Emmerdale: Discussion Thread

[DRW50]

So…the only thing I could really think about with the episode was Robert’s story about Jack catching him with a boy and beating him. 

Some of that matches up to my headcanons (that Robert was crushing on a boy and terrified of his father’s reaction). Some does not (the beating).

I wasn’t surprised at the outrage and thumb-sucking at Digital Spy, especially because I have a feeling some of those people may not have actually seen most of Jack’s actual material on the show (I even saw someone claiming that it’s a retcon to say Jack preferred Andy to Robert…). It’s also fun and fast to remind everyone again about how Emmerdale is laid to waste for Robron and their army of “teenage girl” fans (God knows it’s always fun to hate teenage girls, isn’t it…it’s not like they don’t have enough problems in our society). 

The truth isn’t quite that simple. 

I could have done without the story. It is a retcon, obviously, as Robert was canonically straight until 2014. While Jack was never shown as a huge booster of gay rights, he wasn’t homophobic (although you can support gay people and flip out when your own child is queer). The imagery of Jack beating his son for being in bed with another boy is searing, and I’m sorry that this is how many fans who will never watch old Emmerdale material will remember him. 

Yet, I also have no real time for the claims that Jack was a “lovely” father who would never hit or hurt Robert or any of his children. Or that Jack was a man of the world so would never react. The Jack of the mid-90′s to 2008 (when Clive Hornby sadly left and soon passed away) was a very different man to the worldly, haughty writer or even the relatively jovial man who returned in 1980. He was often hard-headed, bitter, and deeply selfish as a father and husband. He did beat and punch Robert - I’m pretty sure when he was 14 and upset over Andy being adopted, and again when he found out Robert had threatened Victoria into mutism. He got into a nasty fight with Sarah the day before she died that involved him hurting her arm so badly she had to seek medical attention. He frightened Victoria by smashing up her doll in a rage. He terrified Diane more than once, complete with bringing a huge, heavy cabinet full of dishes down when she wasn’t that far away from it. He was not an “abuser” in the easy, quick sense of the word, but he lashed out with his fists. He got violent and then thought later. Do I believe Jack would have abused Robert for years or gone on a homophobic rampage? No. Do I believe Jack would have beat Robert up in a hot temper and then tried to block the whole thing out? Sadly…I probably can. 

Emmerdale has [!@#$%^&*] on the Sugdens time and time again over the years, and often seems ashamed of its own history. Jack was a big part of Emmerdale’s history, and the best of it. I can imagine many would see Robron as a passing fad and be incensed at Jack’s name being besmirched. 

All I will say is to listen to what Robert actually said and go back and look at the man Jack actually was, and then tell me whether you think it’s that much of a “character assassination.” 

[NothinButAttitude]

So people are livid over this itty bitty retcon, which could be true and something Jack would do?

[DRW50]

Some are, yes. It would never happen and Robert was always straight and it makes him a child abuser, and so on. I think if I hadn't actually watched the episodes, I would be more upset. As I actually have (the ones I could find, anyway), it doesn't surprise me that much, because Jack had a lot of anger issues. 

 

What did you think of the episode? I thought it was patchy and they didn't quite seem to know how to edit properly, but I'm glad they had Robert as bi and that they seemed like an actual couple. The guy who plays Lachlan was also very good, as always. I have no idea where this character is going though. 

 

The only complaint I have with Robert as bi is that he is a cheater, and he will likely cheat again at some point, which will be seen as a stereotype, when really, he's always just been a cheater. I'm not sure how I feel about that part of it. But I'm glad they acknowledged his feelings for women as well.

[NothinButAttitude]

I enjoyed the episode, but I (too) am glad that they finally addressed Robert's ambiguous sexuality. And you already know that once Robert cheats it is gonna be with a woman and it'll be b/c Robert is fulfilled with Aaron or some crap. 

[I Am A Swede]

Re: Robert's story. It was obviously a re-write. Not the worst one I've ever come across, on the contrary it's quite a plausible one, but still a re-write. Even though I'm not sure how Jack would have reacted to Robert being gay/bisexual I don't think it's something he would have beaten him for. I do agree that Jack wasn't perfect, or that he could act before thinking, but I just don't see him capable of doing something like that.

