Another World Discussion Thread

[Xanthe]

The article was accompanied by photographs of both Anne Heche and Brad Pitt. 

[Contessa Donatella]

As we watched this play out, I recall feeling like there had been an abrupt shift in story complete with another very different persona for RKK to play, Shane Roberts & his ex-wife Lila, who was mortified of storms, etc. From that point on it was basically a show (13 Bourbon St. bible) in a show (AW). According to Wikipedia this had Josh Griffith as its co-creator & Linda Gottlieb as its producer. I've always been fascinated by that threesome & have wondered if they would ever again create "lightning in a bottle" as they did together on (MM's) first tenure at OLTL. Bobby Reno & Shane seemed like two completely different people. Lila was a believable fragile southern belle who would have the vapors at the first sign of a storm. There was dialogue about East Texas & Louisiana. The language of the Bourbon St. stories was richer than the AW stuff. I found it of interest that this was not to be a daytime show, set to be broadcast at night. And, I thought it really might have been a successful foray.

It was a challenge as a fan to be so accepting of the 13 Bourbon St. partition while being so disenchanted with what MM was writing for the Bay City denizens. As was perhaps something he was known for, he didn't give one iota of concern for character history. One example, he created a new & different Jake more like a Cary Grant or Rhett Butler icon even with no hint of the lifelong chip on the shoulder from his background from the wrong side of town.

[Contessa Donatella]

NBC balked when P&G wanted to hire the Dobsons who were just then free from SB. Bridget & Jerome suggested that this might be because NBC wanted AW to fail since it wanted to get out of the sponsor-owned soap biz, eventually planning to replace AW with GEN. (Her Stories, Levine 212)

NBC had renewed AW even though the ratings were shaky but they had canceled SB, which is where the Dobsons were coming from, approximately Jan. 1993. Peggy Sloane & Sam Ratcliffe were HWs at AW then. The Dobsons had twice before rescued P&G soaps, for GL & then for ATWT.

I wonder can we imagine what it might have been like to have the Dobsons taking us on the ride at that time?

[Contessa Donatella]

Last month one day, I thought of something good about JFP. I was so tickled I wrote down on a list, "One more good thing about Jill!" Of course, I have hundreds of bad things to say about her. Having a new one, that meant I had 3 good. 1 is that there's a name she could name that she does not name. 2 is how she dealt with Zaslow. And, today I thought of a 3 & I was so excited until I forgot what the d*mn thought was! I'm furious. What good is a brain when it pulls this sh*t?! Usually when I can't think of a word or a name my brain lets me cool my heels for a day or two & then gives me the information. Not this time!

#1 There is the name of someone who was involved in the murder of AW's Frankie Frame & Jill could name that name & perhaps ameliorate the blame that is heaped on her but Jill won't do that, she won't name that name. Probably it's the Writer & we know who that is.

#2 Jill was the EP at OLTL & they took Zaslow in & gave him an ALS storyline for the character he played there in the past, David Rinaldi, and he used a computer to speak & an enabled wheelchair & the whole tech shebang & they let him do what he does - act, for a short while before his death. Obviously many people at ABC/OLTL were involved but only Jill could have spearheaded the effort, been the point man.

[j swift]

Damn, these are increasing in value faster than crypto, I wish I had invested sooner

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[AbcNbc247]

Haha... makes me wonder if I should sell my copies

[TVFAN1144]

Very good interview  with Harding Lemay and very talented man.

Did he inherit the Alice/ Steve / Rachel storyline?   He said ratings were down which is why he was hired but this storyline was very popular.  Maybe all writers claim they saved their vehicles from destruction.

He also said the push for hour shows ended up with creating more characters with 2 minute scenes to fill time   He was one writer who was skilled enough to write longer quality scenes for the hour format 

 

 

[Khan]

Other shows and writers felt they had to double the amount of characters and scenes in order to fill each episode, which, IMO, created the bloated budgets that, in concert with the outrageous storylines of the '80's and '90's, led this genre to the pitiful place where it resides today.

[Contessa Donatella]

Agnes was the HW who crafted that triangle & they were there when he got there & after he'd been there a while, was when GR & JC were fired, so, yes, they were in the pkg. he inherited. As far as whether he rescued the show or not, 1) everyone says it & no one disputes it, but 2) we go to the numbers.

Harding "Pete" Lemay at ANOTHER WORLD 1971-79

1971-72 AW ranked 6th of 17

1972-73 AW ranked 3rd of 17

1973-74 AW ranked 2nd of 16

1974-75 AW ranked 2nd of 14

1975-76 AW ranked 2nd of 14

1976-77 AW ranked 2nd of 15

1977-78 AW ranked 2nd of 14

1978-79 AW ranked 8th of 14

1979-80 AW ranked 8th of 13

AW went to 60 min. Jan. 6, 1975

I don't have the dates to hand right now but there were some weeks when AW wasn't just backing ATWT up (2nd, to 1st) but AW tied with ATWT for 1st place those couple of times. By & large they were #2 while ATWT was #1 & P&G was pleased as punch. NBC was happy, too, because high up in the rankings was something they were chasing.

