GL: May Discussion

[DAMfan]

Can being in that lake make Edmund's scar go away??

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[MarkH]

Are you implying that they screwed up, or that the body is not Edmund's?

ETA: Wouldn't it be too much for Edmund to have a twin, like his brother????

[DAMfan]

jeff changed his face and was Prince Richard's stand in and Prince Edmund could have had a double too, but Edmund had a scar and it's a soap - where anything can happen - Roger kept coming back from the dead and Phillip came back from the dead.

GL HOTLINE: 866 - 695 - 1859

email: [email protected]

[jfung79]

I don't think this would be more interesting. How is that "lead-up", sounds more like the event itself? What you describe could have been a good story, but I don't see it as more so than what is there now.

I feel you keep contradicting yourself. My position is clear. I think the show is subtly but not too subtly "show" ing that Marina is probably the killer and why. I think there is *one* clear killer and but it is not *too* clear. You say that is obvious and not subtle at all, and yet you also say that the show is "cheating" with the mystery! Do you see how this is a contradiction? How can it both be super obvious who the killer is *and* the show going for a shock out of left field with no buildup?

As for EJ, I don't understand why some people think his acting is bad. He emotes well with his eyes and gives Rafe a sensitivity that would be lacking in other less good actors' portrayals. Objective Emmy judges looking at the actin rather than at the non-story for the character, saw it too. I agree with CarlD2 that the story for the character has not been well developed, and the solution to that is more airtime with a clear story, not less airtime -- not one-day snippets where he has two lines. A recast would likely have been horrific and played Rafe as a "troubled juvenile delinquent" stereotype. I am very happy he has been on three days in the past week, and I loved the mix of emotions in his scene with Olivia on Monday June 1 (grateful yet with more than a dash of spoiled Spaulding ... a young man wanting to build a future for himself and not wanting to disappoint his mother, yet lying to her ... a polite boy saying "please" even as he is angrily telling Olivia not to interfere in his life ... the juxtapositions were fascinating!). I also loved his scenes last Thursday with cousin-slash-kinda-little-sister Emma and the aftermath.

As for the theory about Grant writing his return, good grief, there's no evidence of that at all. He has been clear in every interview that he didn't discuss the story much. Writers get all of the blame and none of the credit. His return was actualy blah blah to me, you can go back and see that I barely posted during that time -- it's the writing before and since that was interesting with Beth/Coop and then now his dealing with James and Alan. The focus during the first couple weeks of his return was all around Buzz and his grief -- don't see how Grant wrote that. Phillip had some scenes with Beth and Alan (not even Rick that much) where they talked about stuff but mostly he was in jail. Oh, and killing Grady was a highly questionable writing choice making Phillip a murderer. That episode only worked for me because of the nighttime shooting.

So yeah, my *least* favorite period of the 2009 calendar year has been the weeks immediately after Phillip's return. I don't know what people mean at all when they think there has been a drop in writing quality since. It's actually gotten way better and less depressing.

[Mitch]

The lead up has to make us "excited," to watch the mystery and see how the emotional turmoil that is the real reason behind a soap opera mystery, not really the "who dunnit," but "why could all of these people suddenly be capable of murder, how could they be pushed to this." The reveal of the killer is less interesting and important then the how and why, which Wheeler and Co. have not shown us. How does that contradict with what I previously said?

If you felt that the weeks following Phillip's return were blah but the last few weeks of nothing happening were much better....to each his own but how can you find "nothing," happening to be interesting? Phillip's return was the return of some history and emotions which werent forced of faked. Phillip's reactions to Beth and Alan were spot on and I as a viewer cared about them, much more so then whatever Rafe is doing or feeling. The one scene he had with Alex was great. I do agree that Rick and Phillip didnt have the scenes they needed, but I heard they were shot but end up being cut out somehow (typical lame brain Wheeler move...lets take something interesting out and uh,we can have more time to focus on Marina and Mallet.) I agree that the rest of the fallout made no sense, the trial should have been an EVENT and typical Wheeler/GL it was boring and made no sense. The high school reunion happened six months too soon, everyone should have been on egg shells around Phillip not talking about "Pizza Face," I do agree I am glad we are over Buzz's grief but only because I was sick of having to watch Deas overact his way through the scenes (I am in the great minority but I think Deas can be a terrible actor relying on gimmicks and chewing the scenery.) I was also glad we saw that Buzz finally too a friggen shower! For some reason GL thinks that Buzz and the Coopers are must see TV but they are must flee TV to me.

