Santa Barbara Discussion Thread

[1974mdp]

I would have LOVED to see what the Dobsons would have done with Another World!

[Carlos Abad]

Just watched episode 4. These is what I think about this ep.

 -They have beautiful locations with Joe, Peter, Kelly and C.C. I love when they shoot in exteriors.

-I guess it’s true that they played that Joe and Kelly song so many times that it loses the meaning, the magic.

-I’ve read that the scene where Peter Mark Richman confronts Dane Witherspoon and his men thrown him into the water is a reshoot. They actually filmed that scene with Lloyd Bochner.

-Mason pretending he has left the house and then coming in and spying Santana in her underwear is so wrong. He’s so creepy in these episodes. I don’t like him at all.

-The scene where Augusta hits the waitress is so good. She’s one of my favorites from these earlier episodes.

-Then we have Augusta and her pussycat Breeze in La mesa. That’s another great scene. And she has chemistry with Joe. I guess Louise Sorel has chemistry with everybody. She’s is giving so much life in these earlier episodes.

-And a mystery that was never resolved. Who thrown the bomb on the Perkins house? They never addressed that subject.

 -This is the first episode of Dominic and while Judith is for me the one and only Sophia I think Rosemary Forsyt is a lot better playing a man than Judith.

[Jdee43]

I don't think Mason becomes likeable or a lead until 1985. I think it takes the character of Mary.

[Carlos Abad]

Episode 5:

-I like the clear lighting of the sets in these earlier episodes. Later in 1988 the sets were darker and brown and I didn’t enjoy that.

 -C.C. wants a military school for poor Ted. He’s so soft and a sensitive teenager. It won’t work.

 -The Capwell Enterprises scene with Peter, Kelly and Joe seems to be a real building and not a set. I think that was filmed at the offices of the studios.

 -Later on Kelly becomes one of my favorites, but here I don’t like her very much, the same that happens with Mason who I like him more later on. Here Kelly is too soft, quiet, sweet and passive. But at least she has great taste in music. She puts on her radio cassette the song Time after time by Cindy Lauper. I think Lauper is one of the best singers from the 80s.

 -The ending scene with Joe and Kelly finally meeting after all these years is a great way to finish this episode.

 -John Perkins is again shouting and hating his son. I cannot stand him. He’s the worst!

 -I also love the song from Vangelis Alpha that is present in Santana scenes.

 -This is the first episode of Veronica. Here she’s a recurring character but later she will be a regular one. But it won’t last because she receives a carnation from her boss.

 -This is also the first episode of Ruben Andrade but he does nothing remarkable during all his episodes.

 -I think everything is working in this beginning, except the teenager’s story. I’m sorry to say this because I really like Todd Mckee and Melissa Reeves, but if they deleted all the Ted, Danny, Jade, Laken scenes the episode would be so much better.

 -Santana has a spicy revenge with Mason and her chili peppers. I like her. I don’t like him at all. Lane Davies is great in the future episodes, but right now Mason is probably one of my least favorite characters after John Perkins.

Maybe I change my opinion once I arrive there, but I remember disliking very much the character of Mary Duval.

[Ryan Mason]

I don't know that any of you will necessarily have an answer to this any more than I do, but this just popped back in my head recently.

The switch from Margaret Michaels to Gina Gallego as Santana, while not as jarring as Gordon Thomson replacing Terry Lester as Mason MID-EPISODE, was nonetheless rather odd.

Margaret Michaels' last episode ended with her demanding Mason tell Brandon the truth about his mother.

The very next episode, Gina Gallego, in the exact same outfit, ran disappointed from the Capwell mansion AND the episode itself 15 minutes in when Mason opted not to tell Brandon that Santana was his biological mother. There was no opening "The role of Santana Andrade is now being played by..." voiceover to announce the switch, and you didn't see Santana again for about a month. I remember when the episode first aired, my 13-year-old self was like "Wait...she LOOKS really different, but they didn't SAY she's being played by someone else...am I going nuts?" until I saw Gina Gallego's name in the closing crawl. (Again...I was all of 13! 

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)

So I've always wondered if there was some sort of similar scheduling mixup or crisis or what have you and they had to get Gina in there early to shoot what would have been Margaret's last episode. Because that long of a gap in appearances would have made sense if they wanted to give a break between the two Santanas like soaps often try to with recasts so they won't be as jarring, but as it was was rather odd.

Again...I don't know that any of you would have any more information on this, but it's just something I've always wondered!

[Efulton]

The 1970s Guiding Light version of the Dobsons would have been incredible at Another World.  The 1980s As the World Turns and Santa Barbara version of the Dobsons I am not sure about.