I know it's nit-picking, but I also found it a bit strange that Robert said he was caught by Jack together with a guy who was working at the farm. When Robert was 15 Jack had no money to pay anyone to work at the farm. Their finances were horrible, that's why Andy started the fire in the barn that killed Sarah. He wanted to help Jack get some money by burning down the barn for insurance. Robert turned 15 less than six months after Sarah's death, and spent a few months that year in Spain with Annie, after finding out that Andy was responsible for Sarah's death. When he came back Andy had started dating Katie, and that whole triangle started. So the timing really doesn't fit. But I guess that happens when you re-write stuff 15 years later.....

[Bright Eyes]

Having Finn be in yesterday's episode and the fact that he hasn't had anything to do in ages makes me fear he could be a casualty at the end of the week. I think I can say with certainty that Paddy, Robert, Aaron, Ashley, and Laurel all survive.

[DRW50]

[NothinButAttitude]

Wow. This episode with James and Emma was intense. However, I cannot pity James b/c he had numerous times to finish Emma's ass off. He could've shanked her ass with the jagged bottle remains after he hit her with it. He's just too stupid for my liking. 

 

I thought the outdoor scenes and it being foggy were gorgeous and ominous. I do not see things boding well for James. 

[DRW50]

I thought this one would be the strongest of the self-contained episodes, and generally I think it was. Gillian Kearney was great, and Bill Ward gave by far his best performance as James, especially in that dinner scene, which was chillingly good. Little things like the I DO NOT note he wrote in a fit of anger became a major part of the episode in interesting ways.  I also liked that it wasn't as much of the camp crazy lady as I thought it would be. And that scene when he was trying to escape where he tried to chide her for not being happy that he had settled for her - it really showed just why she snapped and just how cavalier he was toward her, because he's so blinded by Moira. I'm glad they didn't try to whitewash him.

[NothinButAttitude]

I'm glad they didn't whitewash him too along with making this story be a typical deranged woman story. Emma's descent into madness has been good. 

[NothinButAttitude]

Wow. Emmerdale once again set the bar REAL high. 

 

The shocker for me has to be that James survived all of that.

 

They better not have killed my Ashley off now too!  Those scenes with him and Arthur discussing if Ashley will forget him (again) broke my heart. It only got worse (re: my heart breaking) with the scenes of Ashley forgetting he was at Dotty's christening were heartbreaking. Who knew that Arthur simply writing that reminder of Ashley's arm would serve as a catalyst of epic proportions. 

 

I knew Emma was gonna push James off that cross bridge. I just knew it. However, James was an idiot to tell Emma on that damn bridge that he was over her. How stupid. He should've waited until they were on solid ground to say that crap. 

 

At first, I thought Ashley was gonna be victim, which he might still be, but now I am thinking that Paddy might be the one to fall on the sword. I'm at a crossroad with that decision if it comes to fruition. Yes, Paddy gets on my last damn nerve and sometimes I wish his ass away, but IDK if I want him to actually die. 

 

I know Aaron's dramatic ass ain't dead. He has 9 lives. 

[Bright Eyes]

 

It's okay, I'll wish him dead for the both of us. Unfortunately, I don't think I could be that lucky.

[NothinButAttitude]

[DRW50]

Ashley’s material in these episodes, especially the first one, blew me away. (kudos once again to Owen Lloyd Fox) It’s what the format of focusing on one story per episode was best used for. The slow drip of just how much Ashley was struggling to even get through the day, had no idea where he was or what he was supposed to be doing, was brilliantly done. The scenes of Arthur confused and upset over Ashley - slowly realizing for the first time just what is going to keep happening - were heartbreaking. The scene in the church where Ashley wept as he realized he no longer recognized his own child was pure agony. 

I really wish this had been one of the episodes that was solo, because it was just incredible. 

Ashley’s involvement in this crash could have been incredibly tacky, exploitive beyond belief. I’m pleased it didn’t turn out that way (at least up to now). It was instead extremely effective, disturbing, and added so much fear and poignancy. The scene at the end where he sat down in the woods like a child just hurt me, it really did.

I’m glad that this week being so intertwined gives viewers who mostly watch for one or two stories (and that’s their choice - no shame on them whatsoever) a chance to see what a superb actor John Middleton is and how much the show will be losing when Ashley is gone. 

So, the first episode...