Sorry, Bonilla is just eh as an actor and his character is useless unless as a roadblock to Otalia. Anyone who beleives that the Emmy voters are objective and blue ribbon in anyway havent been following the stories on how fucked up the voting process is for the daytime emmys, they really have been discredited to the point that they are laughable. I never beleived Gus as a Spaulding and I am even less interested in Rafe being part of the family. I agree about the depressing part, GL, since the move has never been more depressing. The sets look dim and drab and the location shots Wheeler chooses are almost as much so.

[NorrthCafe]

Mitch, AYA-MEN, brother! I think that's the only purpose Rafe serves right now and it's ridiculous given how little time is left. I was VERY critical of this storyline when it started because I didn't trust the writers. I should have followed my first mind and trusted that they'd screw it up like they have everything else.

JEVA, OTALIA, Remy and Christina, and Frank/Blake? Should have been together YESTERDAY, and drama should have come from outside the couples - each battling some external threat.

Rafe and James should be battling for favored grandson.

Cyrus is wasted airspace and there's NO REASON for us to have to see him when the writers haven't gotten their couples in place for the countdown to the end of the show.

I see pics like the one above and think about how much I'm going to miss the show. I watch the show and realize why it's been canceled.

[jfung79]

I agree with you about Phillip and Alex's scene, but it was just one scene.

When you say Phillip's return was about history, I think that is more of an emotional resonance kind of reaction rather than anything about the writing being better then or GA supposedly doing the writing. History does inform the writing in a background way still, but not any more or less than in February.

There hasn't been "nothing happening." First I want to disagree with why that is important -- GL is successfully being a character-based show, not plot-driven, and complaining about "nothing happening" seems like a very plot-based complaint. Watching characters interact in consistent ways that are true to character, as they do on GL, is already good soap. But there has also been a lot "happening" -- Henry has fallen ill and been saved, Edmund has died mysteriously, Reva has been arrested, Rafe has been released back into the real world, Lizzie and Bill are planning their wedding and have been to jail, Ashlee has been hired and fired, James's Ponzi scheme has been revealed, Daisy has found out about James's scheme, Phillip and Alan have found out about the scheme and are fighting it out over how to handle it, Edmund was memorialized with Edmund's touching video, Christina has found out Remy was laid off, Clayton has lost all his money, Remy has become a policeman again, and Shayne has told Marina the truth about Henry (that happened "on screen", since you keep saying things happen off screen). Also, there *has* been exploration of "why" characters would be driven to murder, particularly seeing Marina's reaction when Henry fell ill and when the social worker wanted to take her, but also Reva's, Josh's, and Jeffrey's when Colin was taken the first time and Dinah's and Josh's reaction when Edmund was first told by Shayne that he had been responsible for Lara's accident.

First of all, Rafe is not some simplistic "roadblock," his presence is a key part of the story of a new family coming together and is not one-dimensional. The Otalia story can't be told well without the kids. He has been a reason for Otalia coming together as much as he's been a "roadblock" (like all the times he's told his mother he just wants her to be happy).

Second, unlike you, I agree with NorrthCafe that Rafe should be fighting it out with James as favored grandson. That would be a "useful" way to use the character as well.

Sure, but I don't see how EJ Bonilla could have benefited from the ABC bias this year. If there was lack of objectivity, that would have worked against him.

Finally, the statement about how things are at the wrong pace and focusing on the wrong people given how little time is left --the complaint isn't reasonable, because the stories on air now were probably planned before the cancellation. I think the next few months are going to seem way accelerated, starting in about a week or two. If you still feel the focus is wrong a month from now given how little time is left, that's when the complaint becomes reasonable.

[jfung79]

OMG, little did I know that on the very day I posted agreeing about Rafe and James needing to compete for favored grandson (and, I was also thinking but not writing, for Daisy), they would do that!

Thank you GL!!! I will post more in the June thread.