[Keri]

I wasn;t a huge fan of Mary either, she is very judgmental imo, and in general sometimes she rubbed me the wrong way. Nevertheless, I did root for her and Mason.

[antmunoz]

I remember MM one day, GG the next. But I don’t recall GG being off for a month after her first appearance. I recall her appearing a lot to cement the recast. 
 

I was a HUGE MM fan and I really wanted her to work on SB and later on DALLAS, where she should’ve permanently replaced Victoria Principal as Pam. 
 

GG’s weaker, more desperate, later addict Santana was not my favorite. Hated Wanda DeJesus also. 
 

However, firing the incredible Linda Gibbonney as Gina for “name” Robin Mattson (even though Robin was superb) was my least favorite recast. 

[chrisml]

Linda Gibboney quit because of the working conditions. She was not happy on the show. She gave an interview around the time she was in Generations talking about this. It's probably on some SB site somewhere. 

[Ryan Mason]

It was actually even more extreme, believe it or not. I had read that she debuted in episode 304, which aired October 3, 1985, and didn't appear again until episode 341, which as it turned out aired November 29th! And I just went back and double checked it myself and that is indeed accurate. But when I did I also saw that there was a LOT going on in that time period...Gina plotted and executed the plot to frame Eden for pulling the plug on CC, Brick and Amy got married, Dylan and Mark came to town, Angel held the clinic hostage...so it may have just been simply that Santana wasn't necessarily that involved in those things.

And I agree with you about Gina Gallego; she was probably my least favorite, but I'm not sure whether it was her or the writing. For most of her tenure I felt like Santana was an Argument Waiting To Happen and for months it seemed like her dialogue was just endless variations of "You don't LOVE me, Cruz; you love EDEN!" It got to the point where I'd see her and think "Oh great; what's she going to bitch and moan about NOW?" But then years later I enjoyed her on Crazy Ex-Girlfriend!

It also goes to show the difference recasts can make. When it was Ava Lazar and Linda Gibboney in the beginning, I was rooting for Santana. By the time it was Gina Gallego and Robin Mattson, while I didn't necessarily *condone* the whole allergy pill/crack switcheroo, I was pretty solidly Team Gina.

[Carlos Abad]

Episode 6:
-I’m enjoying these episodes very much but I can get why some viewers are struggling with the first months of Santa Barbara.

 -Messy edition sometimes. The whole episode seems to be taking place during the night but there’s a C.C. and Rosa scene about minute 18 in the Capwell set that it seems to be taking place during the day. There’s so much light and all the other scenes in the Capwell set of this episode are very dark.

 -The Capwell set is too empty compared to future episodes. They need more furniture and decorative elements to make it look real.

 -In this episode they are developing a love triangle between Danny, Jade and Warren, but that never happened. I guess that was the story they planned according to the first promotional photos of the show.

 -The ending scene of the last episode with Joe and Kelly reunion was strong, but the scenes of this episode in the yacht are a disappointing continuation with some poor acting and poor writing.

 

Episode 7:

-Very good episode, except for the silly stuff of Ted and Danny in Hollywood.

 -Love to see Lupe Ontiveros as the nurse in Acapulco in Santana’s scene. This actress has been in many things but I will always remember her as Juanita Solis on the first season of ‘Desperate Housewives”. The scenes between mama Solis and Eva Longoria were pure gold.

 -I think it’s funny C.C. likes so much Peter for Kelly and then he likes Kirk for Eden, two killers. Meanwhile he dislikes a lot Joe or Cruz for his daughter’s. I guess he’s not as smart as he thinks he is. But I really like Peter Mark Richman as C.C. Capwell.

 -Fake cliffhanger in the last episode because in episode 6 Kelly told Peter “Let’s get married right now. We can go to Las Vegas an get married’. But now she wakes up in the car and she says: “Peter, I don’t want to marry you this way”.

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 -I’m used to watch fake exteriors set in soap operas like beaches, caves, gardens, woods and many more. There are some that look more real and better than others and I do accept that. But the fake polo field green screen with C.C., Kelly and Peter is just too much. It looks so fake and cheap. It’s difficult to take those scenes seriously with those “special effects”.

This is also my opinion about Mary and the reason why I don’t like her very much, but Mark was an horrible person so of course I also root for Mary and Mason. But I don’t mind that they killed her and gave Mason a better coupe imo: Julia.

