As The World Turns Discussion Thread

[DRW50]

That doesn't seem like very much story at all. A "mild breakdown" indeed! Some soap characters were in mental torment for years over less.

Perhaps they thought she was burdened by having a young son, but they could have just sent him away to school.

Was it in character for Jennifer to have had an illegitimate child? I wish they'd had Gillian Spencer return for some flashbacks at least.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I wish more was available of Gillian's time as Jennifer on ATWT. From what I've seen, she and Kathryn Hayes were so believable as sisters, and the chemistry was still there when years later Jennifer returned for an episode to guide a coma strickened Kim.

[DRW50]

ATWT would have been a very different show if Jennifer had stayed. She was a very popular character - she was supposed to die of a terminal illness but fan outcry made them keep the character longer, until I guess she wanted to leave or they wanted to write the character out.

I guess in the long run Kim benefited from Jennifer's absence but I really wish we had more time with the two of them together. I'd also like to see how Jennifer/Bob were as a couple.

In time I can see some complex roundelay where Kim married Dan, but still had feelings for Bob, Susan loved Dan but also started to fall for Bob, Bob had a troubled marriage to Jennifer, etc.

[DRW50]

I wonder why Natalie and Joyce never worked together (or did they?). They both had issues with Lisa, didn't they?

[P.J.]

Melinda's appearance puts Chuckie's death in 1978.

I would pay to see early Kim as Jennifer's "naughty" sister. PAY.

[DRW50]

I'd love to see any of Irna's material for Kim. It's one of those cases where I wonder how modern soap audiences would react, if people would say Bob was ruined because of "propping" Kim, et al. Kathryn Hays talked in that Paley thing about how so much of her own thoughts and feelings she didn't share seemed to be in the scripts; it must have been a true experience for her, for viewers, and I guess for Irna too.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Wasn't Irna fired because she wanted Bob to leave a pregnant Jennifer for an also pregnant Kim?

Apparently, the audience reacted negatively to this as they thought Kim should be punished for sleeping with her sister's husband, thus Kim had a stillbirth, or so they thought...

I know it's generally considered an uneven decade for the show, but I'm most intrigued by 70's ATWT. The show was clearly trying to merge its roots and keep up with the times during this era. It may not always have worked, but on paper at least, a lot of the stories seem compulsively watchable.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[DRW50]

I think part of it was also that she wanted Kim to raise the baby on her own and not be punished.

Some of the later stories of the decade start to sound confusing and like they were struggling with ideas, but I'd love to see any of it...I think I'd especially like to see Irna's return, just to know if it was what people have said, and also I'd love to see all the dramatics with Susan/Dan/Kim/John in their prime.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

The late 70's seemed to be a tumultuous time for the show. There was a constant succession of HW's between Robert Soderberg & Edith Sommer and the Dobson's, and of course the show had fallen from first in the ratings to 4th place in 1979. One of the soap books, I forgot which, said the Dobson's were specifically brought in for "emergency surgery" in late 1979. The revamped the hell out of the show and modernized it, but a lot of what is written at that time gave them credit for helping to stabilize the show. I don't know how much better they were than what came before, but clearly the show needed some change by '79.

I bet even the show's "lull periods" in the 70's is better than anything out there now...

Edited September 3, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[saynotoursoap]

Chuckie died in July 1977. Read the previous posts for details.

I never thought of Kim as "naughty". She was aloof, determined, and mysterious. The things she did, such as sleeping with Bob, happened on impulse. She did not commit her sins maliciously or to cause intentional harm to Jennifer. She was daytime's Greta Garbo, and quite enigmatic. It was an interesting era for ATWT. Truthfully, I prefer it over anything that came before or after.

[saynotoursoap]

Actually, Irna was fired because the show's weekly ratings fell as low as 7th place in the Nielsens. This was an era in which NBC posed a serious threat to CBS' dominance as the #1 daytime network. CBS axed Where the Heart Is, Love is a Many Splendored Thing, and the 20 year-old Secret Storm within a year. The network feared that Irna's erratic writing would also sink the series, which was the crux of its entire schedule.

The character of Kim was based on Irna herself, and what she wanted was for Kim to raise the child alone. Kim was a very different kind of character for ATWT, a woman who was completely independent, who did not require a man nor a family to make her happy. However, World Turns had always been a family show. Kim really went against the grain of what Irna had so carefully created, and it backfired, alienating many of the older audience members. In some regards, she was just too progressive for such a conservative soap, which is why the Soderbergs moved her in exactly the opposite direction of becoming a stereotypical soap heroine.

[Paul Raven]

Ralph Ellis/Eugenie Hunt replaced the Soderbergs in late 78. They brought back Barbara (good move).At first they continued most of the Soderbergs stories.They continued into 79 before marland took over for a short spell before the Dobsons in Jan 80.It was after the Dobsons 1st stint that that writer changes became more frequent.

[DRW50]

I also wish I could see:

The relationship between Ellen and her mother Claire - and scenes between Claire and Paul or Dan in those last years, to see how they tried to pass poor Barbara Berjer off as the grandmother of someone like Dean Santoro

Tom as the Vietnam vet hooked on drugs

The Amy Lin story and the recast Penny

Liz falling up the stairs

Oh, and Alma Miller.

Edited September 3, 2011 by CarlD2

[P.J.]

"Naughty" as in less than the pure, pillar-of-the-community, "kiddo" scion of Oakdale that she became.

[Max]

This was brought up in another thread, but I have long felt that I was among the very few who enjoyed the Doc Reese storyline. (I mostly enjoyed it because I never saw coming the plot twist of Jessica sleeping with Doc.) Did everyone else here hate it?

Edited September 5, 2011 by Max