I thought I'd open since it's been a week. It still doesn't seem real.

29 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

not so much about economic status or class, what i miss is soaps with characters grounded in reality and emotional authenticity.

apple tv+ opened their vault over the weekend and i watched ‘shrinking’. the characters were largely well-educated, extremely well-paid professionals. but the relationships between and among the characters were grounded in familiar and relatable emotional conflicts — parent and child, spouses, friends, colleagues. 

would be nice if ‘behind the gates’ is at least emotionally grounded, but i’m not holding my breath. 

 

 

I agree. It's probably too much to ask for in today's TV landscape. Especially if they want it to survive more than a few years. I couldn't watch that Dynasty reboot but look how long it went on!

I, too, think a good writer could write rich, over the top characters, but still keep them grounded in familiar and relatable emotional conflicts. I'd definitely watch that. As long as they did it in gorgeous clothes with great one liners. (The emotional grounding has to come from the actors as well as the writers. Tamara Tunie is one of those actresses who I feel can make the writing better. Maybe some of the others can as well!)

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

1 hour ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

not so much about economic status or class, what i miss is soaps with characters grounded in reality and emotional authenticity.

apple tv+ opened their vault over the weekend and i watched ‘shrinking’. the characters were largely well-educated, extremely well-paid professionals. but the relationships between and among the characters were grounded in familiar and relatable emotional conflicts — parent and child, spouses, friends, colleagues. 

would be nice if ‘behind the gates’ is at least emotionally grounded, but i’m not holding my breath. 

Expand  

What survives of Lemay's AW run shows very wealthy characters who have rich inner lives and react in believable ways. 

And in Marland-era ATWT, you had many rich characters who were still grounded and felt real.

The funny part is that the whole idea of soaps being about camp and OTT and glamour became bigger just as the budgets became smaller. Even Y&R and B&B, which were the most "glam" (although outside of some location shoots I always thought B&B looked a bit cheap to be honest), did not survive without huge slashings.

You also have to ask what DOES glamourous mean in 2025? Kim Hughes sitting down in her Patterns chair had glamour...does a never-ending supply of veneers, Botox, Ozempic, and wearing American flag bikinis at Maralago? Does the increasingly desiccated Bravo circuit?

That's why I don't really need whatever turgid idea of camp or money is around in recent years. I'm happy to save that for whatever Jamey Giddens/Ron Carlivati parody project is in the works next.

interesting observation that as budgets decreased, camp and glam increased. and, yes, what does glam even mean these days? 

didn’t watch much of aw’s later years, so i can’t say much there. but as for doug marland’s ‘world turns,’ he inherited both lucinda walsh and james stenbeck, but brought on the snyders (based on his own family). and while no one in oakdale was likely to wind up on food stamps (even when the snyders were in trouble, someone always bailed them out), the hughes and stewarts all worked for a living. 

26 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

interesting observation that as budgets decreased, camp and glam increased. and, yes, what does glam even mean these days? 

didn’t watch much of aw’s later years, so i can’t say much there. but as for doug marland’s ‘world turns,’ he inherited both lucinda walsh and james stenbeck, but brought on the snyders (based on his own family). and while no one in oakdale was likely to wind up on food stamps (even when the snyders were in trouble, someone always bailed them out), the hughes and stewarts all worked for a living. 

AW's later years weren't that ritzy. Vicky Hudson may have been the most frugal millionaire ever seen on TV. The Love Mansion was long gone. Victoria Wyndham, meanwhile, complained in one interview about the absurdity of the Corys now answering their own door, and it's true, if you compare the Cory setup in the '70s or even the '80s to what they were by the end.

Marland had a way of presenting struggles but not being down in the dirt. The Snyders always needed money, but Lily had two rich grandfathers to help save the day. And so many of them ended up working for a huge international company. Tom and Margo were middle-class, living on takeouts and working all the time, but they had a beautiful house (I loved their '90s house set). 

