My main problem with Natalie is that she is one of the most self-centered characters ever, but it's always blind devotion to a man that causes her selfishness. I mean, can't she see what her sister is going through, yet she tries to prattle on and on about being in love.

Isn't it obvious, though? Her constant cries of "but I love him" are way more for herself than for anyone else to hear. She's trying to convince herself why what she's done was justified and why she shouldn't be entirely self-loathing at this point. She knows that she can't get the forgiveness of her rightly pissed off family until she is able to understand why she did what she did...and she's going to take the easy route and say that it was because she loved Jared. Whether that was her reason or not, it's the one that makes sense to her now. It's going to be a while before she finds the real reason (hopefully RC goes there), which, is just what you said. It's not necessarily that she's selfish purposely...she's unconsciously selfish. She doesn't realize that she's putting herself above everything and everyone, and it's coming at an enormously high cost.

Isn't it obvious, though? Her constant cries of "but I love him" are way more for herself than for anyone else to hear. She's trying to convince herself why what she's done was justified and why she shouldn't be entirely self-loathing at this point. She knows that she can't get the forgiveness of her rightly pissed off family until she is able to understand why she did what she did...and she's going to take the easy route and say that it was because she loved Jared. Whether that was her reason or not, it's the one that makes sense to her now. It's going to be a while before she finds the real reason (hopefully RC goes there), which, is just what you said. It's not necessarily that she's selfish purposely...she's unconsciously selfish. She doesn't realize that she's putting herself above everything and everyone, and it's coming at an enormously high cost.

In her mind, she didnt even do any of this for herself. She hated Jared when she found out and was disgusted by him. She gave him a hard time and wanted little to do with him. She let him continue this lie bc she didnt want to hurt her family bc they she saw that they grew to love and accept him. And most recently, she didnt want to devastate Rex and Viki once she found out the whole truth. If it was all about herself and her "love", it would have been easier to tell the truth like he wanted to do at the time and be lovers openly bc keeping this secret did absolutely nothing for her

it would have been easier to tell the truth like he wanted to do at the time and be lovers openly bc keeping this secret did absolutely nothing for her

Ain't that the truth.

In the end, this whole ordeal should end up as a way to showcase Jessica's ability to move on (personally, I'd rather not see Tess's bitch-ass popping up again) as a single mother's who has lost her husband in the matter of hours. At the core, though, should be a journey that Natalie and Jared take to get to the center of their issues. If Jared did all of this simply because he admired Asa, he has to really ask himself, was it worth it? Was it really effing worth the heartache he's caused not only the family but also himself? And Charlie, and Viki, and Bree. That kid needs to take a long look at himself, seriously. Natalie could use a mirror too. She needs some time away from Llanview because as much as everyone probably wants to get in line to wave a finger at her, they'd all hate themselves to high heavens if they constantly kick her while she's down and they end up finding her dead with an empty bottle of pills next to her bed. She needs to go and accept responsibility for keeping the truth about Jared hidden so that when she returns and faces the Buchanan firing squad, it doesn't break her.

Edited June 7, 200817 yr by All My Shadows

Isn't it obvious, though? Her constant cries of "but I love him" are way more for herself than for anyone else to hear. She's trying to convince herself why what she's done was justified and why she shouldn't be entirely self-loathing at this point. She knows that she can't get the forgiveness of her rightly pissed off family until she is able to understand why she did what she did...and she's going to take the easy route and say that it was because she loved Jared. Whether that was her reason or not, it's the one that makes sense to her now. It's going to be a while before she finds the real reason (hopefully RC goes there), which, is just what you said. It's not necessarily that she's selfish purposely...she's unconsciously selfish. She doesn't realize that she's putting herself above everything and everyone, and it's coming at an enormously high cost.

What a great post! You really give a good insight into Natalie here.

