Jill said it's not Devon

I don't believe nothing that comes out these people mouths.

I haven't watched this show in years and am commenting on stuff that I don't really know about, so forgive me. I do know that when I watched Y&R regularly they tried to pair Neil and Victoria and were getting hate mail and the relationship was quickly aborted. The fact that Lily and this Cane person are one of the show's most popular couples shows some advancement on the show's part and the audience's part, in my opinion.

I haven't watched this show in years and am commenting on stuff that I don't really know about, so forgive me. I do know that when I watched Y&R regularly they tried to pair Neil and Victoria and were getting hate mail and the relationship was quickly aborted. The fact that Lily and this Cane person are one of the show's most popular couples shows some advancement on the show's part and the audience's part, in my opinion.

They got their fans but the audience that CkLily suppose to cater to have left in huge numbers when VR went over the cliff. & the producers got to take that into account when they talking over CK contract. Even after Dru die they wrote all these storylines for CK & she couldn't deliver.

Even the people who was happy CK came back now saying she needs to go. Now I'm not saying that DS would have kept these viewers but they wouldn't have left in droves. I stop watching when I heard that they got rid of Davetta, because I knew what they was going to do to Dru daughter once CK came back & I was right. CKLily can't stand on her own, she weak, & got no goals. Dru daughter suppose to be anything but.

Edited August 29, 201213 yr by MoTheGreat

Here's the thing... everyone says vicky's return would mean ratings. But did the ratings remain strong during the Tuvia/Orchid SL when the entire Winters family was on virtually every DAY for 6 months? I think Julia is a fine actress, once again, not spectacular, and I thought the hospital scene with not Macolm was very good. And I like that she's not some supermodel type. I do GET IT... I understand what TPTB are trying to do with Kahlil's Lily. I understand that they are trying to be progressive and post racial and all of that, but at the end of the day, the black viewers want a glamorous STEREOTYPE. And that's what Drucilla was.... and they want Lily to be a Mini- me of her. So they might as well accept it and pander to it. Give the public what it wants.

Edited August 29, 201213 yr by alphanguy74

and they want to Liliy to be a Mini- me of her.

How can Lily be a 'mini-me' if they had totally different life experiences? Being a glamorous stereotype isn't genetic. Why can't the fans be happy that Lily is more like her father Neil and her Aunt Olivia?

How can Lily be a 'mini-me' if they had totally different life experiences? Being a glamorous stereotype isn't genetic. Why can't the fans be happy that Lily is more like her father Neil and her Aunt Olivia?

Why should Lily be more like her father which he isn't her father. Malcolm is her father. Lily grew up around Dru. why should Lily be like her aunt Liv, she grew up away from Liv. The back story is that Lily was being like her mother when she was in France, hanging around a rough crowd, she must look up her mother old lifestyle & thought that was much more entertaining the princess Lily that viewers like you wanted her to be.

Back to aunt Liv, CKLily is nothing like her black family. I like Olivia, I can't stand how CK plays Dru daughter.

& when we say mini me we mean a go getter, What traits prove that CKLily is a go getter. She's nothing like Olivia who is a doctor, Neil a business man, Malcolm did his thing, & Dru did her thing. Devon is more like a go getter he wanted to do music.

Edited August 29, 201213 yr by MoTheGreat

Here's the thing... everyone says vicky's return would mean ratings. But did the ratings remain strong during the Tuvia/Orchid SL when the entire Winters family was on virtually every DAY for 6 months? I think Julia is a fine actress, once again, not spectacular, and I thought the hospital scene with not Macolm was very good. And I like that she's not some supermodel type. I do GET IT... I understand what TPTB are trying to do with Kahlil's Lily. I understand that they are trying to be progressive and post racial and all of that, but at the end of the day, the black viewers want a glamorous STEREOTYPE. And that's what Drucilla was.... and they want Lily to be a Mini- me of her. So they might as well accept it and pander to it. Give the public what it wants.

