I do remember your charts, Sylphy.

I just remember Mark being very persistent with them during Y&R's last big ratings decline in 2008.

Not a bash against either of you, I'm just surprised no one is doing them this time around, but then again, a lot of us have already given up on daytime.

I don't know, but it's not like there was a lot of interest back then. At least I don't remember any. People might have liked them, but I haven't scene all that many questions when someone posted them or proposed a theory.

I do remember your charts, Sylphy.

Enough with all the sexual infectious..it's sickening!! and gross! Ewwwwwwwwwwwwww

I still don't get the Jikky Jee reference, is there some significance? I'm legitimately curious, it's over my head!

Jill is definitely NOT Erica Kane, not in that ballpark at all. And it's very valid to say she isn't a mass appeal character. In the context of Y&R, however, I feel that Jill is an integral part of the show and if the character wasn't there, the show would die a swifter death than it already is.

Jill is part of The Young and the Restless, but I think that show died when that woman, Alden, what's-her-name, left. That was endgame. Still, though part of me like Jill and agrees with you completely, at times I fail to see what she brought that was so... I'm not sure what adjective to use. Maybe, after all these years, no matter how masterful in his own way, Bill Bell and his crop of characters had mammoth flaws that wouldn't survive detailed scrutiny.

My response to that is "Whose Normal?" The Katherine's and Jill's of the world exist and are functional and achieve and have families and do good things. But they are totally screwed up.

Everyone has their baggage and some people never get past themselves. I happen to like that.

That's OK, I guess. Though to me, sometimes to many neuroses too much of the time is too much.

I have a feeling a lot would tune out if Jill left the show. She along with others IS Y&R.

I would leave with Jill.

I like many of the characters and watch the whole show (only FFing when it's really bad). But I started watching when I was in grade school, the first year the show was on, so I've followed Jill since the beginning. I just wouldn't care anymore without her. And Jill would have to be Jess Walton, she is Jill to me. I liked the first one but I think of her as young Jill.

That gets old. Fast. But people only realize it with a sizable delay. Soaps increasingly over the years tried to tell stories about messed up people when it would've been more effective to make it about normal people with difficulties. People who grown and change. Not bear the mark of inability to mature for half a century.

Normal people are boring. A love triangle with someone between mother/daughter or father/son is good soapy fun for me. Although I can do without the really weird stuff like frozen cities and double doppelgangers.

And Jill was growing in many ways, she had developed from manicurist into a smart high-level corporate executive, until they tore her apart. Nevertheless I'm still hooked on Jill's story because I'm still waiting for her to be the lady of her own home and life. She may own half of the Chancellor Estate but Katherine rules the roost and horns in on every important event with her children/family. I'm not in a huge rush for JC to leave but I can't wait for the day that it's just Jill & husband. I always imagined she would head Chancellor Industries, and develop Chance to take the helm when she was gone.- what a mess they have made of that.

I am offended because I introduced the charts. Then my file that had the archives evaporated, I didn't have the time to make it again and MarkH introduced his own, going back to the 1950s.

I do remember your charts, Sylphy.

I just remember Mark being very persistent with them during Y&R's last big ratings decline in 2008.

Not a bash against either of you, I'm just surprised no one is doing them this time around, but then again, a lot of us have already given up on daytime.

Sylph definitely was first, and inspired my own quantitative explorations--but he gets no blame for my obsession with the numbers.

Like Sylph, I lost my data files. I also have been meaning to look at the long period of slower decline we've been having lately...but time hasn't been available.

I did try to adapt TVByTheNumbers Cancel/Renew index for daytime lately; that led me to believe that on quantitative grounds (as many of you have already written elsewhere) AMC and B&B should be the next two shows cancelled. The only question is whether simple numbers rule daytime in the same way as primetime...I have my doubts.

http://markhsoap.blogspot.com/2011/02/daytime-on-bubble-renewcancel-index-for.html