Also, if I remember well, I think Mason becomes a very likeable character thanks to Charles Bateman. In late 1984 or early 1985 C.C. treats Mason in a horrid way. He’s so violent, he even hits Mason a few times, C.C. is despicable with Mason during many episodes. And that is when Mason becomes one of my favorites and I really root for him. I guess Charles Bateman made me a fan of Mason Capwell.

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 [J1]

[Jdee43]

 

I'm watching those episodes now. Lane Davies and Charles Bateman are terrible together. They just don't seem like father and son. Their looks and acting styles are so different. Also, the way Bateman's CC is written with regards to Mason is too broad, with no nuance; it's always so cold and negative; or maybe that's just Bateman's performance.

I just finished watching episode 92 (12/5/84), with the departure of the original Santana, Ava Lazar. It comes out of no where; she just decides to leave town in the middle of the episode. There was no hint of her leaving in any of the episodes leading up to this, and I'm not sure it makes that much sense in regards to where the story is. She actually decided to give Mason a chance back in episode 89; they were together all of 2 episodes and then she hates him and is gone.

Next to Dane's Joe, it seemed like Ava's Santana was the main character of these 1984 episodes. While at times her acting could be weak, Ava Lazar was very beautiful, and she had charisma. With a story that suited her more, she could have really shined. I doubt the Dobsons would have been receptive to rewriting their story so that it would play more to Ava's strengths, though.

Probably another strike against Ava is that she really didn't have that much chemistry with most of her co-stars, especially the CCs. Having her hook up with CC, and there being three different CCs, really sunk her. I think her strongest chemistry was with Mason, but it seemed like the writers never wanted to really go there. It might have been fun to see the writers take Mason and Ava's Santana in a comedic direction, do a love-hate type of marriage, but it didn't seem like comedy, light or dark, was something they wanted to do with those two. 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Jdee43

[j swift]

I think Charles Bateman was a great CC in contrast to Lane Davis's Mason.  They both had a familial pomposity.  Their rivalry made me understand Mason's motives.  And, I still enjoy watching Bateman's reaction to Mason outing Channing.  It is a well written script that is well played.  Because, we assume that CC will be dismissive and cruel to Channing's lover, but he visibly buries his rage and transfers all of his anger onto Mason.  I think of all the CC's, only Bateman was best for that episode because he was so good saying a line, while showing his inner conflict.

That being said, I don't think that he was well suited for the romantic triangle with Lionel and Sophia.  Jed Allen was sexy, charming, funny, with a little menacing anger at the same time.  If Bateman was still in the role, the audience would never have accepted that Sophia preferred him over Nic Coster's suave Lionel. 

In terms of Santana, I tend to think it was less about the actress, and more about Robin Mattson as the re-cast of Gina.  Prior to the recast, Gina was a nervous wreck.  Much like Blanche in Streetcar, it was easy to believe that Gina married Stockman Demott because she had always relied on the kindness of strangers, which is what attracted her to CC.  But, once Gina is recast, she gains more agency, stops being a drug addict, and becomes a more reliable antagonist for Eden.  In contrast, Santana goes from being a glamorous seductress whom men want to possess to a drug addicted nervous wreck. 

After a while, Eden didn't need two antagonists, and Santana's story was much less interesting.  Coupled with a biased soap press who at first praised SB for having a multicultural cast, and then blamed the poor ratings on the audience's rejection of the multicultural cast, Santana never stood a chance.  

Furthermore, I would argue that once Brandon was SORASed a bit, and his relationship with Gina became popular because of how it humanized Gina, (and Keith), Santana was always going to be the odd-woman out when it came to her desire to raise Brandon.  I liked Gina as Brandon's mother, and every time Santana would return, she always felt like an interloper.  To be fair, Santana's argument that she was Brandon's biological mother didn't hold much weight, considering Gina had raised him since birth.

It's funny that you mention the polo field, which they return to later in the series, because I think the beach set is so much worse.  The sound of the waves and the lighting is all wrong for an outdoor scene.  The set is so small that all the action takes place within two square feet, but somehow they still play those scenes where two characters are talking, yet the third character doesn't hear what they are plotting.  And that whole hang gliding episode is confusing because everyone seems to be looking in a different direction.

 

[Liberty City]

Bateman, for me, was the C.C. for me. Wish he had been given more time.

The problem is with each Santana recast they lost the plot on the core of who Santana was, and it was just... ruined.

Thomson replacing Lester mid-episode was always an interesting choice (a-la what they did with Babe on All My Children), but I find it more interesting they filmed TWO edits of the cast.

[Ryan Mason]

Similarly, the driving scenes on Santa Barbara always looked super low-budget to me. There was such an obvious border outline between the actors in the car and the alleged moving "background"!

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