ALL: Writing for Daytime Television

[Faulkner]

Hmmm...well, during the conversation about breakdowns and writing scripts, Claire told a story about a three-way phone conference she had with Paul Avila Mayer and Mary Ryan Munisteri, who was a scriptwriter on RH. Claire and Paul had just sent Mary an outline for an episode for which she was supposed to write a script. Mary apparently wasn't pleased with the outline and called Claire and Paul to voice her concern. Claire and Paul pick up the phone and say "Hello."

Mary groans, "It's not my job to make a silk purse out of sow's ear."

A beat.

Paul responds, "Yes it is."

Another beat.

Mary responds, "Oh? OK." She hangs up.

It was totally cool because the three of them all knew each other and were like family.

Well, Claire told it better than I could write it. She was great with her anecdotes.

Claire also said she got addicted to Love of Life while she was nursing her babies. Her first-born was a BIG child so she couldn't do anything else with her hands but hold the baby and nurse him. While she did that, she'd watch Love of Life. It was a daily 12 o'clock ritual, and she found herself addicted to the goings-on in Rosehill. After a while, that child got too old for nursing, but soon enough, she gave birth to yet another oversized baby, and her afternoon dates with Love of Life resumed. She said she loved the show dearly and was delighted to write for it.

[aMLCproduction]

Thank you Faulkner and others who went. It sounds amazzing and If i was in NY I would have went too.

[All My Shadows]

LOL That's great.

[aMLCproduction]

I too think soaps need to bring back cliffhangers. Just that little moment where you cannot wait for more.(Not stupid colorful freeze frames)

Y&R is pretty good in the cliffhanger regard. Be it small or big, something happens in EVERY Y&R episode. The plot keeps moving, never stalling. It's been proved, cliffhangers along with good story telling works for soaps.

It's also a shame that so many people have their hand's in the head writer's soup. Thats probably why the shows have declined. Get a clue Networks.

Claire said it best, soaps were destroyed when they went to hours. Some shows, Days, Passns, have scenes which they call filler. Doesn't do anything for plot or characters, dragging the show down. Not only that, it's harder to juggle 25 to 35 characters every day instead of like 15 to 20 on a half hour show.

Writers and production staff would be less stressed and their for quality would improve QUOTEClaire also said that audiences don't watch a show for cliffhangers and what-not, but because they wish they could live in the same town as these characters. There's an emotional truth that each soap has to convey to its audience, and that is what will keep them coming back day-to-day.

I agree with this, but I think cliffhangers are important too. I want to feel the emotional truth throughout an episode, but I also want a memorable last scene that will leave me gasping for more. A cliffhanger doesn't have to be a hanging plot point, but the end of an episode should still have some oomph to it.

QUOTEShe also says that soaps were better when they were only a half-hour.That may be. My favorite soap is 30-minute soap EastEnders

[bellcurve]

What Y&R are you watching?! LOL.

[Sylph]

Thank you, Faulkner! Did Claire mention something about returning? Is she looking OK?

I disagree with her about projections - I believe the length should be varied, it all depends on a story. You don't want to make daytime dramas telenovelas, instead of 13 weeks we would have six months. That's boring, the pacing needs to be changed all the time. Look at Bill Bell, he knew how to write two year long stories and six months stories.

I agree with her about emotional truth, but disagree about cliffhangers. I'm mean, yes, they don't watch it because of cliffhangers, but they need to be there in orther to keep them coming back. There are other ways, too, in which the returns can be assured.

I keep saying that. And I keep mentioning the Douglas Marland ATWT team.

Faulkner, did you notice someone with a camera or a .mp3 recorder or something similar? Did Tom Fontana mention something about his relationship with soaps?

[bellcurve]

I think it, truthfully, all depends on what TYPE of show it is.

I thought PORT CHARLES did a fantastic job under Karen Harris with smaller story projections. People likened the stories to telenovelas(this word was tossed around before the arcs) or primetime shows, but I just simply viewed it as things always happening on the show.

Not to say that on a show like Y&R that things weren't happening with slower story projections, but it just all depends on what kind of soap viewer you are.

Forgive me for using meals as an example, but it all depends on what kind of meal you want. With a show like PC(under Karen Harris), you were in for a chain restaraunt, like an Applebee's or Chili's, where the food is good, the service is great, and it's the kind of atmosphere where you can wear your t-shirt, jeans, and flip-flops and feel comfortable. Y&R is more like a five-star, multi-course meal where the atmosphere is more intimate, you put on your best suit or your best outfit, you're drinking glasses of red wine while every course comes to the table and when you're done, you're full and satisfied. And to those that heard about the meal or saw the pictures or sampled what was left, didn't get to fully enjoy the experience you had because you were there from beginning to end.

Nothing, IMO, is wrong with either one for someone who is satisfied with Applebee's AND the five-star restaraunt. But some don't like the five-star and you've got some that can't stand to eat anything but.

And of course, there's shows like SUNSET BEACH and B&B, which is like eating at McDonalds when you're drunk. Sometimes, it's just what you need at that moment, other times, the food's cold, and in some cases, you puke at the smell of it.

