell and the fact that they are gone while the worst of the three is currently wasting valuable airtime that could be spent on something better is appalling.

I agree, and I never gave a damn about the ABC soaps, always thought they were all overhyped to the extreme.

But I was outraged when GH was the one to survive. And I'm even more outraged now, seeing how much further it's sunk.

I didn't watch AMC that much. But for OLTL, while a lot of the stories made me sick for years, not to mention some horrific non-actors, there was still a lot for many of us to invest in. I watched OLTL for years and many people watched it a lot longer than that. There were still a lot of stories and characters that everyone still cared about. The same goes for AMC. I was hoping Prospect Park would be more successful but I can't say I'm surprised it wasn't. I don't like how the casts and crew for those soaps were treated by ABC or PP, but I was happy to see both shows continue online, no matter how short it was.

And as many have said, this topic has been rehashed many times.

And as many have said, this topic has been rehashed many times.

The topic of the cancellations themselves has been rehashed. The unique thing here (and the reason for this thread) was my puzzlement over the sentiment that there are folks here who don't want ABC to retake creative control of AMC/OLTL, even though many of these same people were upset over the cancellations at the time (back when ABC had full creative control of both shows). (As I alluded to earlier, I did previously mention this topic in existing threads, but I never felt as if I got thorough answer, and furthermore this particular matter always ended up getting lost in the shuffle. If I felt I had received a sufficient answer, I certainly wouldn't have started a new thread.)

Prior to starting this thread, I just looked at things with my own mentality (which infers that if you thought the shows were so awful on ABC, then why would you have been so angry when ABC cancelled them). There were a lot of really insightful responses on this thread (especially from the posters who usually don't discuss ABC soaps), and it made me realize that the opposing mentality wasn't contradictory. In other words, I realize people weren't enjoying the way the ABC soaps were in 2011, but were still outraged over the cancellations because it capped a long period of neglect, and that--once PP put out a supposedly superior product--these same fans now had a strong aversion to ABC reviving these soaps.

I personally disagree with the key premise that these soaps would be in better hands if they remained under PP's control, but I now fully understand the logic behind the "contradictory" set of feelings outlined in the question posed by the title of this thread.

Edited March 30, 201411 yr by Max