 

 

At the outset, that was something he hoped to do, be able to write longer scenes.

 

Good point, good analysis, just because it seems to make sense to double everything doesn't mean that would really be called for.

Edited April 24, 2022 by Tonksadora
Mention some #1 weeks.

[TVFAN1144]

Thank you for that information.  The ratings certainly did increase during most of Harding Lemay’s  time

[Contessa Donatella]

Pete Lemay's book about being HW at AW

 

Oh, you're very welcome! Glad you enjoyed. I think it's a great interview, too. And, of course, it's early on, which is always neat to find. Pete Lemay is one of my heroes! If you haven't read his book, it's great! Eight Years In Another World

Edited April 25, 2022 by Tonksadora
Link & Ill. Remove image.

[vetsoapfan]

Actually, it's a myth that Harding Lemay saved AW from either cancellation or even low ratings. The numbers drawn by his predecessor, Robert Cenedella, were basically on a par with Lemay's. (Cenedella-era ratings: 9.5, 9.6. Lemay's initial ratings: 9.1--they went down slightly at first--9.7.)

Lemay's ratings hovered at 9.7 for the next few years. After the departure of key actors from the soap in the mid-1970s, however, Lemay's ratings began to slip (down to 8.9 in 1975), and then took a noticeable drop when General Hospital had its resurgence in 1978 (AW fell to 7.5) and finally gave AW some solid competition.

The real savior of AW was Agnes Nixon, whose writing saw the show rise to its highest ratings ever (10.5 in 1968); higher than Lemay's in his heyday.

In fact, when Lemay finally left as official headwriter in 1979, the show had slid to lower ratings than it had enjoyed way back in 1966.

Edited April 25, 2022 by vetsoapfan

[Contessa Donatella]

It's certainly true that Agnes saved the show from what was close to being early cancelation! I thought everyone acknowledged that. That really has nothing to do with what happened later on with Pete which was a very nice golden period. He doesn't take away from her. No one can take away from her. Without her intervention at that time there wouldn't have been a show by the time Pete Lemay caught the attention of Honchos at P&G. James Lipton had done the show no favors, and, of course, he never really was much of a writer. Anyway, the Matthews family, nothing like having your core family nearly decimated or having a brand spanking new family 'rode into town ...

The one thing I had hoped to read in Nixon's excellent autobiography was her discussing the parallels between Erica & Mona with Rachel & Ada, but she didn't mention it. The show got the benefit of her using the AMC bible, though, which is what counts.

[vetsoapfan]

Lemay's early years were indeed golden. Although he did not seem to understand certain important characters, and changed them in ways that baffled me, there's no question that his work was initially excellent. I personally felt the cracks started to show in 1975, about four years after he took over as head writer, but even at his "weakest" (so to speak), Lemay's work was better than many other scribes who have worked in daytime soaps.

Yes, those who actually have a grasp on soap history acknowledge Nixon's invaluable contribution to the series. And the genre as a whole. Unfortunately, not everyone studies or cares about the legends of the past. Over the years (or decades, LOL) fans have said to me that Maurice Bernard has "saved General Hospital," or "Kim Zimmer saved The Guiding Light," "James Reilly saved DAYS," "Paul Rauch and Harding Lemay saved AW," etc. When people say these things, I usually try to bite my tongue, but my honest thought is always: Bernard, Zimmer, Reilly, Rauch, Lemay, etc., did not "save" shows that were in good (or sometimes even BETTER) shape before they even arrived.

Was it ABC executive Brian Frons who pushed Agnes Nixon out of her involvement with All My Children because she supposedly "no longer understood" the soap opera medium? UGH.

Edited April 25, 2022 by vetsoapfan

[Contessa Donatella]

I bit a hole in my tongue! I kid you not. I plan to move on & try grinding my teeth. Most recently I've run into this misplaced hero worship and over-aggrandizement - if you'll pardon me that horrible made-up word - of certain individuals who now think that Tony Geary, the person, and Luke Spencer, the character, have somehow saved all of daytime. Now I understand why this is happening: the GH writers killed off Luke. Fans thought it would be revealed that he was still alive & being kept prisoner on some island fortress & that has NOT happened. Luke is still dead, folks. I don't know why they can't be content with his true "ists" or bests, etc. He's the most famous anti-hero, the best ratings for a wedding, a lovers on the run storyline that will forever keep its place in history, a perm like no other, a legendary paycheck with 10 weeks off every summer, etc. I give him his due. But he is not the most important person in all of soapdom.

Fortunately Agnes Nixon was well rewarded by her industry! Not all of her industry because there's the Brian Frons's & Anne Sweeney's & Megan McTavish'es of this world who had no better sense than to be opposing Ms. Nixon. ABC did her very wrong by pushing her away & then when the show got into trouble, bringing her back in & rinse & repeat.