And I have to say, in spite of my anger with the character, I have felt for her this week. Somebody said that MA really stepped up during the slap, that you could see the guild and terror on her face, and I do think that's true. I also thought she was effective in the chapel, and as I've said three times now LOL, when she begged Viki not to let Jess make her hate her.

I agree with Cheap21 that Jared didn't mean for Nash to fall through a skylight and die.

However, I think the entire family has every right to be angry with Jared and Natalie. There is no excuse for what they did as far as Jared PRETENDING to be a Buchanan and Natalie going right along with him. They are despicable. And I think Jessica has every right to be livid.

I didn't mind her going off on Natalie, because I think she was directing her rage at everything, from the duplicity regarding Jared's impersonation to the fallout with Nash's death.

Nash dying was an accident, but certainly it was precipitated by the selfish, horrible actions of Dorian, Jared, Natalie, etc. None of them would have been in this situation if Dorian hadn't exposed B.E., which in turn wouldn't have happened if Jared had been honest.

My main problem with Natalie is that she is one of the most self-centered characters ever, but it's always blind devotion to a man that causes her selfishness. I mean, can't she see what her sister is going through, yet she tries to prattle on and on about being in love. I've never been so happy as when Jessica laid that EXCELLENT slap across her whiny, pouty face.

ITA

I like natalie, always have and prob always will. But her selfish actions have hurt her family and she \desevres whatever she egts. ZShe didnt do this not to hurt rex or charlie, she used that as the justification for what she was doing. sure she was pissed when she first found out, but that doesnt mean anything because she then went along with the lie.

Jessica, all of th family, Rex - they all have right to be pissed at her and let her know it.

Her constant cries of "but I love him" are way more for herself than for anyone else to hear.

I actually think Natalie has shown admirable self restraint and unselfishness by not trying to explain her actions at all up to this point. For the most part she's withstood her family's disgust and accusations without making any excuses. The only times I recall her telling anyone that she loved Jared were in the shareholder's meeting when it first came out before Nash went through the skylight, and when Clint told Viki that Dorian had revealed that Jared and Natalie were sleeping together. I'd hardly call that constant, and neither time was she using it to explain the lie, she was telling everyone that she loved Jared and that this wasn't some seedy little affair. Because Natalie's one of the few characters in Llanview for whom those words have real meaning, unlike Jessica (Antonio and Jaime?).

It would be very tempting to desperately want to sit everyone down and explain and try to make them understand, her reasoning for her actions. Explain that what they see as an affair with Jared wasn't what motivated her to keep the secret. Explain that she never intended to hurt them but wanted to tell the truth in the way that would minimize damage to BE and to everyone involved including Viki and Rex. She started to explain to her mother in the hospital "We were going to tell . . ." but she brought herself up short because she realized that the most important thing the family had to deal with right now was Jessica and her grief. Now is not the time to worry about how they feel about her (Natalie). Natalie unselfishly realizes that and just accepts their rejection and hatred for her because that's all she can do for Jessica right now. But that's my girl. The tough one who takes it on the chin for those she loves. Not the least a princess.

Furthermore, it's important to acknowledge that by the time Natalie knew the truth, the Cobb and Webster deals had already been done. Dorian already had the ammunition she needed to take over BE. Jared and Natalie were certainly a large part of her arsenal, but Dorian's the one who picked up the weapon and pulled the trigger. Natalie telling the truth at her earliest opportunity would not have restored the shares Dorian had already won.

Furthermore, it's important to acknowledge that by the time Natalie knew the truth, the Cobb and Webster deals had already been done. Dorian already had the ammunition she needed to take over BE. Jared and Natalie were certainly a large part of her arsenal, but Dorian's the one who picked up the weapon and pulled the trigger. Natalie telling the truth at her earliest opportunity would not have restored the shares Dorian had already won.

