No one's talking about 00. But I also object to the following reasoning: B&B went downhill when Y&R "rejects" came in. No. One has nothing to do with the other, writing cannot go downhill just because you add new cast. The fact that Bardley Bell wasn't able to write anything digestible for these people all the more exposes how terrible his writing became.

No, I never said B&B went downhill when Y&R rejects came in! I meant their addition does NOTHING in terms of story or really acting, so why bother adding them in the first place? And I wasn't talking about the year 2000. I was talking about the decade as a whole.

An actor to make sense of a cr*ppy story? Please! How does that happen? Has it ever happened? If it's cr*p on paper, it'll be cr*p on screen. There's only so much "elevation of material" an actor can do.

Tell that to performers like Scott Bryce(before he was replaced with Jon Lindstrom) and literally half the cast of GL who work(ed) their asses off to make what was on the page seem real. I'm obviously referring to the point before they decided to turn their production into an unrehearsed music video. No matter how badly their characters were ruined, at least they didn't sleepwalk through their scenes.

The scenes where Nick and Katie break up were rushed, yes, but it's Heather Tom's job to convey some sort of emotion, even if it's not on the page. I don't expect a weeping, blubbery mess of Katie, but at least something other than her shrugging her shoulders going, "Oh well, let's be friends and play basketball sometime." Where was the hurt?! The nostalgia for the way things were?! Maybe it wasn't scripted, but it's Tom's job to at least do something other than memorize her lines and shoot her scenes as though she would rather be at home than on a soundstage.

The scenes where Nick and Katie break up were rushed, yes, but it's Heather Tom's job to convey some sort of emotion, even if it's not on the page. I don't expect a weeping, blubbery mess of Katie, but at least something other than her shrugging her shoulders going, "Oh well, let's be friends and play basketball sometime." Where was the hurt?! The nostalgia for the way things were?! Maybe it wasn't scripted, but it's Tom's job to at least do something other than memorize her lines and shoot her scenes as though she would rather be at home than on a soundstage.

It seems Tom's been getting acting lessons from Morrow.

No offense to any Y&R fans, but I don't want any more of those rejects(behind or in front of the scenes)stinking up Los Angeles. The ones we have on the show now do nothing in terms of story and they are ALL phoning it in. I know the stories suck pretty bad, but damn, when did Heather Tom start sleepwalking through her scenes?

I totally agree with you. I don't really blame the actors...I think they are doing what they can to bring life to these constant plot switches and personality changes. But, per se, what the Y&R actors do is keep me tuning in (because I love many of them)...but I don't actually feel they enrich the show.

I did like Heather and Don's banter stuff, when she was drunk...I think there might be something there...but you are right.

Of course, Melody could be different .

No it wasn't. It wasn't always like that. There are plenty of stories/events that were good in the 00's that didn't require Y&R's talent. i.e. Ridget, Macy coming back from the dead in Portifino, Stephanie's faked heart attack, Thorne leaving Forrester to join Spectra, Shane's Death, even Darla getting hit by a car on PCH(even though that is ridiculously unbelievable that Taylor, of all people, would be the one to hit her when there are so many nutsos driving the streets that would have plowed into her AND Phoebe first), Storm's Suicide. And there are other bright spots/stories too.

There have been times when I watched B&B IN PREFERENCE to Y&R. Now, I didn't love all the stories you listed above. For me, 90s B&B is the high point, and I'm trying hard not move past nostalgically wishing for a return to that.

Who would replace her?

Or would she die in Mexico trying to save Victor from himself?

Honestly. She'd go tend to Casey's breast cancer recurrence. And never be seen again. You know I'm right.

The scenes where Nick and Katie break up were rushed, yes, but it's Heather Tom's job to convey some sort of emotion, even if it's not on the page. I don't expect a weeping, blubbery mess of Katie, but at least something other than her shrugging her shoulders going, "Oh well, let's be friends and play basketball sometime." Where was the hurt?! The nostalgia for the way things were?! Maybe it wasn't scripted, but it's Tom's job to at least do something other than memorize her lines and shoot her scenes as though she would rather be at home than on a soundstage.

You're right. I think Heather was trying to avoid any nostalgia for Nick-Katie (which was a damaging pairing for her character and for Wagner). I think, based on her interviews, she's REALLY trying to imbue some "fun" into Katie...hence, I think she turned it up when she started playing opposite Diamont.

But to see Melody-as-Beth playing momma to KKL, Heather-as-Katie and Gareis-as-Donna. To MTS crying over the memory of Thorne. To see MTS doing battle when Flannery's Stephanie tries to make her feel like a low-born whore. I can't lie. I want it.

I have never been the biggest Nikki fan, but I hope that MTS takes her pay cut and stays with the show. Yesterday's episode showed that Nikki still has a place on Y&R. She brought some life to TGVN and the funny to Ashley's statue chat. She even got to put MJ on the defensive.

But to see Melody-as-Beth playing momma to KKL, Heather-as-Katie and Gareis-as-Donna. To MTS crying over the memory of Thorne. To see MTS doing battle when Flannery's Stephanie tries to make her feel like a low-born whore. I can't lie. I want it.

You are totally trying to make Thorne's suicide happen! LOL. I love it.