Edited January 7Jan 7 by DRW50

cannot make this up…

the guests on the first episode of ‘finding your roots’ are lea salonga and amanda seyfried.

not only were both on ‘world turns, but lea was there in 2001 and 2003, amanda 1999-2001. so the two of them may have been n oakdale at the same time. 

1 hour ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

cannot make this up…

the guests on the first episode of ‘finding your roots’ are lea salonga and amanda seyfried.

not only were both on ‘world turns, but lea was there in 2001 and 2003, amanda 1999-2001. so the two of them may have been n oakdale at the same time. 

Thanks for the heads up!  I didn't know the new season had begun. Just set my DVR for the second showing.

Amanda is only in a handful of episodes around the end of 2000. Peyton List assumed the role in December 2001. She appears just as Carly's leaving Oakdale for France to wind up in the Spa. Her arrival stopped Craig from pressing Carly to accompany her on the trip.

Hunt Block didn't start until mid-2000, ergo Lucy wasn't in town.

Edited January 8Jan 8 by P.J.

On 1/6/2025 at 8:06 PM, DRW50 said:

Marland had a way of presenting struggles but not being down in the dirt. The Snyders always needed money, but Lily had two rich grandfathers to help save the day. And so many of them ended up working for a huge international company. Tom and Margo were middle-class, living on takeouts and working all the time, but they had a beautiful house (I loved their '90s house set). 

His vision of farm life was a bit outdated and romanticized. I come from a farm family and many of those are not living in modest homes like the Snyders. By the same token, the Snyders are never actually in the fields, talking about crops, worrying about weather, rain, etc. The Snyders were the Spauldings of farm families..what the hell did they actually do/produce?  I remember one scene when a character (a european character obviously a Walsh client, most likely trying to seduce Holden) talking to Emma about all these small little houses with small fields close to each other, and Emma says, "Oh, yes, a lot of our friends had to sell pieces of their land and someone else bought it to start a farm of their own, it happens a lot"  Uh, no it doesnt Emma, corporations were buying farms, (which would have been a good plot...)

i

Actress Holly Cate who played the scheming Janice Maxwell has uploaded the best "Janice Moments" on her YouTube channel 

 

I, too, grew up on a farm. I wish we'd had a house as nice as the Snyders. It was a mobile home in the middle of a giant field with an aluminum roof and no shade!

@TheyStartedOnSoaps Great find. A shame it is unlisted. I just loved watching her as Janice. A real shot in the arm for a moribund period.

6 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

His vision of farm life was a bit outdated and romanticized. I come from a farm family and many of those are not living in modest homes like the Snyders. By the same token, the Snyders are never actually in the fields, talking about crops, worrying about weather, rain, etc. The Snyders were the Spauldings of farm families..what the hell did they actually do/produce?  I remember one scene when a character (a european character obviously a Walsh client, most likely trying to seduce Holden) talking to Emma about all these small little houses with small fields close to each other, and Emma says, "Oh, yes, a lot of our friends had to sell pieces of their land and someone else bought it to start a farm of their own, it happens a lot"  Uh, no it doesnt Emma, corporations were buying farms, (which would have been a good plot...)

We'd hear about all the work they did in the fields and once the kids grew up, they're hire hands like Rosanna, but I don't think we ever saw any of the farm on location, aside from some of Holden and Lily walking around outside in 1986.

I can't remember how much Marland said about his childhood - I suppose Emma's farm was what he always wanted his family farm to be.

Much as it was something of a comfort to see the Snyder kitchen up to ATWT's end, I wish they'd stuck to their guns about burning down the farm in 1994. A part of me wonders if they ended up not having the budget and just blamed the soap magazine leak. Given OJ-mania at the time it's not as if millions were poring over SPW or SOD anyway.