The Ashley material was stronger and I would have preferred a full episode of it. I was worried they would say he caused the crash. I'm glad they made it clear that he didn't - even the best driver wouldn't be likely to react well to a huge pile of wood crashing onto their windshield. John Middleton gave his absolute best, and the effects that indicated his time lapses and confusion were, unlike many occasions on soaps, used perfectly, not feeling showy or pretentious. If any of the increased budget went for that then I'm glad they did it. Budget isn't anything if the acting isn't there and the heart isn't there and that's where the Thomases will be such a loss to Emmerdale. The fear and concern and hurt from Laurel, Sandy, poor little Arthur. I guess the girl who plays Gabby must have had schooling or something, I don't know? Anyway, the scene where Ashley weeps in the church is, for me, up there with the best soap scene this year. I don't know if I'm going to forget it anytime soon. And the last moment where he sees the message Laurel left on his arm. Haunting.

The chopping in of other stories wasn't as good, although it was alright. I don't know how to feel about Emma. Obviously she's going to get worse and worse, but I'm still not getting the "evil crazy lady" vibe I had half-expected. James was playing silly head games with her all the way to the end and you could see how it destroyed them both. I liked that they had her trying to warn people not to keep driving - not that it did any good. Emmerdale hasn't had a moral compass in the last few years and you can see that in how hesitant they are about where to completely take Emma and Pierce. Gillian Kearney just about makes it work all the time - I kept thinking she was going to be too OTT, and maybe she was a little, but I thought it made sense for the character and situation and meant the lunacy of a Misery knockoff leading to a Final Destination knockoff wasn't as ludicrous as it could have been. The last bit in the first episode of her trembling like a leaf was a superbly acted moment. 

I didn't mind the stunt in the first part. I thought it looked OK - amusing at times and frightening at others. I did burst out laughing when Pierce was hit about 3 times and seemed fine (being half-crazed on Emmerdale makes you indestructible) and the "Lachrobron" car went sailing over the cliff, as it reminded me of this:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywQEcv22Mdk

 

Second episode:

 

I know it wasn't intended that way but I loved that the first thing Finn (with a new haircut no less) did was to find and save a really hot guy. Surely that's in the Gay Agenda Guidebook for what to do at an accident scene. 
 

Charlotte Bellamy giving the horror movie scream that "horror week" needs.

Some of that also reminded me of when Daniel died - probably the most harrowing soap episode I've ever watched. 
 

It wasn't mentioned in the episode, but I felt like there was sort of an acknowledgment (in Victoria's fear at the water's edge) of her myriad issues with nearly drowning twice. 

I had mixed feelings about the Aaron and Robert material. I kind of liked that they had Aaron terrified and mewling, rather than the cliche of bravery (Danny Miller was apparently terrified so I guess it wasn't all acting). I also liked that they realized it should be Adam, not Robert, in the ambulance with him, given their long history. Lachlan's involvement felt shoehorned and jarring with the rest of the material. I guess it must have a purpose down the line. Ryan Hawley is hit and miss for me with emotional acting but I liked him a lot more than I thought I would here - the wet shirt didn't hurt either. 

Joe Gill is another who can be a bit all over the place with dramatic work, but he absolutely nailed the last scenes on the phone with Emma. I hope this episode is the start of him becoming a more prominent character, but I can't say I'm going to expect it. We are, presumably, heading for Emma killing James, which is trite, but also a fitting bookend given that she was going to leave him for dead not long after she first came on the show. Gillian Kearney was just great in that last scene. What an actress. 

Paddy/Rhona/Pierce - weak stuff, aside from Dominic Brunt, who was very believable as being in shock and bleeding out. It felt very disconnected from everything else, and while Jonathan Wrather is hot as hell and is good at the controlling and charming part of the role, he was not good with what he had in a lot of the accident. I'm glad they didn't have him actually leave Paddy for dead, as it means the character is not a complete cartoon, and could still go in various directions. 

I'd probably give the first one an A and the second a B or B-. 

Last year we seemed to be getting a lot of setup for aftermath, but beyond Eric's breakdown, most of it never actually arrived. This year, I didn't get the sense there was a lot of aftermath, beyond the point where they find out about Emma, but I think the show has improved re: aftermath so I will wait and see. 

[DRW50]

Lots of behind the scenes videos and interviews here. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2eG-6hBo9VNb5_6K9DAqUg

Edited October 21, 2016 by DRW50