And for something as fun as that to happen, A ) Melody would have to be willing to play mama bear to a woman less than ten years older than her, B ) Realize she's not the star of the show, and C ) Brad would have to be 100% committed to it. And when has Brad been 100% committed to any story on B&B in the past two-three years? Seriously?

Edited June 5, 200916 yr by bellcurve

You are totally trying to make Thorne's suicide happen! LOL. I love it.

And for something as fun as that to happen, A ) Melody would have to be willing to play mama bear to a woman less than ten years older than her, B ) Realize she's not the star of the show, and C ) Brad would have to be 100% committed to it. And when has Brad been 100% committed to any story on B&B in the past two-three years? Seriously?

OMG. You're right. It's Freudian, but it keeps happening. I cannot lie...I wouldn't miss Thorne one bit at this point.

I thought about what you wrote A ) B ) C ) too...each comment is spot-on. But I think it could work. Isn't the current recurrent Beth only about a decade older than KKL too? And let's not forget Leslie Anne Down and Jack Wagner....

Give MTS whatever she wants and your little dog, too.

Give MTS whatever she wants and your little dog, too.

No, not my dog.

If MTS is being completely unreasonable, then that is of course ridiculous.

But I do feel a 30-year vet needs to be handled differently. "We love you. We want to pay you the moon. But here are the financial details. How can we work together to make this win win?"

If this show had stronger writing and better options, I could deal with Nikki being written out. However, as it stands, the entire Newman family is horrible and not entertaining in the least bit. Amelia is an utter disaster as Victoria, Nicholas is one of the most sloppily written and acted characters on the show, and Victor is a little too one-note. Nikki even though her life could be a mess, was always a calm center for all of those characters, and she isn't anymore - her onscreen children are either bad actors or they're not being written for effectively. Then we have the horrible way in which women on this show was being written. Most of them are desperate and pathetic and see a man as the be all and end all of their existence. I can't name a single strong female character on this show at the moment, other than Katherine. It's really gross. Had the writing for the Newman family and the rest of the show been on a creative high and fitting on all cylinders, Nikki's exit might not be as big of a loss, but it sure as hell is now.

Here's my question, if they have a budget problem, and MAB is aware of this, why does she have 15 f-cking writers on her writing team, including TWO Co-HW's? That right there drains the show of a substantial amount of money, and no way in hell does she need all of those writers, especially TWO Co-HW's. That's non-sense, and her poor management skills are partly what is wasting this show's budget.

Here's my question, if they have a budget problem, and MAB is aware of this, why does she have 15 f-cking writers on her writing team, including TWO Co-HW's? That right there drains the show of a substantial amount of money, and no way in hell does she need all of those writers, especially TWO Co-HW's. That's non-sense, and her poor management skills are partly what is wasting this show's budget.

If you look at DAYS, the budget cuts didn't affect DAYS' writing staff. When Tomlin took over, he brought over more expensive/veteran writers, and the cheaper/less experience writers were fired, and he brought the breakdown position back.

DAYS doesn't have three HW's, and twelve staff writers though. LOL!

So many on that writing team can go, and I'm sure it would free up a lot of money. Why the hell is Scott Hamner still there? I'm sure he's not that cheap either, given that he has adequate primetime experience too. There's also WAY TOO MANY Breakdown Writers on staff. Why does she need SIX Breakdown Writers? They can afford to lose one or two Script Writers as well. There's no excuse for such stupid management. She's had over a year and half to understand what she likes and dislikes in writers, and yet her writing staff is still bloated, and way beyond a necessary amount. I also think its ridiculous that she has to have two Co-HW's, especially in this economic climate.

I also notice a lot of people in production have been fired, yet that writing staff doesn't seem to be lowered at all.

Edited June 6, 200916 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

DAYS doesn't have three HW's, and twelve staff writers though. LOL!

So many on that writing team can go, and I'm sure it would free up a lot of money. Why the hell is Scott Hamner still there? I'm sure he's not that cheap either, given that he has adequate primetime experience too. There's also WAY TOO MANY Breakdown Writers on staff. Why does she need SIX Breakdown Writers? They can afford to lose one or two Script Writers as well. There's no excuse for such stupid management. She's had over a year and half to understand what she likes and dislikes in writers, and yet her writing staff is still bloated, and way beyond a necessary amount. I also think its ridiculous that she has to have two Co-HW's, especially in this economic climate.

I also notice a lot of people in production have been fired, yet that writing staff doesn't seem to be lowered at all.

Oh, I don't disagree with you. I was just showing an example of the cost of a writing team going up while the budget was being slashed. Maybe the budget/cost of the writing team doesn't affect the budget of the cast?

DAYS doesn't have three HW's, and twelve staff writers though. LOL!

The thing is: the less competent you are, the more people you need to cover your shortcomings. And that's what's going on in here... Maria is to insecure, probably, and hires and fires these people depending on weather.

Edited June 6, 200916 yr by Sylph

There's also WAY TOO MANY Breakdown Writers on staff. Why does she need SIX Breakdown Writers? They can afford to lose one or two Script Writers as well.

If they're getting paid per breakdown or script, it doesn't matter if there's one writer or a hundred.

If they're getting paid per breakdown or script, it doesn't matter if there's one writer or a hundred.

Good point. Also, shouldn't this kind of talk go to the writers & directors thread? This is a thread ostensibly about MTS.