OLTL: Discussion for the week November 1

[DRW50]

The difference is that Clint pined for Viki for years after their divorce, whereas Bo got over Nora and was very distant towards her for quite a long time, and was happy with a number of other women.

The Buchanans used to be a very believable family, with fights as well as warm moments, but I haven't seen that in a long time. I don't think it helps that so many of the characters have been trashed in recent years.

[TeamEric]

Hmm... I don't see much difference. Viki and Clint have been divorced for what 16 years now. And while Clint pined for her, he also married Lindsay when Viki was sending all those I'm interested signals. Regardless, 16 years later, if Bo chased and married Viki, you bet Clint would be soooooooo hurt and furious. That's the love of his life.

So Bo called Nora many times. Bo only stayed distant due to the Sam/Matthew debacle. In fact, that was a sign right there he couldn't get past the devastation so easily and just be "friends" like Viki & Clint managed.

Even as RSW paraded around town with one young chick after another, most viewers knew Nora was the love of his life so darn well Clint knew and he still chased her. Now I blame Nora for not coming clean with her feelings before the wedding. She made a huge mistake in marrying Clint but I guess I do side with Bo some, brothers don't poach on the other's great love.

Clint's just sore because Nora married him instead of being honest and that B&N spent months in an emotional affair making a fool out of him. Clint despises being made a fool of and that's the bottom line. He feels David did the same thing with Kim. She ran off leaving Clint feeling like an old lecher who was rejected by the stripper he had real feelings for.

Clint always despised when Asa belittled him, reacting poorly to it. In the past with Clunker in the role, Clint was known to experience quite the inferiority complex married to well-educated, classy Victoria Lord. JVD's Clint is classier and more well-read businessman version but I still see the Clint who hated being made a fool of.

[DRW50]

I'm not even sure if today's Clint would care. The new Clint history says that Clint cheated on Viki for years. That doesn't seem like the love of his life. If Clint was upset it would be if they wrote him as seeing Viki as a possession, since this is the new, Asa 2.0 Clint.

Clint had little to do but pine for Viki for years until he suddenly married Lindsey and then left town. He then stayed away for almost a decade, aside from a few visits. Bo stayed in town with Nora and while he sometimes seemed fond of her, or questioned her relationships, he had no qualms about being with a variety of women and having them as mother to Matthew. Until the last few years I think the show presented him as being over Nora in a romantic sense.

[Cheap21]

I honestly dont think he'd care. If he did it would be more about his rivalry with Bo as opposed to Viki. Clint is LONG since over her. Maybe if CR was in the role,things might be different but they dont play up Viki as the love of Clint's life since JVD took over. No teasing or hinting or any residual feelings. Everything is strictly platonic and I dont get the feeling that if he could be with her if there was nothing in the way, that he'd want that. Its simply not how things are written

[TeamEric]

Actually when Bo pointed out the analogy Clint winced and it was the first time I felt a glimmer of understanding in Clint's eyes. A glimmer but it was there.

Years? Where do you get? It's been repeated Echo was in town for a year and part of that time she was framing Clint for murder. Sounds like instead of a one night stand, RC is making it a few months affair. That sucks, but it's not like Luke on GH who suddenly screwed Holly and hookers all through his marriage to Laura. After all, Viki did cheat on Clint with Sloan, which makes them even on the cheating dept.

Hmm, I disagree. ES plays it strictly platonic but last summer when JVD had those scenes in Asa's cabin I felt he was selling Clint still having feelings for Viki. So just gotta agree to disagree as frankly I don't see Charlie as long-term partner for Viki. I'm betting by next summer it's Viki & Clint.

[DRW50]

I thought all that about her making appearances in Llanview later on, after she was supposed to have initially left town, was supposed to be part of their affair.

[SFK]

Among the more obvious reasons why I am so firmly against Ford being the father of Viki's grandbaby is my belief that Ford and Jessica have zero chemistry. One might say that doesn't matter since they aren't intended to have a romantic relationship, but no, I feel that they don't even share chemistry as scene partners and that just won't work for people who will need to be in one another's lives having screaming matches/bonding moments/whatever for the next several (optimisitc) years. I would have such an easier time accepting this character if they just let him be a jerk, I continue to be appalled by how hard they try to justify the presence of such a superficial character, how much effort they put into making him "work" all because of the way he looks with his shirt off.

[Vee]

If I was sure they had said Clint was [!@#$%^&*] around on Viki long-term, I'd be up in arms, but I haven't seen clear evidence of that yet. Certainly it seems he gave Echo that necklace which seems to indicate a longer liaison than what we previously thought, and I don't think I like that. But I think Echo's return to Llanview the following year was only to drop off Rex. For the most part I still really enjoy the story, especially ES and JVD's prominence. And KZ has added some great nuances to her usual persona - that little accent, for one.

I have no interest in Viki and Clint reuniting. They're both so much more interesting apart now, while still in story together - I love her with Charlie, and I love him with people like Kim and Echo. This Clint has more responsibilities, and shades, than he had when he was with Viki; to an extent, he must be Asa, which he didn't have to be while they were together and which would likely have ended their marriage back then. I think the show has toyed with the idea before but I hope they've dropped it for good, and I don't see any sign of it here.

If the show had any sense Viki would've learned the truth about Natalie's baby today. But no, she can only have a prominent role in one story at a time.