THAT'S A GREAT POINT, and one I had not thought of before. But you're right - even if Natalie had come forward at the time, Dorian's plan just would have been moved up (and certainly wouldn't have had the same "oomph" it did at the annual shareholders' meeting). It doesn't change the fact that "mistakes were made", as it were. But it does take some of the onus off of Nat.

Thanks for bringing that up, Rhinohide!

I think Viki is angry with Natalie, not that it means she will turn her back on her though.

As for Jess

we know that Susannah Hanen, Nora's sister and Viki's one time therapist, is coming back to Llanview, either to deal with Tess or some deep-seated resentments Jess's Tess side may harbour toward Natalie.

Where did you hear that spoiler from? I had heard a rumor about it, but I didn't know it was actually going to happen. I wonder if it will be the original actress portraying her?

So many great points for BOTH sides. The true sign of great storytelling

This OLTL thread currently has 13,808 views compared to ATWT's 2773 and AMC's total of 2464. OLTL is definetly THE soap of the moment

Edited June 7, 200817 yr by Cheap21

Where did you hear that spoiler from? I had heard a rumor about it, but I didn't know it was actually going to happen. I wonder if it will be the original actress portraying her?

I thought that was just a rumor too, but we do know there is a showfax script out there with fake names,

but it's widely speculated that it's with Tess and a mechanic who has shown up at Llanfair to tell Natalie that someone has tampered with the brakes on her car and that's what has caused a car accident with Viki.

Thanks for bringing that up, Rhinohide

YW brimike

So many great points for BOTH sides. The true sign of great storytelling

So true Cheap 21. Remember the day when there were so few rootable characters on the show? I love the dynamic that I believe is being set up between Jessica and Natalie. It's great that people are coming down on one side or the other. Even though I love Natalie, and loathe Jessica, I appreciate the fans of Jessica and get where they're coming from. But it's more exciting when we all have different perspectives. And it obviously generates a lot of discussion.

Cheap21, how excited are you for Tina's return?

You guys, I am so excited about next week, and I don't know if it's appropriate to post about Tina in here. I know there is a spoiler thread, but I just can't read it!

I AM SO LOOKING FORWARD TO ANDREA EVANS. She is why I started watching this show as a little fifth grade gay!!

I really don't care about any of the returns, and at first I was worried that the stories I have been enjoying so much would move to the back burner to make room for them, but now I am almost relieved. After this week I am not sure how much more my heart can take. I welcome a break.

Edited June 7, 200817 yr by rhinohide

Cheap21, how excited are you for Tina's return?

You guys, I am so excited about next week, and I don't know if it's appropriate to post about Tina in here. I know there is a spoiler thread, but I just can't read it!

I AM SO LOOKING FORWARD TO ANDREA EVANS. She is why I started watching this show as a little fifth grade gay!!

Cheap21, how excited are you for Tina's return?

You guys, I am so excited about next week, and I don't know if it's appropriate to post about Tina in here. I know there is a spoiler thread, but I just can't read it!

I AM SO LOOKING FORWARD TO ANDREA EVANS. She is why I started watching this show as a little fifth grade gay!!

I cant begin to tell you how excited I am. Tina Lord is my FAVORITE soap character ever. She puts all else to shame. This is the bitch that got me into watching soaps and I was hooked to OLTL whenever she was on the screen. OLTL was my first soap and it was my favorite through the end of the 80s up until the mid 90s when Tina left. Her departure left a huge hole and it hasnt felt the same. I cant beleive its taken this long to get her back in town. Im so glad its with a competent writer as Im sure Ron C will do her justice. This is the moment Ive waited over 10 years for. Tina Lord is FINALLY coming home and you couldnt find a more happier fan

Check out this clip. Maria tries to kill Tina and ends up dying with her own poison

Edited June 7, 200817 yr by Cheap21

Bree Williamson owns this scene. And I could watch that slap forever!

I never saw AE's Tina. When I started watching Karen Witter was still in the role. Then that chick that used to play Mindy on GL came(couldn't stand her Tina).