Edited January 9Jan 9 by DRW50

58 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Much as it was something of a comfort to see the Snyder kitchen up to ATWT's end, I wish they'd stuck to their guns about burning down the farm in 1994. A part of me wonders if they ended up not having the budget and just blamed the soap magazine leak. Given OJ-mania at the time it's not as if millions were poring over SPW or SOD anyway.

even through the height of oj, there were fans (myself included) who poured over weekly and digest. when i interviewed laurie caso in 1996, he told me that the plan was to bring all of the snyder kids back to the farm.

i’ve talked with him a number of times over the years and always found him to be a straight shooter. were there budget issues? maybe. but according to caso, it was lisa brown who leaked to weekly and the fact that an actor knew about the fire and hit the panic button suggests (at least to me) that the show was serious. 

1 hour ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

even through the height of oj, there were fans (myself included) who poured over weekly and digest. when i interviewed laurie caso in 1996, he told me that the plan was to bring all of the snyder kids back to the farm.

i’ve talked with him a number of times over the years and always found him to be a straight shooter. were there budget issues? maybe. but according to caso, it was lisa brown who leaked to weekly and the fact that an actor knew about the fire and hit the panic button suggests (at least to me) that the show was serious. 

That's around when I started reading soap magazines, so I know there was an audience, but it was just hard for me to believe that was enough to kill a huge stunt which would have affected months of storyline. But if he does blame an actor leak, I guess it is true. 

13 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Much as it was something of a comfort to see the Snyder kitchen up to ATWT's end, I wish they'd stuck to their guns about burning down the farm in 1994.

I would have rather seen Kim and Bob's kitchen (as Gautman seemed to think the show only needed on kitchen set...) the show started at the Hughes and should have ended at the Hughes home.  But yes, they should have burned down that farm, there were always weird logistics going into getting the characters out to "Luther's Corner" where even Lisa would drop by in her fur it was getting nutty. The show actually needed an urban family to offset all the wasps the show centered on...(and believe me, I love that Kim and Nancy cooked in an apron and pearls..)

5 minutes ago, Mitch64 said:

I would have rather seen Kim and Bob's kitchen (as Gautman seemed to think the show only needed on kitchen set...) the show started at the Hughes and should have ended at the Hughes home.  But yes, they should have burned down that farm, there were always weird logistics going into getting the characters out to "Luther's Corner" where even Lisa would drop by in her fur it was getting nutty. The show actually needed an urban family to offset all the wasps the show centered on...(and believe me, I love that Kim and Nancy cooked in an apron and pearls..)

I wish they'd done more to introduce Jessica's family all at once and on a more regular basis. They would show up here and there, but there was a chance to make them more of a frequent fixture in the early '90s.

I would have chosen the Hughes kitchen over the Snyder farm too, although I never quite had the emotional connection to it that I did to, for some reason, the house Tom and Margo had in the late '80s and a lot of the '90s. I guess because I started ATWT in the late '80s.

I can't remember when that place was redesigned but I missed seeing the old living room. Did we just see a kitchen later on or did they have a living room but just a cheaper version?

Edited January 9Jan 9 by DRW50

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

can't remember when that place was redesigned but I missed seeing the old living room. Did we just see a kitchen later on or did they have a living room but just a cheaper version?

I loved their old living room (which was the house Kim and Nick lived in redecorated, which was kinda weird) where everyone would just "walk in" and start talking about their problems or doing exposition on the plot (mostly everyone's favorite buttinsky Lisa who had a hand in everyone's plot) ..it was unrealistic but I loved it and I always thought that a soap should have one center, main house where everyone felt comfortable and at home at..I am sure the Gautman's and JFP's of the world would disagree.

Anyway, Bob and Kim seemed to loose their whole house, during the producer before Gautman their living room got redesigned and shrunk and would not have contained the marching band of characters that Marland had coming in and out, and then their kitchen became a set of WOAK, and Bob and Kim had to hang out at Lisa's hotel all day, Kim wearing the same damn pink pantsuit...SAD!!!!