I don't want Jessica to lose another baby, but I also don't want her to have a Ford. At all. Ever.

[SFK]

Exactly. Meanwhile, Michele Lee and Joan van Ark would clutch their pearls at word of Jessica Leccia playing a 34-year-old grandmother.

[TeamEric]

I could be wrong, but I thought Rex dug up that Echo returned just once. Rex dug up a speeding ticket that noted she returned a year later. He noticed yesterday the speeding ticket was very close to the day he was abandoned at Llanview Hospital... which is a rewrite b/c he was abandoned in Atlantic City wasn't he? That whole Mitch is his father story was such a mess I may be confused on that.

I guess we'll hear the full backstory over the next week and figure out how far RC wants to take this rewrite.

[Vee]

No, according to Alison, Rex was abandoned at Llanview Hospital.

[TeamEric]

Never watched GL but KZ's rep proceeded her. I was fearing another OOT IK who I've always found an appallingly bad actress going back to Delia, but KZ is far more restrained and nuanced. I like her. I am very much enjoying KZ, ES and JVD mixing it up. Could do with a little more RS splashed in though.

I find Charlie a complete, crashing bore. He's a useless character who's not even smart enough to holds Viki's purse. Good grief, even Ben and Blondie was more entertaining than the Charlie and Viki stuff and I loathed them. I was never a big Viki & Clint fan as cowboy CR bored me, too. But JVD has brought a twinkle, a smarter, savvier Clint that I enjoy. I don't think he's evil, I think he's trying to act way tougher than he is. I like ES/JvD chem a lot too.

I think that mixup last year with the Asa wedding banner was setup for V&C reunion and ever since I've seen MORE scenes between V&C leaning on each other during tough times than Viki/Charlie. I could be wrong but hey I'll watch and see where RC takes it.

Viki isn't even allowed a phone call to check on Todd, Tea, Dani, Starr and Hope. That's stupid writing as it was with Viki never checking if Todd was alive last April, and barely interested in her daughter's pregnancies b/c she's so worried about REX - REX of all people, good grief!!!

I fear we are [!@#$%^&*] out of luck, Vee, that baby has a Ford name all but stamped on it. I hate it, I hate it, I hate it but I see it coming a mile away.

[TeamEric]

I don't even find DAG remotely attractive so I just don't get it. NR's James is a cutie-pie, a subpar actor but he he's got some real sweet charm to him so I can at least see the APPEAL there. Arghh... I don't the overnight instant family sob story and four more family members to sell HIM.

But I am sure RC wants Ford as Jessica's baby father, he's not a subtle writer and he's all but telegraphed it. Plus, all OLTL writers get off on victimizing Jessica and if it's Brody's kid, what's next? They are a toothache sugary sweet already.

[Vee]

Well, I love Ilene Kristen. But often the problem with Kim Zimmer on GL was that she was a vibrant character actress forced into the role of show heroine and "sex goddess," a label which just doesn't fit when she is a leathery old sex bat who's clearly overweight. On the British soaps all this would be a boon for her immortality, where they treasure these hard-boiled women of a certain age. But in the '90s and most of the past decade on GL, they treated her Reva like she was Erica Kane or Brenda Barrett, all things desirable, and even a glamorous island princess and psychic time traveler. This changed a bit towards the end of the show's run, as they began to acknowledge that Reva was an overweight old grandma who still loved sex and the bottle, and she seemed far more real for the first time in a long time IMO. But by then virtually all the storytelling was [!@#$%^&*].

Echo is a supporting role and a heavy, so Zimmer's obvious inherent strengths are finally able to be spotlit. She can be hammy, like many soap stars, but she also is very talented. She can be obnoxious onscreen and off, but she's never anything more than totally committed IMO. And she's really transformed a lot of her persona to play Echo again, I think. This could've just been Reva again and it's not.

As for Viki and Clint, I remember those scenes and I think some background was lain there and later, but it's long since been abandoned with the advent of Kim, then Inez and Echo. If they were going to do it, they'd have done it when Viki and Charlie were separated post-Mitch. Maybe it'll happen when the show ends; I hope not.

I don't know whose idea the Ford/Jessica thing first was, Frons or RC, but it's clearly coming if it's not shouted down by the audience. Brody was an RC favorite which is how he got a contract, but a lot of RC favorites have hit the scrapheap in the last year.

[SFK]

"Never watched GL but KZ's rep proceeded her. I was fearing another OOT IK who I've always found an appallingly bad actress going back to Delia, but KZ is far more restrained and nuanced. I like her. I am very much enjoying KZ, ES and JVD mixing it up. Could do with a little more RS splashed in though."

Yeah, I can't say that I've shared the crazy love that others have for Roxy. I do enjoy her but sometimes the writers are just pushing it and IK *really* goes for it, she's not one to dial it back to make it a little more palpable. I was rather taken aback watching her and KZ work together the other day, I had to laugh, KZ was doing a very good job with her little polite laughter, playing the straight man in that scene. We're so used to seeing her as the one who's "out in orbit" in a scene. I also caught myself thinking how special it is for the show to have such a nice share of living soap opera legends assembled, Kristen, Zimmer, ver Dorn, Strasser (agreed, more Strasser please!), Slezak, and of course RSW and HBS across town.