And I dunno what to call PASSIONS. Hamburger Helper?! Takes forever to cook at home and still isn't what you really want, but you feel like you have to eat it because you spent so much time making it.

But I digress. Anyway, my point is that some story projections work better for some soaps than others. For shows like B&B and PC, these kind of projections work because they appeal to a certain audience.

As much as I love the Y&R of old, I think I'd tie the noose around me if every show was exactly like it. And I think that is what is frustrating many viewers of daytime. Nothing stands out among the pack. Not even Y&R.

[Faulkner]

I don't think Claire was discounting the importance of cliffhangers, she was simply saying that they aren't the most important reason why people are tuning in day-to-day. You can have cliffhangers out the wazoo, but they won't mean a thing if people aren't invested in the world the writer has created.

I think she has a point about story projections as well. Writers certainly should have a vision, but they should be flexible enough to see what's up on screen and adjust to it. Bill Bell was the king of dropping things that simply weren't working on screen. Why put viewers - and yourself - through the agony of it if you know you can change it?

Claire looked good...I never realized she was so tall. She said she would love to come back to daytime, but no one's asked her. She said she has a few projects in the works but wouldn't go into detail.

[aMLCproduction]

LOL I was waiting until someone called me out on it. I know I am in the minority but I love Y&R and to me the plot moves everyday. It flows so well. The only thing I dont like about LMLis the casting choices. LML could slow down just a tad. LML is not perfect but she keeps me tuning in.

"I don't think Claire was discounting the importance of cliffhangers, she was simply saying that they aren't the most important reason why people are tuning in day-to-day. You can have cliffhangers out the wazoo, but they won't mean a thing if people aren't invested in the world the writer has created. "

Very true indeed Faulkner. That's the trick for the writers. You have to have investment for cliffhangers to pay off. Emotions etc.

"I think she has a point about story projections as well. Writers certainly should have a vision, but they should be flexible enough to see what's up on screen and adjust to it. Bill Bell was the king of dropping things that simply weren't working on screen. Why put viewers - and yourself - through the agony of it if you know you can change it? "

Yes Bill was. In fact in interviews he stated taht he don't even use long term story projections, he made it up as he went a long. In writing, at least in mine, stories can take you on many different rides. You see things or get ideas you didnt have before without projections. I mean I keep a genreral path of which and where the characters and stories will go but I don't use concrete long term story projections. It works for me.. Antoher trick is that writers have to watch their work. I for one don't think JER does this.

I hope Claire would come write for Y&R I think she would be a good fit there

"Forgive me for using meals as an example, but it all depends on what kind of meal you want. With a show like PC(under Karen Harris), you were in for a chain restaraunt, like an Applebee's or Chili's, where the food is good, the service is great, and it's the kind of atmosphere where you can wear your t-shirt, jeans, and flip-flops and feel comfortable. Y&R is more like a five-star, multi-course meal where the atmosphere is more intimate, you put on your best suit or your best outfit, you're drinking glasses of red wine while every course comes to the table and when you're done, you're full and satisfied. And to those that heard about the meal or saw the pictures or sampled what was left, didn't get to fully enjoy the experience you had because you were there from beginning to end."

I am glad you did use food as an example. It made sense and you have made some good analogies regarding Y&R and PC

[SpiritualJunkie]

Very interesting...thanks for the review!

I also think that writers should be flexible enough to change what's not working. I have seen too many stories where it seems like the writing is continuing to force something that clearly isn't there.

That's an interesting note about the disadvantage of large writing teams. One day you'll see a really well-written show, the next could just contain the worst dialogue. Clearly, there is a disjointed vision or the writers just don't have equal writing skills.

Totally agree with Judy Tate about lack of South Asian characters. I don't recall ever seeing a main character who was South Asian, either.

[Toups]

Thanks for the recap, Faulker!

I wish there was a podcast of the panel. Damn the Writers Guild for not having one.

[Sylph]

Yes, it does depend on the show. But don't you think it would be boring somewhat if you knew that every time after,say, six months the story will end? You have to mix everything, several concurrent storylines that have different duration, but you also have to be very careful in writing that.

I love your meals example!! :LMAO: One of the reasons I watch many soaps is that I want difference, I like the five star restaurant, sometimes I like to grab something over at Applebee's or Chili's, but that's not what I'm getting for several years now...

Yes, I would feel nauseous all the time if I had to watch Y&R doppelgängers. It's a very idiosyncratic show. Not everyone can watch it.

[Sylph]

Yes, I thought so, but I was somehow distracted... And she's completely right - no empty cliffhangers.

Yes, I agree on flexibility, but I still think that story projections should be written. And meticulously, something Douglas Marland used to do.

I'm glad! I hope she comes back to daytime soon!

[TC]

Thank you Faulkner.

I'd like to hear all of this OLTL stuff that was so unmemorable to you.

YOUR take on it will be so much more palatable than that of some OLTL fangurl.

[WorldTurner]

Thank you Faulkner! It's really appreciated to hear what was discussed!