November 1-5, 2010

[EricMontreal22]

Demos are HUGELY important. But I always feel this notion that "ALL that matters whatsoever is the 18-49 demo" has been tossed around among fans so much that everyone takes it as one of the Ten Commandments. Is it really, are we certain, ALL that matters?!? (I'm sure I sound defensive, but it's one of those things I've never seen officially stated--just hearsay)

Exactly. that's why I'm not convinced it's the be all and end all of what's what.

[EricMontreal22]

The tone of AMC has been slowly eroded since the mid-late 90s (some might argue earlier, but I wouldn't). What set it apart from, say the P&G soaps or Y&R in the old days was both that it always focused on young love (back when this wasn't a focus on all the shows), and that it had a lot of comedy--sometimes quite broad in the case of over the top Dickensian characters (some might argue caricature). Plus of course the social storylines. It was a mix that some didn't like (some soap books in the 70s have said it's liek watching three different shows in one, with each scene a different tone--I don't agree, I think they managed to make the tone fit, but). But it brought in a lot of new soap viewers--I think it's huge rise in the 70s was due to at least as many viewers who never watched soaps before (notably college students and men--it was the top daytime program for men for much of that time) as it did existing soap viewers.

Agnes also had a knack for writing more down to earth and relatable characters. Anyway a lot of that is missing, or at least is in lower quantities now (though as a fan hanging on, I do see elements of the old AMC back, and still have some fondness for the current regime compared to the very un AMC tone of Pratt's, etc). but we don't really have any great comic characters, or broad older characters, too many people now are independantly wealthy, loss of the sense of community (many fans in the 70s marveled that even compared to other soaps, Pine Valley really felt like an identifiable place--that's long gone), etc

[Ann_SS]

Give the tons of posts here about the overall numbers, it is clear that everyone does not believe that the 18 to 49 women demo is all that matters. In fact, most of them don't which is why most of the debates about the ratings are positively inane.

Also, the importance of the 18 to 49 women demo to advertisers of soaps and a multitude of shows have been stated in many articles in tv mags and interviews with network executives.

[EricMontreal22]

See I'd give it another 5 years (though when Passanante wrote it solo it was prob the low point), but I get your point.

[Saving ATWT]

Sounds like AMC was a great show. Every soap used to maintain some unique feel, tone, quality and, aside from B&B, these elements seem now to be gone. Each soap brand, like the line up of 2011 autos, looks so similiar and homogenized. Even Y&R has lost the sexy mood lighting and in favor of brass yellow tones. My only real contact with AMC was during the Pratt period and I did like the look and unusual filming style--seemed to me like scenes were shot from above in an amphitheater. I only watched the Trans story but, overall, liked the show. Have no idea why Frons chose DK aside from the fact that GL was very much a community show and, even with handheld cam, Springfield felt real. I'm probably one of the few posters who saw potential in this production model.I knew a kid who worked on the GL and the entire show was staffed by recent college grads--cheap labor. My main issues were the cheap looking white trash houses used along with the semi-contrey/folk music.

OLTL is the only ABC show that seems to focus on community. RC OLTL reminds me of late Marland ATWT with his parties, use of Vikky as pillar of the community, the strong family connections and over-sized cast. I'm a bitter ATWT fan but can objectivly say that OLTL is the best soap currently on air.

As for demos, NBC is trying to sell the 54-62 demo and this was noted in Monday's Nelson TVGUIDE.ca article. This would mean a lot to Days, as well as other soaps. It is too bad no one considered this back when the PGP shows were still on air.

[AS THE WORLD TURNS]

Oh that. I seen TC if you mean Katie she could of been added back in after you said they were gone.

[Saving ATWT]

They pulled TC and MW because they are now under new contracts. I just don't understand why the site is even up. It is as if TPTB at TeleNext are still shopping the brand and it makes me wonder if SD isn't going to come out with one final 'The Man From Oakdale' type book. I'd think they would have timed it for the holiday season, though.

Those cheap books would be a great way for dead soaps to live on. With the right writer, they could develop a real cult following along the lines of Harlequin Romance novels but with a slightly wider appeal. PGP could even make mention of their various products in the book from Tide to Pantene by working these items into the text. A 'Soap Classics' line of serial novels including ATWT, GL, AW and, maybe EON would be rather cool. They would be like Harry Potter for the Sr. demo

[AS THE WORLD TURNS]

I said TC is on there and I don't think Maura West was ever on there I never seen her. Her fans were mad that was never added.

[Saving ATWT]

TC has her own 'speaking' intro? I thought her's was pulled down about the same time as Reid Olivers.

[J.W.S]

Well If Its The Demos & Money AMC Has Two strikes aganist it. Its last In Demos and so Overbudget

OLTL is always Under Budget. In Fact Its the Money ABC saves from OLTL that they use to try and balance out AMC and GH

[Saving ATWT]

How can OLTL still be under-budget with such a HUGE cast? I know they don't pay top dollar, TC said she had to take a pay cut when she joined; however, the cost of so many actors plus the addition of a new associate head writer must add up. I've been hearing OLTL is under-budget for years now but is this still the case after the AMC move to LA? There is no way OLTL is under budget ever quarter. I'm suprised Frons has not cut deeper to a Days production model costing 150,000 per show or drop even lower like ATWT. Days costs less but gets better demos and ATWT ranked pretty close to OLTL so I'm suprised ABC has been willing to spend so much.

SoapNet profit must help the entire ABC line up. We all are so focused on the weekly daytime ratings but ABC has a second revenue stream with these shows--I'd love to see the total viewership for OLTL Daytime+Online+SoapNet. That total must be a lot higher than 2.4 million. I expect serious budget cuts for all ABC soaps once SoapNet dies unless Frons has some plan to get these shows onto Lifetime which would be really smart. I wonder if Sony will try a Y&R replay on another cable channel such as Hallmark, OWN or even BET.

[Bella20]

The profit most not be too much, if anything, since SoapNet is about to go off the air.

[JaneAusten]

Sometime back one of the AMC actors(I think it was Jacob Young) was encouraging fans to watch the show and watch it on ABC because the viewing on Soapnet was not really a factor. I am going to guess based on this and the fact that Soapnet is changing formats in 2012 tells me the amount of $$$ generated is probably minimal.

[Saving ATWT]

SoapNet makes a profit; however, the Disney brand is on fire and they will make an even larger profit with Disney Jr. Disney is focusing on a brand with larger growth potential, trying to loose the image as a steady blue chip stock. Also, there are many rumors that Disney wants to sell ABC, which it considers a failure much like Viacom did with CBS, and the Disney Jr. switch would be a good way to retain the cable outlet.

The line up makes money and could easily end up on another cable channel that pulls older demos and is satisfied with slower growth. One of the Lifetime Channels would be a perfect fit and, since they are co-owned by Hearst, would not really effect the Disney bottom line even after a sale. Neither company is dumping a lot of money into these networks and the soaps are still 'new' programming at low cost. If ABC gets sold/spun off, the future of these soaps is anyone's guess.

I'd still love to see the total live+online+SoapNet ratings for GH, OLTL, and AMC if anyone has them. I know both Y&R and Days get a huge number of online hits. Even though no one makes money online, 14 million hits does suggest that the genre is far from dead.

[Bella20]

Where did you read this? Just a few years ago Frons was complaining that the ratings were so low that Nielsen couldn't measure them. I know that ratings for AMC, GH, and OLTL have gotten better, but I think that's relative to what they were, but not in the realm of actually making Disney money.