No one return can ever mean ratings but you point to something that is a real problem. One character can't be all things to a "community." Whatever weakness that Y&R has had with diversity, one of its strengths was the fact that it had enough black characters that there wasn't pressure on anyone to be The One. They had Drucilla, Olivia, Nathan, Malcolm, and Mamie (those are the ones that I remember). Each character could be an individual with their own motives and histories. It made sense that Olivia was the good girl and Dru was the "stereotype" to use your term. And because there were numerous characters, they could be given truly soapy storylines like the questions around Lily's parentage without being accused of writing the ONE black woman on the show as a slut or conversely being pressured to write her as perfect/saintly.

You can't have one character represent everyone. White characters aren't viewed as being representative of anyone but themselves but minority characters don't have that luxury. If Dru comes back, that needs to be only the beginning. If there isn't a serious thoughtful commitment to rebuilding that canvas I can promise you that her return will be an epic fail.

Edited August 30, 201213 yr by marceline

Exactly, marceline. It's like the point I was trying to make about Sofia yesterday.

No one return can ever mean ratings but you point to something that is a real problem. One character can't be all things to a "community." Whatever weakness that Y&R has had with diversity, one of it's strengths was the fact that it had enough black characters that there wasn't pressure on anyone to be The One. They had Drucilla, Olivia, Nathan, Malcolm, and Mamie (those are the ones that I remember from its heyday). Each character could be an individual with their own motives and histories. It made sense that Olivia was the good girl and Dru was the "stereotype" to use your term. And because there were numerous of characters, they could be given truly soapy storylines like the questions around Lily's parentage without being accused of writing the ONE black woman on the show as a slut or conversely being pressured to write her as perfect/saintly.

You can't have one character represent everyone. White characters aren't viewed as being representative of anyone but themselves but minority characters don't have that luxury. If Dru comes back, that needs to be only the beginning. If there isn't a serious thoughtful commitment to rebuilding that canvas I can promise you that her return will be an epic fail.

That makes all kinds of sense. When I was watching in High school, it was Amy, Jazz, Tyrone, Mamie, Frank, Nathan, and Salena. And they DID run the gamut. Nathan... thug turned good guy. Jazz was basically the same. Tyrone, the "Good brother" (Cane and Abel SL) Mamie, the snotty domestic, Frank, the big wig chief of police, and his daughter Amy, sweet girl and Traci's best friend, and Salena occupied Ronan's spot on the canvas. . "Kong" was mentioned earlier... and you guys do realize that Kong was Nathan? He worked for Mob boss Mr. Anthony, and turned states' evidence... so then he dropped the "kong" moniker and went by his real name, and that was his redemption. I have always said that the sibling rivalry of Dru/Olivia was one of the most riveting SL's this show ever had. But then you have people say that Olivia is High Yellow and boring, and they don't like her, and back then, you ahd people saying about Phil Morris "How DARE they take a black man and paint him white!". So it's a case of your'e always gonna have somebody bitching about it not being good enough. That's why pandering to fanbases doesn't work.. and Bill Bell's motto of "I do what I want, screw the fans" is the best way to go.

Edited August 30, 201213 yr by alphanguy74

Dru? A Stereotype?

The trolling has reached epic proportions.

And because there were numerous characters, they could be given truly soapy storylines like the questions around Lily's parentage without being accused of writing the ONE black woman on the show as a slut or conversely being pressured to write her as perfect/saintly.

Except it DID paint her as a slut which is why Jack Smith should have NEVER touched that story.

Dru? A Stereotype?

Especially when you have a maid named Mamie walking around?

Except it DID paint her as a slut which is why Jack Smith should have NEVER touched that story.

I never thought she was painted as a slut... Malcolm did her while she was zonked out on pills... that's damn near rape in my book.

Especially when you have a maid named Mamie walking around?

They were both stereotypes. It's not a bad thing, it just is what it is. I'm a stereotype myself. Olivia, Amy, and Salena weren't, though.

Edited August 30, 201213 yr by alphanguy74

I never thought she was painted as a slut... Malcolm did her while she was zonked out on pills... that's damn near rape in my book..

It WAS rape. Period.

But Y&R acted like Lily was conceived during Malcolm & Drucilla's relationship which never happened.

They were both stereotypes.

They weren't stereotypes.

Sofia & Scottie Pippen are stereotypes.

Lol just remembered a funny story about the first time my mother saw CK Lily which was like a year ago. She heard Lily call Neil dad and was like "That's not his kid right? Not by Dru!"