[RoseVioletDaisy]

I don't for one second think Marina is the killer. As bad as these writers are at messing with and destroying characters, turning Marina into a murderer would be so insanely out-of-character that I have a hard time believing that even they would do that. That ridiculous scene of her blackmailing the social worker was bad enough but cold-blooded murder is a whole other animal and would make no sense given what little we know about the crime. The other reason Marina is almost certainly not the killer is because the viewers have practically been beaten over the head with hints that she's the killer from the moment "Edmund's" body was found, if it was even his. This signals that she's a red-herring. Anyone who looks too obvious, especially at first, is almost never the killer.

I personally don't think that the writers have any clue who killed Edmund or his double and will probably throw a dart at a bulletin board with the casts' picture's on it about five minutes before the denouement is taped and whoever gets hit will be the killer. Or it'll be someone totally inconsequential like Natasha, the diamond-hunter who's blackmailing Cyrus, or somebody James is swindling.

If the writers want to end this story in a way that makes sense in terms of both plot and character the only real options for the killer are Jeffrey or Mallet. Both have a history of violent criminal behavior, both have a motive to get Edmund out of their lives, and both have long since out-lived their usefulness as characters. And both can use their positions in law enforcement to try to frame others.

The only thing Rafe and James should be fighting over is the privilege of being thrown off a cliff by Phillip! They both suck but at least Rafe has legitimate anger issues, James is just a disgustingly coddled little brat.

[Mitch]

The producers knew the show was on the bubble, and CBS CLEARLY spelled out that they needed to reach a certain ratings point, which they did not, so only a fool would think they werent going to get chopped. Since CBS gave them an ultimatum to reach a number, and they gave them enough time (word had spread by the internet last summer, so TPTB had to have heard that months ahead of time..) so wouldnt it have made sense to pull out the big guns and have a consistent show full of quality material? This is the material which was supposed to SAVE the show from cancellation, THIS is their A game?

Nothing IS happening!!!! Nothing of consequence. The viewers have no investment in Baby Henry, so his illness had little or no impact..sure it would work as a B story but it is not an A story! Edmund is dead but, again, I am sorry there was absolutely no buidling of suspense to it. He is just dead...James Ponzi scheme is character based??? First of all, no one cares about Daisy, and we havent had enough time to care about James. Unlike RVD, I think the actor has promise, but he hasnt been integrated into the adults enough...he had one small scene talking to Phillip which was good, but the writers cut it short to have him go chase Sweaty Daisy. What does James feel about Alan, and his marriage to his mother? An interesting subplot which would have tied all this together would have had James identify more with Rick, who acted as his father figure during Phillip's absence and the Beth/Rick marriage.. Phillip would be happy,but kinda jealous, building on the uneasy relationship Rick and Phillip should have now. The Ponzi scheme makes no sense and wasnt how the real Ponzi scheme worked. I can overlook some things but when a soap asks me to overlook EVERYTHING the show begins to have no relation to reality...(example Mallet being a cop now, Remy's constant career changes, and now the useless Rafe, a convicted felon, becoming a cop!) Much less it involves Remy and his dad as main participants, who gives a flying crap??? Reva is arrested for a crime we know she didnt commit and a crime that had no lead up or supsense? Again, who cares??? Bill and Lizzie are playing cute and not dealing with the issues which they realistically would be dealing with, they run a multinational corporation which involves two companies merged together, companies which are owned and ran by two families who have a real, long running competition feud going. I would love to see Alan, Alex, Billy and Van dukeing it out in the boardroom. Instead of Alan being the cartoon villian he has been for over four years, maybe he could be interested in a revitalized Van, who has come back to work at Spaulding to save a company that would have to be in ruins by now (oh, I forgot, Alex said," The stocks have never been higher with Bill and Lizzie in charge," which goes to show how far the writers are from trying to present any kind of reality. Really, the stocks are surging with not only those two lunkheads in charge, but with stocks down across the board. Gee, those two cuties really must have the magic touch!)

Random things happening that arent connected or make sense (Remy be coming a cop again)doesnt mean that anything of consequence is happening, just random scenes thrown at the wall.

A big agree that of course Minnie Mouse didnt kill Eddie....I still think the big "suprise" will be that Grady is still alive and he somehow killed Eddie. As the light slowing turns into oblivion!